Eq question (1 Viewer)

[Juan Castillo]

1. Is there a big difference in the quality of low budget EQ's?

2. Even if it is not needed, is it a good idea to incorporate one if one is available?

3. Anyone here have a technics model SH-GE50? And if so, are you happy with it?

I have one, and am about to incorporate a Kenwood VR-507 reciever into my system using my old reciever as a sub amp for my DVC Cerwin Vega sub. So hopefully, I can make good use of the EQ. Thanks in advance for your input.

 

[ColinM]

Will you be EQ'ing the sub?

 

[Juan Castillo]

not sure exactly how to hook things up yet. What I have right now, is a stereo reciever umm.. well here, lemme list my components, and you give me a suggestion k?

Kenwood VR-507 DD, DTS, DPLII reciever in transit : )

Pioneer SX-203 Stereo reciever/Sub Amp

Technics SH-GE50 EQ

Phillips DVD711 DVD player

JC Electronics JC-111 HTPC

Sony SLV-N71 VCR

Pioneer PD-M423 CD changer

Sony TC-W365 Cassette

Pelican PL-625 A/V Switch

Technics SB-S29 Surrounds

Technics SB-LV105 Bookshelf

Technics SB-AFC32 Center Channel

Cerwin Vega SW-12B Passive 12" DVC Sub

Before the Kenwood , I was using the A channel on the Pioneer to push the bookshelf speakers, and the B channel to push the sub through its low inputs, with the high outputs to the surrounds.

I know, 100 watts per channel x 2 to 5 speakers... oh yeah, the center not plugged in with this old setup. The DVD audio was being run through the EQ, and then back out to the recievers inputs. This way, only DVD playback would make use of the EQ, but since its the only way that it can be hooked up to my system its fine by me ... So, now that I am going to implement the VR-507, and use it to push all 5 speakers, with the sub out going to the stereo reciever to push the Sub all by itself, I am just wondering if I should plug the EQ back into the dvd player, and run its signal to the Kenwood. I guess its a simple question, just wondering if all the Kenwood adds to my setup, if i would benefit from still having it in place? Thanks again.

 

[Ted Lee]

unless professionally setup, i think eq's can be very tricky. something about you're only supposed to flatten humps, not try to raise dips, etc. not really sure there.

in any case, i used to use an eq and really liked it.

but...

my paradigm shift about how to listen to music happened the day i started realizing that it was really processing the sound to such an extreme that i wasn't even hearing what the producers/artist intended.

of course, really all that matters is how you like the way it sounds. if you enjoy boosting/cutting the sound, then so be it.

you mention running the eq between the dvd and receiver? i thought most eq's were hooked up to the receivers tape-monitor? unless you're trying to do something different?

in any case, since you already have it, i'd definitely say hook it up and give it a shot. see what you like best...

ted

 

[Juan Castillo]

Can anyone expand on the tape-monitor hookup that Ted references? I will look at it tonight and post the hookups it has, and hopefully I can set it up to use it for all sources and not just the dvd. Thanks

 

[Ted Lee]

i'm absolutely positively sure...(i think)
the back of your eq will have some in/out labeled "main" or "playback" or something like that. those plugs go to the tape-monitor input (often tape2) on your receiver.
then, whenever you hit the tape-monitor on your receiver, it "engages" the eq. now, no matter what source you select on your receiver (dvd, tuner, cd, etc.), as long as the tape-mon is selected, everything you hear will be eq'd.
at least that's how it's worked on all the eq systems i've seen.
remember, it can't be hooked to the tape-1 input. that's just like any other input on your receiver. it doesn't always "stay on" like the tape-monitor (tape2) input does.

 

[Juan Castillo]

You da man Ted!! I know it has two inputs and two outputs in back, and a bypass button in front..er something like that.. I will try tonight. Thanks for your help!

 

[Ted Lee]

no problem juan!
it should definitely work. just make the connections, turn your receiver's volume knob down, hit the tape2 button then jack up all the eq levels. you should hear an immediate and noticeable difference.
if you still have problems, just let us know!

 

[Juan Castillo]

The back of the EQ had two separate input output sections. One labeled EQ, the other Tape. I tried the Tape first, hooked everthing up the the Tape 2/Monitor inputs and selected the tape setting on the front (push button selector, when pushed in, source is selected, when released, tape is selected), and turned on the reciever. I first put in a CD, selected the cd button on the reciever, and then hit the tape 2 button. Nothing. No sound, no movement of LCD display on EQ.. OK.. Powered down, switched everything on the EQ back panel from the Tape input/outputs to the EQ input/outputs, selected Source on the push button selector on the front panel, turned everything back on, and Whoala!!!SUccess.. Next, put in a DVD, selected the DVD button on the reciever, and boom! Only prob is, that until I get my Kenwood. I will not be able to listen to my TV through the Stereo. Not enough inputs. Ted, thanks !

 

[Ted Lee]

glad it worked juan -

does your tv have audio-outs? if so, you may be able to hook that to the tape input on your eq. i'm guessing the front of the eq has some way to "engage" that tape input?

give it a try...you may be surprised!

 

[Mark Larson]

I was also interested in getting an EQ for my (stereo) setup, but even in my old minisystem, i just left it at one setting - don't know how to do it properly.
And 10 points PER CHANNEL!! Wow! I would be tweaking all day!

