Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker Discussion Thread (SPOILERS!) (1 Viewer)

[SamT]

I agree that Lando was completely wasted. You could have removed him and it wouldn’t matter. They could have used him in connection with Han. A little reaction. Maybe he could have talked to Ben and have something to do with his return.

 

[Doug Wallen]

Overall, I enjoyed it. Seems like it was a checklist type of movie (so many things must be addressed,d we get them all?)

Wasn't great, but it wasn't awful.

The "together" theme was really overused.

Best moments to me;
1) the conversation between Han and Ben ending in, "I know!"
2) Rey giving her name to the "neighbor" and watching the suns set.

 

[Jason_V]

My biggest problem with JJ's big movies outside of Star Trek 2009 is they rehash things already done. Star Trek Into Darkness was a shameless rework of Star Trek II. The Force Awakens is A New Hope from beginning to end. And Rise of Skywalker? It's Return of the Jedi Mark II. They even made the Ewoks have a damn cameo at the end during the montage.

Lando in a helmet obscuring his face, final crap ton of ships having a space battle, a Force user going down a big hole in a planet/Death Star, Force ghosts providing pivotal story information, absurd humor at times, unnecessary humor, lots of unnecessary creatures...

And that kiss. No. A million times no.

 

[Robert Crawford]

Yeah, they had too many ships in battle and could have cut that final battle down some.

 

[Jason_V]

Yeah, they had too many ships in battle and could have cut that final battle down some.

Although, and I neglected to mention it, when Lando shows up with those ships...THAT was the only time I felt an emotion in the movie. I welled up a little bit. And then it went away.

 

[Greg.K]

I'd argue that TLJ takes some direct shots at TFA (making fun of Kylo Ren's mask, turning Hux into something of a goof, having Luke just toss his lightsaber after that being the climax of the previous movie). TROS just didn't follow the tracks that TLJ set down and to me, that isn't disrespectful, it was just that Abrams and company went in a different direction.

I liked Luke admonishing Rey to treat the saber with more respect. I think some will see that as a slam against Johnson but I like that it's just Luke admitting that he was wrong. Jedi have never been infallible. I think TROS's treatment of Leia also provides more justification for Leia's force abilities in TLJ - of course she trained with Luke, she was potentially just as powerful as him. And I liked that she knew enough to be able to train Rey to some extent as well. Maybe not a real "master", but along with the Jedi texts, giving Rey all that she needed.

* Felt bad for Rose Tico / Kelly Marie Tran - as if negative reaction to her character in TLJ led to her role being diminished (similar to JarJar in Ep 2 and 3)

Agree, I wish she'd had much more to do. (though I can't say I ever felt bad for Jar Jar )

* Rey being the granddaughter of Palpatine is a logical connection; BUT Palpatine showing up suddenly in this episode (with no hint in TLJ) shows the disconnect & lack of overarching plot.

But on the other hand since Snoke pretty much came out of nowhere with no backstory in TFA, I liked the explanation that Palpatine created him (and the vats of Snokes was a nice gag).

Were Force Ghosts (eg. Luke) always able to wield the Force? I thought the point of Obi Wan's "If you strike me down, I'll be more powerful..." was that he can still influence / guide... otherwise why aren't all the dead Jedi helping????

I don't mind it in small quantities (Yoda lightning striking the tree, Luke catching the saber) but Luke didn't even need to be the one to lift the X-Wing out of the water, Rey could have easily done that herself.

1) the conversation between Han and Ben ending in, "I know!"

I also loved Han's "I know" line. And I liked Ben's return to the light side at this point of the movie and not just as a climactic turn at the end quite a bit too.

 

[Jason_V]

I also loved Han's "I know" line. And I liked Ben's return to the light side at this point of the movie and not just as a climactic turn at the end quite a bit too.

But see, the turn happens and then he utterly disappears until he needs to show up again. And then he goes out like a punk, the kiss and then nothing else. The Big Bad of this trilogy just...vanishes in favor of the Emperor.

We all knew he would turn--I'm not against it. You just don't change a main character and then go "well, go get some juice until you're needed again."

