UHD Review A Few Words About A few words about...™ - Rio Bravo -- in 4k UHD (1 Viewer)

[Kyle_D]

Your killing time hanging out with a trio of 1950s icons waiting for them to kill the bad guys ( claude Akins and John Russell) who were killed by the end of every tv western they were in at that time.There was no suspense there, and even though we are comparing both movies, this is why High Noon is better than Bravo.

You just explained exactly what a lot of people love about Rio Bravo. It's one of the great hangout movies ever made.

You find High Noon suspenseful. I find it self-righteous, contemptuous pablum. Tastes vary. We're both entitled to our opinions.

 

[Robert Harris]

You just explained exactly what a lot of people love about Rio Bravo. It's one of the great hangout movies ever made.

You find High Noon suspenseful. I find it self-righteous, contemptuous pablum. Tastes vary. We're both entitled to our opinions.

I’m one firmly in the Kramer/Zinnemann camp.

 

[OliverK]

Dean Martin is better than Mitchum by a country mile.

You always learn something new on the forums...

I like Nelson's low-key quiet and they give him good lines.

Looks like his stature has grown a lot over the course of this thread. The last time I watched Rio Bravo he still looked like a singer who couldn't act.

RIO BRAVO is fresh and subtle where the other two are obvious copies.

I never thought of Rio Bravo as fresh and subtle or El Dorado as a copy but then I try to judge movies on their own merits and not according to which movie came first.

In any case I like both movies and I am quite puzzled how somebody could like Rio Bravo that much and at the same time find El Dorado so inferior or vice versa, does not make much sense to me.

 

[Robert Crawford]

Ricky had lines he couldn't sell. He was to weak of a actor to play that part. Eldorado got a key element correct that Rio Bravo badly needed. It had a character who was just as good if not better than the protagonist. Good enough to the point the protagonist had to cheat to win. There is no sense of danger in Rio bravo. Your killing time hanging out with a trio of 1950s icons waiting for them to kill the bad guys ( claude Akins and John Russell) who were killed by the end of every tv western they were in at that time.There was no suspense there, and even though we are comparing both movies, this is why High Noon is better than Bravo. Chris George charcter is the difference between these 2 films and the conflict is stronger and leads to our heros in the story having to think outside the box to win. And ultimately professionalism is highlighted stronger in this movie than in bravo too. The last lines by George and wayne proves it. Wayne couldn't afford to leave anything to chance even though Chris George was willing to fight him fairly. Bravo is a good movie but it has cons all over the place. High Noon is superior to both.

I'm sorry, but I never thought the George's character was as good as the protagonist because he never demonstrated his gun play ability in the entire movie. We only heard about his gun play ability. I never got a sense that Cole Thornton was going to lose to him. That facial scar was an indication that McLeod could be beaten. Rio Bravo might have its faults, but it's a better and tighter western/film than El Dorado with its comedic efforts that aren't really funny to me since I grew up from watching it in 1967. As to High Noon, in my opinion, it's not only the finest western ever made, I believe High Noon is one of the all-time best films.

 

[Robert Crawford]

You just explained exactly what a lot of people love about Rio Bravo. It's one of the great hangout movies ever made.

You find High Noon suspenseful. I find it self-righteous, contemptuous pablum. Tastes vary. We're both entitled to our opinions.

Everybody is entitled to their opinion. I happen to disagree with yours in this case.

 

[Robert Crawford]

I’m one firmly in the Kramer/Zinnemann camp.

Same here. It wasn't always the case though because when I was younger my opinion of High Noon wasn't nearly as high as it is now. Matter of fact, I appreciated Rio Bravo more as a movie in my younger years. However, about 25-30 years ago, my opinion shifted about the film as I gained life experiences and my opinion about society and people in general became more in focus. I think there is a coordination there.

 

[Kevin Antonio (Kev)]

In any case I like both movies and I am quite puzzled how somebody could like Rio Bravo that much and at the same time find El Dorado so inferior or vice versa, does not make much sense to me.

