Subwoofer to match with B&W 804s??,NOT SVS....

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by rodneyH, Jun 29, 2002.

  1. rodneyH

    rodneyH Supporting Actor

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    My father is looking to upgrade his JBL junk subwoofer and wants something reasonably priced and that will fit in the cabnit he has built in the home (about 23"h X 24"d X 40"w). The SVS is out of the question because of the size requirments (although he does love my SVS, and wants similar performance).

    Looking around the net, perhaps the Adire Dharma and the Hsu VTF-3 look to be some good options. ANY OTHERS OUT THERE???

    The room is fairly big, but he is NOT a big bass type of guy. He did listen to a 2 or $3,000 revel over the weekend and loved it (who wouldn't) but the price isn't right.

    Thank you for your help.
     
  2. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    Contact either Acoustic Visions or Rutledge Audio. Both places can custom build you a sub that will be able to best utilize the space avialable.
    Although unless it is the absolute only option, I'd recommend against building a sub into a cabinet as fixing its' location is usually not a good idea. Subs are very sensitive to room placement.
     
  3. rodneyH

    rodneyH Supporting Actor

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    ya, dustin, I don't think he wants to go custom like that, too many risks.
     
  4. Gregg Z

    Gregg Z Stunt Coordinator

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    Hi Rodney,
    For B&W's I would HIGHLY recommend either a REL Strata III ($1200) or REL Storm III ($1700). The are a perfect match. Check out www.audioreview.com for glowing recommendations on these two subs. They can be purchased at Tweeters/HiFi Buys in "textured black" or (yellow) cherry. If you want a custom color to match the 804's (ie black ash, red cherry, etc..) you will need to purchase from an authorized dealer. Since you are in CA, that would be Sumiko.
    Gregg
     
  5. Evan S

    Evan S Cinematographer

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    What about the ACI Titan II LE ($1200) at www.audioc.com? Great sub, very musical with high output. People compare this sub very favorably to the Rel subs above on Audioreview.com and it's priced considerably lower to the Storm with great looks.
     
  6. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    What risks are those rodney? Both guys running those two places will go out of their way to keep a customer happy. Both build extremely solid nicely finished cabinets. Both use drivers and designs proven by the DIY community.
    I'd find more risk going with your typical commercial sub. You have no idea how it is actually constructed (both these places will send you pictures of its' construction). Try getting a commercial sub manufacturer to give you T/S parameters and specifics on the enclosure?
    Although at the price range it appears you are talking about, these aren't as much of a concern. However at these price ranges you can expect a finish like this from either of these places:
    http://www.rutledgeaudiodesign.com/P1_1.jpg
    A low Q sealed Tempest could easily fit in that space and would provide excellent output and outstanding sound quality.
     
  7. rodneyH

    rodneyH Supporting Actor

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    Dustin, I guess "risks" was the wrong word. What I meant is, that, what happens if/when he moves, he doesn't want it built it like that, What happens if it didn't sound good in that location-you couldn't move it around to find the absolute best position (he wants it in the cabnet, but if it sounds a lot better somewhere else, then it will be moved), the 3rd reason is that is would probably be way more $$$, time, and hassle that he doesn't want to deal with.

    As for the REL and Titan, those were actually subs I was looking at, when I was and I decided to go SVS with full intentions to return it and get the Titan or REL, well it sounded so good (and sooo much better than my M&K) I couldn't return it (and I kind of wanted to since I think hte rels and titans look so much better, and I already had budgeted for it), but after getting the SVS, I couldn't do it. I guess what I am saying is, that there are others out there for better prices that are about as good for 1/2 the $$, also I don't think they would fit (too tall?) and they use 10" drivers that sound great for music but for movies in a large room, I have heard that they fade in that department just a little.

    The Dharma and the Hsu look like some great options though, the Dharma has a huge enclsure that would fit perfect, and the ports face the front, which is important in his application (any idea if/where the Hsu ports face??).
     
  8. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    Ok, I got ya now. But I'll just throw these thoughts out.

    The only hassles I can see are waiting for it to be built and shipping. For the price of a Rel or Titan LE I think you would be surprised what these guys can do.

    As for moving it around, I am suggesting a finished cabinet that could be moved were ever, but would be of dimensions that would make the best use of the cabinet if that space actually worked.
     
  9. rodneyH

    rodneyH Supporting Actor

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    Dustin, that sounds like a good idea, but my father really isn't the type to want to go through that. He actually use to own his own car stereo business (before it became so popular) and he use to build sub boxes for cars, so I don't think he could justify having someone comeout and do it, when he would just say "for that $ I could just do it myself" but when it came down to it, his time is worth too much, and would never get around to it.

    Which leaves us at buying a pre-built sub that could fit nicely in the cabnet and moved if needed. So far, the Dharma looks like it would fit very nicely in his space, and the Hsu would fit as well.

    any others??
     