 

[Colin Jacobson]

I think the worst cameo was John Williams. He should not have been in there. It was distracting and he is bigger than life. He does not need a cameo.

I didn't even notice him, so I guess he didn't distract me!

Very excited to see Denis Lawson!

 

[Colin Jacobson]

I'm with the crowd who views this as an enjoyable movie but a disappointment.

I reserve the right to change my mind. I didn't like "Last Jedi" initially but warmed up to it, so I may like "Rise" more with additional viewings...

 

[benbess]

.....

 

[Joe Wong]

Agree, I wish she'd had much more to do. (though I can't say I ever felt bad for Jar Jar )



But on the other hand since Snoke pretty much came out of nowhere with no backstory in TFA, I liked the explanation that Palpatine created him (and the vats of Snokes was a nice gag).



I don't mind it in small quantities (Yoda lightning striking the tree, Luke catching the saber) but Luke didn't even need to be the one to lift the X-Wing out of the water, Rey could have easily done that herself.

Agreed on all 3 points...

I wasn't a fan of JarJar either...it was more the parallel

Yes, Snoke's backstory was nicely explained...given what happened to him in TLJ. Though I don't think this is how JJ may have envisioned it

And as you said, Rey could have raised the X-Wing. But seeing as Ghost Luke still has such powers...why doesn't he join them in the final battle? He may not have helped in the physical sense, but the Force is powerful

 

[Tommy R]

I did very much like that Snoke was “made” by Palpatine. Nicely explains why a new baddie organization came to be after the empire.

You know, during the scene with Han, I DID hear that he ended the convo with “I know” but I didn’t register it as a throwback line until I read the comments on here, lol! I guess I was just SOOO taken by the whole scene I didn’t notice.

After sleeping on it, I still really like it and see it as a fitting end. Here’s my current rank (I reserve the right to jumble these around for the rest of my life):

TESB
ANH
TLJ
R1
TROS
ROTJ
TPM
S
TFA
ROTS
AOTC

 

[Greg.K]

But see, the turn happens and then he utterly disappears until he needs to show up again. And then he goes out like a punk, the kiss and then nothing else. The Big Bad of this trilogy just...vanishes in favor of the Emperor.

We all knew he would turn--I'm not against it. You just don't change a main character and then go "well, go get some juice until you're needed again."

Not sure what else he was supposed to be doing, Rey stranded him on Endor. He was never really a great "big bad", he's the most conflicted dark side villain we've seen and almost turned back in both TFA and TLJ, so I think it was justified that he ultimately did so - and I was glad that it wasn't at the climax to save Rey (which would have been even more of a ROTJ rehash), but in reaction to the twin acts of kindness of Leia calling out to him, and Rey healing him.

And THEN he sacrificed himself to save Rey, so I don't think he went out like a punk at all.

And I liked the kiss. The audience I saw it with cheered, too, so I think it went over well overall. (Though I guess he's kind of technically her cousin since it has been hinted at in the prequels that Palpatine created Anakin in the first place...)

 

[Colin Jacobson]

Cameo I only caught via reading the credits: George Harrison's son Dhani as "FN-0878"...

 

[Jason_V]

Not sure what else he was supposed to be doing, Rey stranded him on Endor. He was never really a great "big bad", he's the most conflicted dark side villain we've seen and almost turned back in both TFA and TLJ, so I think it was justified that he ultimately did so - and I was glad that it wasn't at the climax to save Rey (which would have been even more of a ROTJ rehash), but in reaction to the twin acts of kindness of Leia calling out to him, and Rey healing him.

And THEN he sacrificed himself to save Rey, so I don't think he went out like a punk at all.

And I liked the kiss. The audience I saw it with cheered, too, so I think it went over well overall. (Though I guess he's kind of technically her cousin since it has been hinted at in the prequels that Palpatine created Anakin in the first place...)

Not gonna argue if he was a good villain...but he is the villain through most of these movies. I don't know what else he's supposed to do either, but there should be at least one connecting scene between the turn and showing up to fight with Rey. Also not arguing he should not have turned; it needed to happen for the saga to be truly complete with a tidy bow.

