Bruce Lee vs. Ali (1 Viewer)

[Andy Sheets]

however, i think i heard it from this amc documentary:

http://www.amctv.com/show/detail/0,,50039-1-EST,00.html

if you haven't seen it - it's definitely worthwhile. it even includes the original ending to "game of death".

Yup, that's an excellent documentary, and I loved the Game of Death footage at the end. I should get the dvd sometime...

 

[Tim L]

didn't rocky marciano beat ali in a computer fight or someting- except rocky was quite a bit older then ali at the time- but from what I read somewhere he was still all set to go at it-
TimL

 

[Citizen87645]

The martial art Lee developed and practiced was Jeet Kune Do, which is roughly translated "The Way of the Intercepting Fist." It is more of a philosophy of fighting than an actual form, emphasizing adaptability and fluidity. If you've seen Jet Li's "Fist of Legend," which is a remake of Bruce Lee's "Fist of Fury" (or "Chinese Connection" depending on the continent you're on), this is a major thematic component. So if Lee were thrown into a boxing ring with boxing rules in theory he would adapt to the situation and maybe win!

 

[CaseyLS]

Who would win?
Uh, Mike Ditka.

 

[Mike Wladyka]

Van Damme said something like "a kickboxer has weapons a boxer lacks. If I got in close, I could break his legs." of course, he didn't say how things would go if they had to fight under boxing rules

this just shows how bad of a martial artist van damme is. anyway i think bruce lee would have a definite advantage providing a no rules type of contest. BTW, bruce lee had a ton of power...did you know he used to workout on a daily basis with 300lb punching bags...plus i never saw ali as having huge amounts of power anyway (relatively speaking and comparing to other heavy hitters), his knowledge made him great as did bruce's knowledge made him great. The best fighters in any rules format are always the ones with the greatest knowledge.

 

[Paul_Sjordal]

Miss Piggy woulda kicked all their butts! Hiiiiii-ya!

 

[Bill Griffith]

If it was purely a stand up fight Ali would win, if it were a Open Martial Arts match, Ali would win.

You mention things like UFC and Pride. Yes a fight like a Gracie or Sakuraba, or other ground specialist (whatever art they may practice) would have the upper hand and more often than not win against a pure boxer.

As far as I know Bruce had none of these techniques under his belt. There never was any mention of submission holds he could do or if he was trained in that area.

As for power, sure lb for lb bruce was more powerful than Ali, but physics would still win out and Ali would win that battle. So he works out on a 300 lbs bag, Ali would be able to make a 300 lbs bag moe more than Bruce could.

Ali was also fast, in his earlier days, bruce is fast as well though. Lets say Ali blocks series of bruces pucnhes and kicks, he's not that effected. Lets say Bruce decides to be silly and try to block a flurry from Ali. There is no blocking taking place here. It would basically be Ali saying "quit hitting yourself, quit hitting yourself"

 

[JonZ]

Matching in their primes - Noone and I mean noone would be able to beat Bruce.

The guy had remarkable strength for his size. More important he knew how to hit and was truly a dangerous person capable of causing serious damage.

I consider Ali to be the greatest boxer ever. Ali was amazing. Watch the old fights he had in the late 60s. His accuracy and aim was beyond amazing.

But there no way he could have take Bruce.Bruce would have a serious edge with his footwork. He was big on short kicks to the knees and feet to stop opponents from advancing.It was very difficult to even get near him.

My brother does this while sparring and its awesome at stopping someone dead in their tracks while trying to close in on you.You can see examples of this type of defense in Return Of The Dragon when hes fighting Bob Wall.

Ive read articles about Bruce dislocating people shoulders, while training with a airshield,and even kicking a door off the hindges.

BTW, Bruce got in real fights constantly. Anyone who says he was just a actor is talking out of his ass and shouldnt say things without knowing what hes talking about.

Bruce Lee was a master at hand to hand combat.

 

[StephenA]

I'd say Bruce Lee. Both were very powerful and skilled at what they did though, and would be a close match. Bruce Lee took many styles of fighting, including boxing, and incorporated them into Jeet Kune Do. He also had the one inch punch. I'm no expert, so take my opinion with a grain of salt.

 

[Shayne Lebrun]

In a boxing match? Ali would win. In an honest to goodness fight? Hard to say. Bruce really did surrender a lot of size, and Ali, as people have pointed out, had some skills that he couldn't directly use as a boxer.