 

[Ted Lee]

hey mark -

most eq's follow this format:

1. the left-most channels are the bass

2. the middle channels are the midrange

3. the right-most channels are the highs

typically, most people will boost the bass and treble, but not the mid's. they'll taper off the extreme bass and trebles too.

so, basically, the eq will sort of look like a soft-sloped "V" or sea-gull wings...

of course, the whole thing about having an eq is to tailor the sound to your personal tastes or requirements.

 

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

Ted,
I’m not chasing you around looking to counter everything you say, really I’m not... :b

typically, most people will boost the bass and treble, but not the mid's. they'll taper off the extreme bass and trebles too. so, basically, the eq will sort of look like a soft-sloped "V" or sea-gull wings...

This is what I less-than-affectionately call a “smiley face” EQ curve. In my opinion (and this is worth exactly what it costs you ) anytime you see this you can be sure the user has no idea how to use an equalizer. For instance, I know a guy who sets up this curve on every equalizer he gets his hands on – his home stere, his car stere, his guitar amp. Really, what are the odds that all these systems need the same EQ settings??
Juan, Mark,
You don’t really “set up” a 10-band equalizer like you do a parametric or 1/3-octave EQ, since it doesn’t have the capabilities to correct room problems.
However, a 10-band EQ can still be very useful as a sophisticated tone control, to adjust for program deficiencies. With response and sound quality of CDs all over the map, a little specific EQ adjustment can often make improvements. Of course, you have to have a good enough ear to determine where in the frequency spectrum adjustment is needed.
Playing around with the sliders can help you become familiar with the frequency changes an equalizer can introduce. A little experiment: With music playing, move each slider, one at a time in turn, slowly up and down to its limits, noting what changes in the frequency spectrum occur when the slider is moved, what is sounds like with that area exaggerated or deficient. Becoming familiar with the frequency spectrum will help you determine if program content has say, weak or exaggerated upper bass, if there is too much “sizzle” in the sibilants, if the vocals sound “dark,” etc.
Be sure you do this test with the system set to a moderate volume. Playing high levels and then boosting 8kHz 12dB is asking for a smoking tweeter.
Another thing you might look out for on this test: If you find a place where the slider doesn’t seem to make as much of a change as other places, this might be a area that could use a little boost to sound better. Likewise, if a slider seems to produce more severe peaks than others, it might be that a little reduction there is in order.
The moral of the story is to experiment and use your ears to learn how to properly use this simple equalizer. Eventually you can learn to identify problems that are between the fixed sliders, problems that are wider or narrower than the sliders can adjust - things like that. When you get to that point you could “graduate” to a 2/3-octave (15-band) EQ.
Best of all you can knowingly smile to yourself when you see someone set those smiley-face EQ curves.
Other things to keep in mind:
While a 10-band EQ is it’s fine for music, for the most part it is a bad idea to use them for home theater video programming. To begin with, EQs across tape monitor loops are incompatible with Dolby Digital processing; typically engaging a tape monitor loop will make the receiver default to Dolby Pro-Logic mode – you don’t want to watch your DVDs with the tape monitor on.
EQing two-channel Dolby Surround programming can be problematic as well, because tape-monitor connections place the equalizer in front of the Dolby Pro-Logic processor. As you may know, proper DPL steering is dependent on phase information, especially the (mono) rear channel, which is comprised of signals that are out of phase with the front channels. Since any equalizer introduces a certain amount of phase shift when the filters are boosted or cut, they can do strange things to the surround effects. I’d say if you do use your EQ DPL programming, make sure a minimal number of filters are used in the 100H-4kHz range, and any boost or cut amounts are small – only a 2-3dB at most.
Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[Juan Castillo]

Wayne, that kind of information is exactly what I was looking for. Aside from how to properly hook it up to my setup, which Ted did a fine job clearing up for me (Thanks Ted) Really good information that I would have had to really delve deep into the forums to find. The saying goes "You learn something new every day"... well, just reading here each day, I learn alot. Thanks Wayne. Your EQ knowledge comes only second to your soldering : )..

I will leave the EQ in place, but for the time being only use it while listening to my audio sources.

Dumb question, but would the same apply to my satellite watching, and occasional video? Meaning, is the signal still influenced negatively by the EQ in this mode?

 

[Ted Lee]

no problem wayne! thanks for clarifying my post.
i did mention that the whole point of having the eq is to customer tailor the sound, but (as usual) i like your explanation/clarification much better.

 

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

Thanks for the kind words, Ted and Juan.

Juan,

Is there a big difference in the quality of low budget EQ's?

It’s hard to say without extensive evaluation of them all, but I you can expect to find reasonably good performance in the $100-150 price range (for a 10-band - expect to pay less for fewer bands) suitable for use with a budget-to-mid-line hi-fi system. It’s not hard to build a decent 10-band equalizer, but as with most equipment, look at specs for THD and signal-to-noise ratio. S/N ratios especially are very important with an equalizer, as any slider boosted means lowering the noise floor at that frequency by the same amount. Thus it is important for the EQ’s S/N ratio to be better than the receiver.

IMO in this class and price range the thing to look for is whether or not it will pass a clean signal. A simple test: Play broad-band pink noise with a test CD and, with all sliders set to flat, switch the EQ in and out of the circuit (preferably with the tape monitor switch). If there a change in the tonal quality of the pink noise when the EQ is switched in, then it is not passing a clean signal.

Regards,

Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[Juan Castillo]

Wayne, thanks again. I will try the test tones suggestion, as I had a hard time finding documentation on the model of EQ I own. Either way, using it to learn more about this hobby is fun.