He needed something bigger and badder to go out on. That's just me. It was almost a Boba Fett death. One moment there and the next...gone. At least for me.

The less said about that kiss, the better. Rey is a Palpatine, Palpatine is maybe/likely Anakin's father, Ben Solo is a Skywalker...just...ew. But it does tie back into Empire Strikes Back and the Luke/Leia icky retrospect kiss.

 

[Atari]

I knew most of the plot points going in so it was interesting to observe the crowd reactions. Here are the ones that stuck out to me:

1. Chewbacca and C3PO fake outs - complete silence, nobody seemed to buy they were gone
2. Rey is a Palpatine - audible gasps and several people shouting "No"
3. The Kiss - cheering
4. I'm a Skywalker - cheering

I enjoyed most of the Rey / Kylo scenes except the kiss really seemed out of place. A lot of the rest was a convoluted mess. Several characters seemed to be added just to breakup love triangles.

For Finn I have two theories on what he wanted to tell Rey. Either that he loved her or that he had force powers too. They probably just didn't want to make it clear so the people that want them together can still have hope.

 

[Greg.K]

1. Chewbacca and C3PO fake outs - complete silence, nobody seemed to buy they were gone

Was C-3PO really a fakeout? As soon as they mentioned R2 having backups you knew he'd be back.

 

[joshEH]

I could be totally wrong on this, but I don’t think the Force was ever meant to be a thing where you had to be born in a certain blood line to get it. I think some people came away from Phantom Menace and midichlorians thinking that the Force was like a part of your DNA. But I’m not sure that’s what Lucas ever intended. I think it’s more a thing where midichlorians are present in people who are Force sensitive, but it’s not solely an inherited trait. That you could have the force and midichlorians even if your relatives don’t. I think midichlorians were a way for Lucas to objectively measure what had previously been unquantifiable to audiences, so that characters could say of Anakin, “he’s stronger in the Force than anyone we’ve ever known.” I don’t think the intention was ever to turn it into a royal bloodline but I think a lot of the fandom has kinda taken it that way. Otherwise, how could the Jedi have thrived for a thousand generations if the Force can only be inherited but that Jedis also don’t have kids?

While it's definitely true that all living beings can touch the Force in some way (and that all people carry midichlorians), in this case the concept of measuring the Force actually goes back decades -- the 1976 ANH novelization makes mention of the "Jedi scientists" who attempted to measure the Force via physical means.

The Force is still the universal energy-field described by Alec Guinness in the original film, with the midichlorians simply being a genetic/hematological predisposition towards sensitivity to it that certain people possess. Everyone can touch the Force to some extent or other, but people who produce larger numbers of midichlorians can do it better than others. In Return of the Jedi, Luke says, "The Force is strong in my family" -- which implies a hereditary genetic carrier-trend, something in the DNA that is measurable and traceable in real-world scientific terms.

 

[Colin Jacobson]

While it's definitely true that all living beings can touch the Force in some way (and that all people carry midichlorians), in this case the concept of measuring the Force actually goes back decades -- the 1976 ANH novelization makes mention of the "Jedi scientists" who attempted to measure the Force via physical means.

The Force is still the universal energy-field described by Alec Guinness in the original film, with the midichlorians simply being a genetic/hematological predisposition towards sensitivity to it that certain people possess. Everyone can touch the Force to some extent or other, but people who produce larger numbers of midichlorians can do it better than others. In Return of the Jedi, Luke says, "The Force is strong in my family" -- which implies a hereditary genetic carrier-trend, something in the DNA that is measurable and traceable in real-world scientific terms.

You know Lucas and all the others just make this stuff up as they go along, right?

 

[joshEH]

You know Lucas and all the others just make this stuff up as they go along, right?

True, although in this particular case, there's enough circumstantial evidence (including the 1976 ANH novel, which Lucas had considerable supervisory-input into) which at least partially suggests that this concept was something that had been in the back of his mind for some years, even if it took him a couple of decades to finally put it into a film.