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sbjork

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Stephen
I watched the 4K/UHD again this morning. I did monitor the Mbps during the entire viewing and I concur with your findings about the Mbps. With that said, I think the video presentation is excellent for the most part and I'm very happy with it. It's a disc I will revisit quite often on my LG OLEDs, and I can see some improved differences between this 4K disc and its 4K digital counterpart.
Oh, it's quite good, and the best version of the movie out there. It's just disappointing that Warner Bros. didn't give a classic like this that last bit of TLC to make it as good as it could possibly be.
 

mskaye

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Oh, it's quite good, and the best version of the movie out there. It's just disappointing that Warner Bros. didn't give a classic like this that last bit of TLC to make it as good as it could possibly be.
can someone elaborate on why they would opt to master it like this ? is it an economic choice? If it is cheaper to do it this way I can understsand it. Not agree with it mind you just understand it.
 

titch

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Kevin Oppegaard
Why do people think Warner did something wrong?
As Stephen pointed out in his typically thorough review in The Digital Bits: "Of course, the raw bitrate isn’t necessarily as important as is how well that that the compression was handled, but in this case, there are definitely some deficiencies in that regard. In the medium to long shots of Wheeler’s shirt, the textures are nicely defined when everything is static, but they can break up and smear when in motion. The grain is occasionally affected by the compression as well. As always, it’s worth remembering that most of these kinds of artifacts are only visible when viewed from up close on a larger screen, so they won’t be noticeable from normal viewing distances. Still, it’s disappointing that Warner Bros. wouldn’t pull out all the stops to ensure that Rio Bravo looks its best regardless of circumstances. Given the fact that the only extra on the disc is a commentary track, space shouldn’t have been a consideration."

Companies, such as Fidelity In Motion, really use all available disc space to make sure their compression doesn't have artefacts. Why Warner Bros. don't utilise "the whole playing field", is the question. I remember all their blu-rays for years were terribly compressed, because they were encoding on BD-25's. This may have been acceptable for viewing on small TV screens in 2007, but the deficiencies in resolution and encoding were obvious when projecting at sizes over 100 inches. 15 years later, far more people have large screens or projectors and a 4K disc should be able to render a picture that looks equal to, or better than it it would, on a cinema screen.
 

Robert Crawford

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As Stephen pointed out in his typically thorough review in The Digital Bits: "Of course, the raw bitrate isn’t necessarily as important as is how well that that the compression was handled, but in this case, there are definitely some deficiencies in that regard. In the medium to long shots of Wheeler’s shirt, the textures are nicely defined when everything is static, but they can break up and smear when in motion. The grain is occasionally affected by the compression as well. As always, it’s worth remembering that most of these kinds of artifacts are only visible when viewed from up close on a larger screen, so they won’t be noticeable from normal viewing distances. Still, it’s disappointing that Warner Bros. wouldn’t pull out all the stops to ensure that Rio Bravo looks its best regardless of circumstances. Given the fact that the only extra on the disc is a commentary track, space shouldn’t have been a consideration."

Companies, such as Fidelity In Motion, really use all available disc space to make sure their compression doesn't have artefacts. Why Warner Bros. don't utilise "the whole playing field", is the question. I remember all their blu-rays for years were terribly compressed, because they were encoding on BD-25's. This may have been acceptable for viewing on small TV screens in 2007, but the deficiencies in resolution and encoding were obvious when projecting at sizes over 100 inches. 15 years later, far more people have large screens or projectors and a 4K disc should be able to render a picture that looks equal to, or better than it it would, on a cinema screen.
Frankly, I don’t think the studios cater to those that have projectors because they feel most of their consumers have displays that are 65” or less.
 

jayembee

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Interesting with these new UHD releases from Warner Bros., that they have now discovered the colour green. The resolution may not have improved dramatically, but now there is green!