Especially when they are practically the same movie. Dean Martin was a cool dude and a class act but he isn't Robert Mitchum... he isn't even burned out doing it for money Robert Mitchum. But Eldorado actually added a element the other story was missing.

And hanging with icons doesn't make a film better too me. Maybe rewatchable, but not better in all the departments that matter. High Noon stomps on bravo when you measure the conflict of the main protagonist and way he has to go about finding a resolution ( a man eventually alone) against evil. The suspense is better and pacing is much better. The ideal of professionalism is a great mantra by Hawkes but his feelings about Noon were always absurd to me. In that time period most Sheriff's and Marshals " wernt hired guns" most sheriff's were simple elected because they were the most liked or upstanding person. So being afraid of real killers and asking for help is sound storytelling, characterization, and true to the nature of that time period for most.

 

[Robert Crawford]

I'm a big Robert Mitchum fan and always thought he gave a good performance in El Dorado. With that said, Martin's performance in Rio Bravo was excellent and is beyond reproach in my opinion.

 

[Robert Crawford]

One more thing, I just want to give everyone that participated in this thread a "shout out". I might not agree with all of the opinions and thoughts expressed in this thread, but I respect each and every one of them. Film appreciation is a subjective process and I long ago realized that my appreciation for any film might not be shared by other people. It's all good as I bow out of this thread because I have nothing else to say about Rio Bravo, El Dorado or even High Noon.

 

[mskaye]

I’m one firmly in the Kramer/Zinnemann camp.

Mr. Hawks was indisputably a great director. But his opinions on two great films - High Noon and The Wild Bunch - display him as a little narrow-minded (at least when it came to Western competition.) He was entitled to his opinion of course, but he is on the wrong side of (film) history.

 

[Kevin Antonio (Kev)]

I'm a big Robert Mitchum fan and always thought he gave a good performance in El Dorado. With that said, Martin's performance in Rio Bravo was excellent and is beyond reproach in my opinion.

I think it being dean Martin was always a hard sell for me. I love the man but I suppose my eyes just can't overlook that its him instead of the charcter. Same thing in some came running ( another great film from that era). I love Mitchum in just about everything. Shame he never viewed himself the way many of us view him as a actor. This has been a good discussion. I think we can all agree it's a good thing these classics are being kept alive and given good treatment. Let's hope Warners follows up with even more releases .

 

[Kyle_D]

Mr. Hawks was indisputably a great director. But his opinions on two great films - High Noon and The Wild Bunch - display him as a little narrow-minded (at least when it came to Western competition.) He was entitled to his opinion of course, but he is on the wrong side of (film) history.

I disagree with Hawks on the Wild Bunch, but I'd argue a little "narrow-minded"-ness is a feature, not a bug of a lot of great artists. I'm reminded of the Truffaut quote: "Taste is the result of a thousand distastes." Or, "A man's gotta have a code."

My problem with High Noon, apart from the standard Kramer didacticism, is the overt message is far too simplistic and malleable such that it is easily co-opted to justify abhorrent behavior. I'll leave real-life out of it. Taken to its extreme, "Society is full of cowards, so the individual must stand up to oppression and do what's right," leads to Travis Bickle.

 

[SuperClark]

Rio Bravo is my number 1 favorite western and El Dorado is in my top 15.As I previously mentioned I believe Ricky Nelson was effective in his role.He was low key,easy going,confident which was his character as Colorado.I would have preferred Elvis since he was 5 years older (23 in 1958) and it would have been fantastic to see him work with John Wayne and Dean Martin.This is an interesting comparison of the 2 movies.I did not know in the original screen play Leigh Brackett had Cole die.

 

[Keith Cobby]

I'm not a fan of The Wild Bunch (or much else by Peckinpah with the exception of Ride the High Country). He brought in a new era of western films but the slow motion and over use of the zoom do nothing for me.

High Noon is a fine film about duty, but I can appreciate why it received so much criticism.

 

[OliverK]

Magnificent thread everybody, now imagine we could also compare El Dorado and Rio Lobo Blu-rays or UHDs from new masters.

That'll be the day...