  10. Karl L

    Karl L Agent

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    Hey Rodney, I use the VTF-3 with my N804's and couldn't be happier. The thing goes oh so low, and even more importantly for me is very musical to boot. The perfect compliment for the N804's imho. Your in San Diego as well, yeah? I bought mine locally for $750 from a joint out in National City.
     
  11. rodneyH

    rodneyH Supporting Actor

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    Karl, I am in Mission Viejo (1 hr north of SD), tell me more about your set up and other subs you were looking into?? Also, where did you buy it for $750??

    1 last Q, what direction do the ports face??
     
  12. Karl L

    Karl L Agent

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    The place I bought the VTF-3 at is called Jeff's Sound Values. They seem like a bunch of really good guys, wouldn't hesitate to do business from them again. However, the first sub I brought home from them was d.o.a. Had to haul it back down there for a replacement that I have had no problems with. Its a forward firing sub, that I have up against a side wall, close to my listening position. It blends very well with the N804's, probably even more so if I had the space to better position it. I originally had my mind set on getting an SVS, but after reading a couple of posts heaping praise on the musical nature of the VTF-3, and then getting a chance to hear what it was all about in person, decided to go that route instead. It replaced an Energy ES-8 which has been in my system since the beginning. I did not get a chance to demo any other subs so you still may want to look into the Dharma to see how it stacks up to the Hsu. The rest of the speakers in my setup are an Htm1 center, Def Tech bp2006tl's on the sides, and a Def Tech clr2300 in the rear. I'm currently using a Pioneer 49tx as a pre, and a 200w 5 channel Theta Dreadnaught as my amp.
     
  13. Evan S

    Evan S Cinematographer

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  14. ManojM

    ManojM Stunt Coordinator

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    Rodney,
    I will also recommend the use of the REL Strata III or Storm III. If the 804s are cherry, then the cherry REL is a very good match for color. I use the Strata III with my 804s to fill out the bass, and it is never intrusive, and fast enough to keep up comfortably with the B&Ws.
     
  15. John A. Casler

    John A. Casler Second Unit

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    Rodney,
    If he wants SVS performance to fit in that space, then the HSU VTF-3 is a good reccomendation and would be 4th on my list.
    My first choice however would be the VMPS Larger SUB which is 23 x 32x 19" (HxWxD)and would just barely fit height wise.
    http://www.vmpsaudio.com/sub1.htm
    There is no sub previously mentioned that could match the output or musicality of this one. It lists for $699 and add $200 for an AudioSource monoblock (or other) and it will excell in most every area. (and that is beyond "ANY" commercially available sub under $3000)
    Second choice would be the little brother, The VMPS Original Sub at 20 x 27 x 17" (HxWxD) and $499 will also prove an incredible performer on music and "high impact" theater.
    Tied for second is the SuperNova MKIV 12". Dimension are 15" x 15" x 15" Listing at $1699 this Sub will match or best most subs in its size and price category. It also has a remote control so you dont have to pull the sub out and tilt it over to make adjustments to the sound between music and movies. (let me tell you how convienent that is especially if your father has his inside something like that cabinet)
    http://earthquakesound.com/serv02.htm
    If "I" was going to put the sub in my system, these would be my choices (or maybe the 15" SupeNova if the budget allowed for it).
    Funny, this is what I "DO" have.
    If you want power, these subs will literally (and I mean literally) make your walls move!!!
    You want to hear what resin YoYo Ma has used on his bow for a particular recording, these subs will do it.
    Plus they will fit.
    Happy hunting
    John
     
  16. Greg_R

    Greg_R Screenwriter

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  17. rodneyH

    rodneyH Supporting Actor

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    John, that "Larger subwoofer" looks very interesting. I wonder if 1" could be cut off the bottom of the cabnet (or is there a port under there that would screw it up??), I also wonder if one of the Plate amps with a built in crossover and 280W would work with it??
     
  18. Michael R Price

    Michael R Price Screenwriter

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    I second the recommendation to get a Tempest. It's cheaper and I honestly don't see a practical disadvantage to it. Whether you or someone else builds it doesn't matter. What does it cost, $700 with the amp? Its performance would likely exceed that of the VTF-3 and compare to or beat the Larger sub. I am not too familiar with the VMPS products however, given the lack of comparative reviews. Also, you could get it custom built to fit your space (although you probably would have better performance placing the sub somewhere else). You could also go with a sealed design, which would give you probably better sound than any other sub mentioned (while still probably matching their output). I'm sorry, my DIY bias is showing. Just wanted to throw in my opinion.
     
  19. Tom Vodhanel

    Tom Vodhanel Cinematographer

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    >>>There is no sub previously mentioned that could match the output or musicality of this one. It lists for $699 and add $200 for an AudioSource monoblock (or other) and it will excell in most every area. (and that is beyond "ANY" commercially available sub under $3000)
     

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