Green.gif
 

Kyle_D

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Kyle Dickinson
Here are the video specs for the disc

Video
ID : 1
ID in the original source medium : 4113 (0x1011)
Format : HEVC
Format/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Format profile : Main [email protected]@High
HDR format : SMPTE ST 2086, HDR10 compatible
Codec ID : V_MPEGH/ISO/HEVC
Duration : 2 h 21 min
Bit rate : 53.7 Mb/s
Width : 3 840 pixels
Height : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0 (Type 2)
Bit depth : 10 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.270
Stream size : 52.9 GiB (93%)
Language : English
Default : No
Forced : No
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.2020
Transfer characteristics : PQ
Matrix coefficients : BT.2020 non-constant
Mastering display color primaries : Display P3
Mastering display luminance : min: 0.0001 cd/m2, max: 1000 cd/m2
Maximum Content Light Level : 3163 cd/m2
Maximum Frame-Average Light Level : 193 cd/m2
Original source medium : Blu-ray

I don't see anything deficient. The film leaves about 10GB free on a BD-66, but that overhead is typical for most releases, even those presented on BD-100s.

I realize it would be ideal if every release could be presented on a BD-100 with an 80+ Mbps video encode, but my understanding is that's just not realistic given the state of the market and today's manufacturing capacities.
 

Daniel Melius

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I think he means not at that price point. That’s how I interpreted his post.
At the time i made that post amazon had raised the price from 29.99 up to 37.50, which is close in price to the 4k i just preordered of arrow's limited deluxe 4k of witness. They have now dropped rio bravo back down to 29.99. This is still too much for pretty much a bare bones 4k disc. I already own the blu ray of rio bravo so i will wait until they drop the price of the 4k to between 20 and 22 dollars before I purchase it. That is the current price for their 4k's of the maltese falcon and cool hand luke.
 
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mark27b

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Mark Pledger
Disappointed no slip when the promo material shows one

A premium price for a premium product I expect one
 

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Robert Harris

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Here are the video specs for the disc



I don't see anything deficient. The film leaves about 10GB free on a BD-66, but that overhead is typical for most releases, even those presented on BD-100s.

I realize it would be ideal if every release could be presented on a BD-100 with an 80+ Mbps video encode, but my understanding is that's just not realistic given the state of the market and today's manufacturing capacities.
It’s neither market nor manufacturing. It’s what’s called for by the film. In this case the film is soft by design.
 
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Kyle_D

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Kyle Dickinson
It’s neither market nor manufacturing. It’s what’s called for by the film. In this case the film is soft but design.
If manufacturing cost and availability were not a concern, would there be any downside to putting every UHD release on a BD-100 with a maxed out bitrate?

I'm not saying that every film would benefit from a higher bitrate. I don't disagree that it's probably unnecessary for most titles, and I rarely notice compression issues on my 65" display with 50 Mbps UHD encodes. With that said, I can't discount the viewpoints of people who have noted differences between UHD encodes and higher bitrate Kaleidescape downloads on larger projection setups.
 

Robert Harris

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If manufacturing cost and availability were not a concern, would there be any downside to putting every UHD release on a BD-100 with a maxed out bitrate?

I'm not saying that every film would benefit from a higher bitrate. I don't disagree that it's probably unnecessary for most titles, and I rarely notice compression issues on my 65" display with 50 Mbps UHD encodes. With that said, I can't discount the viewpoints of people who have noted differences between UHD encodes and higher bitrate Kaleidescape downloads on larger projection setups.
Why produce 33, 66 and 100?
 

sbjork

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Aug 1, 2020
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Stephen
Here are the video specs for the disc



I don't see anything deficient. The film leaves about 10GB free on a BD-66, but that overhead is typical for most releases, even those presented on BD-100s.

I realize it would be ideal if every release could be presented on a BD-100 with an 80+ Mbps video encode, but my understanding is that's just not realistic given the state of the market and today's manufacturing capacities.
Again, it looks very good as is. The encode still isn't as good as it could be, and there are artifacts as a result of that. Minor ones, that most people won't notice, but they're present. It's still a great disc, just not quite as great as it could have been. There's nuance here.
 

SuperClark

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Jan 15, 2022
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Clark
Its too bad the role Harry Carey Jr played was cut.So he called HH 'Howard' instead of Mr. Hawks.Big deal.I guess a scene filmed but deleted with Ricky Nelson was also deleted.


 
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