 

[David_B_K]

I think it being dean Martin was always a hard sell for me. I love the man but I suppose my eyes just can't overlook that its him instead of the charcter. Same thing in some came running ( another great film from that era). I love Mitchum in just about everything. Shame he never viewed himself the way many of us view him as a actor. This has been a good discussion. I think we can all agree it's a good thing these classics are being kept alive and given good treatment. Let's hope Warners follows up with even more releases .

I've never been much of a Dean Martin fan for the reasons you say. To me, he always had a lazy "phoning it in" way about him. Even his singing has a lazy sound about it IMO. When he did his TV variety show (which he didn't want to do), he only agreed to do it if he didn't have to rehearse or change out of his tux. For this reason I agree that he never seems to really be in character in many of his films.

However, Rio Bravo is the exception for me. I think Martin is fantastic in the movie. He seems totally committed and really makes you feel for his character. I also liked him in The Sons of Katie Elder. But in general, he just seems to be coasting through his films.

As for the either/or of Rio Bravo & El Dorado, I saw El Dorado when it came out and loved it. Saw it again when ABC showed it on TV still loved it. A few years later, I saw Rio Bravo for the first time as a late movie. Being on a local station, it probably ran well over three hours with commercials. Even with its slow pace I found it one of the most enjoyable films I'd ever seen. I have not seen El Dorado since and don't particularly want to. Even though they are similar stories using a formula Hawks was fond of, they are different in a lot of ways. El Dorado has more action and characters and plot, but tends to be more comic in tone. The drunkenness of Mitchum's character is often a source of humor, whereas the drunkenness of Martin's Dude is more dramatic in tone.

In general I feel Hawks went to the well a little to often with this story. After Only Angels Have Wings, To Have and Have Not and Rio Bravo, he had basically done the story (or elements of it) in three genres and there was not much left to explore with it. I've never seen Rio Lobo, so I can't speak as to how "the formula" works in that one.

 

[OliverK]

I'm not a fan of The Wild Bunch (or much else by Peckinpah with the exception of Ride the High Country). He brought in a new era of western films but the slow motion and over use of the zoom do nothing for me.

High Noon is a fine film about duty, but I can appreciate why it received so much criticism.

If you can look past the slow motion and the zooms there are some good movies to be found there from Peckinpah but I can see how you would be annoyed by some of it.

I have not seen High Noon in a very long time. I know it is regarded as a very good movie but somehow it didn't do that much for me.

 

[Filmgazer]

Rio Bravo is my number 1 favorite western and El Dorado is in my top 15.As I previously mentioned I believe Ricky Nelson was effective in his role.He was low key,easy going,confident which was his character as Colorado.I would have preferred Elvis since he was 5 years older (23 in 1958) and it would have been fantastic to see him work with John Wayne and Dean Martin.This is an interesting comparison of the 2 movies.I did not know in the original screen play Leigh Brackett had Cole die.

Thanks for posting the video clip comparing between "Rio Bravo" and "El Dorado". Very interesting, as was the stimulating discussion on this thread!

 

[Keith Cobby]

Rio Bravo is my number 1 favorite western and El Dorado is in my top 15.As I previously mentioned I believe Ricky Nelson was effective in his role.He was low key,easy going,confident which was his character as Colorado.I would have preferred Elvis since he was 5 years older (23 in 1958) and it would have been fantastic to see him work with John Wayne and Dean Martin.This is an interesting comparison of the 2 movies.I did not know in the original screen play Leigh Brackett had Cole die.

An interesting comparison. Apparently Elvis wanted top billing and this is unthinkable for a John Wayne film. I like Dean Martin and he's very good in other westerns, but I like Bob Mitchum more and it's always been fun to watch him with Wayne, plus nice ending.

 

[Robert Crawford]

An interesting comparison. Apparently Elvis wanted top billing and this is unthinkable for a John Wayne film. I like Dean Martin and he's very good in other westerns, but I like Bob Mitchum more and it's always been fun to watch him with Wayne, plus nice ending.

He's excellent in this western!