Why doesn't anyone ever mention Bag End

Discussion in 'Speakers & Subwoofers' started by Stephen Bort, Apr 16, 2004.

  1. Stephen Bort

    Stephen Bort Agent

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    My friend has had the Bag End Infrasub-18 for a few years now and it's easily the tightest 18-inch sub I've ever heard. It even claims to get down to 5 hertz. But in my couple on months here I've never heard of anyone talk about Bag End.

    Are there just so many sub companies out there that this one never comes to light?
     
  2. SethH

    SethH Cinematographer

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    I may be incorrect, but everything I've ever seen made by BadEnd is pro-audio gear. Does this mean it cannot be used for HT? No, but generally people stray away from it. Most pro-audio subs cannot get down low enough to handle HT, but if his really gets down to 5Hz that's pretty impressive.
     
  3. BruceD

    BruceD Screenwriter

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    response down to 5Hz is a joke (pure marketing bs), and is likely >30dB drop in SPL levels below 10Hz with lots (>10%) of distortion.

    Just not worth the money when you can get much better products for half the price.
     
  4. Stephen Bort

    Stephen Bort Agent

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    They do some HT.

    "response down to 5Hz is a joke"

    What about the thread about the Black Hawk Down scene and people counting the pulses on their DIYs. Is 5 hz impossible in something as small as a sub?
     
  5. Stephen Bort

    Stephen Bort Agent

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    I'd link directly to the sub, but their site doesn't work that way. If you wanna see it, it's at bagend.com under products --> home theater --> infra-18.
     
  6. Greg_R

    Greg_R Screenwriter

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    No, but Bag End's methodology involves heavy boosting via EQ and not reporting how the frequency response was tested. I could point to any speaker and say it plays a 5Hz tone... but at what SPL and distortion level?

    Any sub w/o a limiter (DIY, SVS, etc.) will allow you to count the sub vibrations at very low frequencies. Heck, you can use a 9V battery on the terminals of your main speakers and see them move in and out. The audio waveform is no different (just a lot faster oscillations and more sinusoidal).
     
  7. Edward J M

    Edward J M Cinematographer

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    http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...8200316533.pdf

    In Nousaine's standardized testing, the Bag End Infrasub-12 turned in a very lame peformance. It could only generate 73 dB @ 20 Hz @ 2 meters. See the hotlink for all the details. No, it's not the 18" model, but if the peformance of the 12" is indicative of the product line, I'll take a Pasadena.
     
  8. Stephen Bort

    Stephen Bort Agent

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    Thanks guys...I'm still pretty new to the technical side of subwoofers...where can I go to read more?
     
  9. Tom Vodhanel

    Tom Vodhanel Cinematographer

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    Hi Stephen,

    Tom Nousaine and Don Keele both reviewed 18" Bagend models in the mid to late 1990s for AUDIO magazine. If you could find copies of those reviews(and then compare the measured performance to other Nousaine/Keele reviews)...I think you'll enjoy the information.

    Don Keele even did a *power compression* test which was interesting. He measured the Infra flat to 8hz(as marketed)...but only at about 70dB. He gradually increased the volume levels and kept remeasuring the frequency response...and at common HT levels(100-105dB)...the Infra only had something like 32hz extension. Another way of thinking about that is...you just lost two whole octaves of response...just by using moderately loud(and very common) listening levels. The Infra measured very powerfully >30hz though...so in a small to medium room...keeping the levels at moderate to moderately loud...it should sound great.

    I can look up the exact issues of AUDIO those two reviews were in if you'd like?

    Tom V.
    SVS
     
  10. Stephen Bort

    Stephen Bort Agent

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    "I can look up the exact issues of AUDIO those two reviews were in if you'd like?"

    Thanks, but no need, really. If I did that I'd just be making my friend feel bad if I get an SVS 16-46 PC+... by the way, at 16 hz how many db does a 16-46 measure?

    I'd always envied the sub, but now that I think about it, he was on an Air Force base...the room he was in was about 9' X 11' ! No wonder it sounded so good.

    Still, it was tight for an 18 incher.
     
  11. David Barteaux

    David Barteaux Stunt Coordinator

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    I have this sub and >30 Hz it is very flat. This makes it a very good sub for mainly music. Below 30 Hz this sub will distort when driven loud at most HT movie levels. The only way to cure this is to turn the sub down, but then your not getting loud HT in your face SPL which is what you need with movies.
    Therefore in a small room it sounds better because it is not turned up very loud, and thus less distortion with
     
  12. Nathan W.

    Nathan W. Stunt Coordinator

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    A sub would have to be freakin' humongous like the driver in "Back to the Future" for you to feel 5Hz - you certainly won't hear 5Hz, let alone 20Hz.

    I took a BIC 12" sub and replaced the amp and driver with Dayton Audio components and use it for my computer's sound system. I downloaded a free spectrum analyzer with a sine wave and pink noise generator that can go down to 1Hz (anything below 5Hz you have to type in). It's funny to watch the sub driver move at 5Hz and even funnier to see it move at 1Hz. The Dayton amp doesn't filter out these ridiculously low frequencies. After seeing a driver move this slow, you get an idea of how huge a driver would have to be to get usable output at these frequencies. My sub has "response" down to 1Hz which just means it responds at that frequency, but the output is essentially zilch.

    If anyone wants that free analyzer, it's at trueaudio.com. I can't post a direct link to it. I'm too newbish to this forum and it won't let me.
     
  13. Robert_Gaither

    Robert_Gaither Screenwriter

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    Personnally I've always liked Bag End Infrasub and before Diy considered this or Paradigm Servo 15. This is still a good sub but unfortunately there are better cheaper of course it's been over two years since I've heard one so if they've revised I can't comment on the current line up.
     

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