TPM edge enhancement?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Randy Boecker, Oct 17, 2001.

  1. Randy Boecker

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    I've read lots of complains/concerns about audio with the TPM disc (which I also thought was a little low and lacking). But I also noticed a fairly large amount of edge enhancement, something I wouldn't have expected from Lucas. My monitor has been calibrated, and I even cranked the sharpness all the way down, but it was still very apparent.
    Anyone else annoyed by the judicious use of edge enhancement on this feature? Once I saw it, I couldn't NOT see during the rest of the film. I would have thought Lucas would have taken more care with this transfer.
    (I looked for a thread on this subject, so forgive me if I missed it)
     
  2. Brajesh Upadhyay

    Brajesh Upadhyay Supporting Actor

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    I noticed a fair amount of EE as well, giving the transfer a bit of an overbaked look. It'll be interesting to read Bjoern's findings.
     
  3. GlennH

    GlennH Cinematographer

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    Well, we've had many discussions here about whether the "ringing" seen on many discs is EE or not, whether it could be prevented or not, etc.
    I don't know the answers but I did see it in quite a few places on TPM last night, in the usual high contrast borders like buildings against a bright sky, etc. I also see the faint horizontal lines close to the letterbox border as on FORREST GUMP.
    However, while it would be nice if these effects were totally absent they did not significantly detract from the presentation in my opinion.
    (58" widescreen Pioneer Elite 610 - Panasonic RP91 prog-scan player).
    [Edited last by Glenn Heberle on October 17, 2001 at 02:54 PM]
     
  4. Richard Kim

    Richard Kim Producer

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    I noticed it very clearly on one of the buildings in the new air taxi scene.
     
  5. Keith M.

    Keith M. Second Unit

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    I noticed this ringing myself, but is it EE or simply the result of the overuse of CG and bluescreen filming process?? It seemed more obvious during scenes with very elaborate backgrounds...
    BTW, i was very impressed with the audio. All 7 channels were ALIVE!! It was probably one of the most aggressive uses of the rear back channels (EX) I have experienced so far. Understandable, considering this movie launched the EX sound format...
    In any case, despite the annoying Jar Jar, this is one of my top 10 dvds for overall HT enjoyment...
     
  6. rajiv

    rajiv Stunt Coordinator

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    The EE was very distracting for me. I have a Pioneer Elite PRO-610 RPTV and DV-38A DVD player. This particular DVD player is known for some red-blooming and that has never bothered me after calibrating my system. The EE was a big disappointment. Comparing the TPM with the "Mummy Returns", which is another DVD that has lots of special effects, TPM could have been better.
    Look at any sharp lines throughout the movie and there is a ringing effect that distracts to the point of hurting your eyes.
    Rajiv...
    [Edited last by rajiv on October 17, 2001 at 10:22 AM]
     
  7. Jeff Kleist

    Jeff Kleist Executive Producer

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    I watched TPM on the Scootplex 20ft backyard screen
    No visible edge enhancement
    What you're probably seeing is MPEG artifacting on hard edges, IE Simpsons season 1
    Jeff Kleist
     
  8. DaViD Boulet

    DaViD Boulet Lead Actor

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    MPEG mosquito noise from compression around hard contrasting edges and the halos from edge enhancement have different visible artifacts. Those who've seen the disc are not seeing a compression artifact.
    The Fifth Element SB disc is a good illustration of how these halos are not MPEG related (unaffected by the bit-rate or scene complexity).
    -dave
     
  9. Hubert

    Hubert Second Unit

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    Obviously I don't know what to look for because TPM looks incredible to me and I saw none of what you guys are referring to. I saw some slight shinnering in about 10% of the desert scenes, but that was it. Truly an awesome disc.
     
  10. Kwang Suh

    Kwang Suh Supporting Actor

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    TPM has some unbelieveable EE. It's like hyper-EE. There are some places where there's so much EE it looks more like a "bar" of white.
    Also, there is one scene with clear mosquito noise. But hey, why nitpick. [​IMG]
     
  11. JJR512

    JJR512 Supporting Actor

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    I guess I'll bite the bullet and stick myself out as the idiot.
    Umm...What is edge enhancement?
    ------------------
    -Justin "JJR512" Rebbert
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    Join our [email protected] Team! (Click here for more info.)
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  12. Ken Seeber

    Ken Seeber Supporting Actor

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    Peter Staddon quite emphatically stated on this board that "The Phantom Menace" received little or no edge enhancement.
    Whatever it is everybody is seeing, it probably isn't EE. Maybe we should concentrate on getting answers on exactly what the problem is first, then we can better figure out how to do something about it.
    Is this a problem of the transfer? Or is the ringing in the original source material, a byproduct of the over-use of digital backgrounds and other special effects?
     
  13. RobertR

    RobertR Lead Actor

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  14. bryan_chow

    bryan_chow Agent

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    Here's the picture I took clearly showing "hyper-EE":
    [​IMG]
    I mean, the guy has such a ridiculous halo he looked like Jesus.
    It is so ridiculous that in many scenes (especially on Tatooine) the letterbox border had a double-line due to EE.
    The picture was taken using an old digital camera, by hand with flash turned off for long exposure so it's not the best, but it still shows the problem pretty convincingly.
    Bryan
     
  15. Jeff Kleist

    Jeff Kleist Executive Producer

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    That's not a good example, it's obvious that was blown up to a large extent
    Jeff Kleist
     
  16. bryan_chow

    bryan_chow Agent

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  17. Kwang Suh

    Kwang Suh Supporting Actor

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    What's really odd about the EE is that some scenes will have absolutely no EE and look great, some scenes will have a portion of the screen with EE, and others have massive EE.
     
  18. Chris Maynard

    Chris Maynard Supporting Actor

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  19. bryan_chow

    bryan_chow Agent

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    quote:
    If this is true then I would not want to watch movies on your setup. It looks zoomed to me. That same shot may show some edge enhancement on it but looks a lot clearer on my rig.
    [/quote]
    Yes, I zoomed into a small section of the screen where the EE was particularly glaring.
    I don't see how that would affect the presence of EE? If it's there, it's there.
    And before you guys think that my picture is poorly setup, you can find some other screen shots I took:
    http://tachyonic.net/photos/
    And yes, like someone else said, some scenes on TPM are fine and appear to have no EE at all.
    Bryan
    [Edited last by bryan_chow on October 17, 2001 at 07:52 PM]
     
  20. RobertR

    RobertR Lead Actor

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    I'm getting the impression of people in denial about this..
    ------------------
     

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