 

[Ted Lee]

It would basically be Ali saying "quit hitting yourself, quit hitting yourself"

boxing and kung-fu are likes apples and organges. they're just not the same.

i would argue that quickness would win out. although ali has good footwork, how was his upper-body? did he have like really quick jabs and stuff? personally, i don't know. i think a good solid punch from ali and bruce's face may potentially cave in.

but i *do* know that lee was quick. given that fact, i would think lee could get "inside" ali pretty quickly. a couple of disabling kicks and ali would be in serious trouble.

how does that line from "they call me bruce" go? something about "with this hand i can take your eye out, with this hand i can slap you upside your head ... look at my face. i am oriental!"

 

[Mike Wladyka]

if it were a Open Martial Arts match, Ali would win.

i highly doubt that

 

[JonZ]

"With this hand, I break ur nose"

 

[Citizen87645]

We're all speaking in hypotheticals of course, sticking to what we know. I know a little more about Lee than Ali, so there's an inherent bias.

Anyways, I think the key is ultimately who can adapt to the opponent better and more quickly. Ali would have to compensate for a smaller, quicker target, incorporate any martial arts he knew along with his boxing mastery. Assuming he just got thrown in the ring (assuming it's a ring) without time to train for these differences, I'd say that's a significant shift in practice. Lee would then have the advantage because adaptability and crosstraining are fundamental components of Jeet Kune Do philosophy. He would have been constantly training his mind and body to NOT stick to any particular strategy or discipline. Lee would also be accustomed to compensating for size, whereas Ali would be used to having opponents of equivalent size and weight.

Ultimately both men are human and can screw up. If either men left themselves open to a hit there's no doubt there would be damage inflicted. As most know, however, power is not always the deciding factor.

 

[Geno]

BRUCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

 

[Bill Griffith]

uh...what do you think martial arts is?

I think Martial Arts is, in my own words, a generic term for any type of fighting that is not Boxing or brawling. Just because you say "I know martial arts" or "He knows Martial arts" doesn't tell you anything about how they fight. If you say "I know Muay Thai" or "I know Judo" those are both forms of Martial Arts, but are both very different in the way you learn and what you learn.

My point was mainly to find out wheather they had fought or not. Something happened in Houston in the 70's where some boxer fought some martial arts guys. My friend still thinks it was Ali but and Bruce, funny how the mind remembers things that didn't happen.

Please by all means continue on who would win. I like most forms of Martial Arts over boxing but I just don't think Bruce would be able to pull it off in a ring even if they were both allowed to fight any way they wanted. Ali was Fast and Powerful, Bruce was fast, and powerful for his size, but by know means was he more powerful then Ali.

If your interest in seeing fights like these though The K1 competitions are about as close as you'll get to seeing a boxer against a kickboxer/karate/punching and kicking style Martials arts. Boxers usually loose. But there also all the same size and weight.

 

[Citizen87645]

Very true, but we also need to separate the movie Bruce Lee and the martial artist Bruce Lee. Martial artist Lee would know better than to rely on kicks that leave him vulnerable. We've all seen Lee pull of some amazing high kicks but it's doubtful he would rely on it for combat. Plus Lee was originally trained in Wing Chun, which has kicks, but nothing above the waist, to maintain stability.

 

[Gregg Shiu]

Ok, I said before I'd stay out of this because it's so hypothetical and the thread would possibly spiral akwardly out of control like in some martial arts forums. I say let these two legends rest!

I'll just add my two cents though to whoever first mentioned Bruce's grapling/ground skills or lack thereof. I agree with you to a point, because I've read numerous accounts which stated he knew he'd have a hard time if he were to be taken to the ground, but that would hardly happen. Bruce had later encorporated more ground work into his skills because he knew it was important to diversify and take important parts from different fighting styles. UFC fighter Ken Shamrock was interviewed before about his view of Bruce Lee and mentioned how you could see him using an armbar, which was not an orthodox martial arts maneuver. Basically, the point is Bruce Lee wasn't ignorant, and he did expand his repetoire in fighting skills to back up his teachings.

 

[Mike Wladyka]

Yes he will make the bag move more because he had speed and because he's bigger

all i am saying is just cuz he is bigger doesn't mean he will move it more. maybe he could i have never seen hit a 300lb bag, but don't dismiss bruce's ability to move the bag until you have seen it. I remember a friend of mine showed me a clip of bruce training with the 300lb and he was moving it like boxers move 80lb bags. Maybe Ali could move it, but so could bruce. Don't dismiss bruce just cuz ali is bigger and bruce is smaller.

 

[JonZ]

I disagree that Ali was faster than Bruce.

Watch the scene in Chinese Connection when Bruce takes on the russian.He connects with a punch that came from his hand being down at his waist - it is undoubtedly the fastest punch Ive ever seen.

Or the kick to the Koreans head in ROTD

Also,Im not sure which documentary it is - either A&Es or the one on in Bruce Lee boxset, but they should Bruce punching a heavybag in his backyard the the thing goes flying in the air. He actually has to step foward to keep hitting it.