Sean Connery in Lord of the Rings and Matrix?.... (1 Viewer)

[Robert Anthony]

"Don't forget, LOTR started filming shortly after The Matrix came out, so Hugo Weaving would probably have been cast before the film's release, before anyone knew that Matrix would be a hit and the Smith would be such a great character."

As far as "they shouldn't have cast Weaving" goes, I think the above probably explains it best.

Hey, you could make the same argument for McKellen as Magneto, too. And the same response by Matthew would fit just as well.

Thing is, I think both actors have managed to craft completely different characters, VERY distinctive from the ones in the comic-book style movies they do, and they did it well enough that for a large part of the moviegoing population (probably, It's not like I"ve polled anyone) it's not a big deal beyond a quick little whispered MST3K style one liner during the movie.

 

[Dalton]

Carlo,
I guess the Matrix just isn't really that popular around here. There are only a few people i know who liked it (i know that sounds wierd)besides me.

 

[Rob Gillespie]

I don't think I really had any issues over the casting for the Rings films. I remember back in the early days - before the shooting started - when gradually the list of cast members grew and being astounded by the talent they were bringing on board. I think for most of the roles, they really couldn't have got any better.

I suppose the one I did have doubts over was Liv Tyler but when I saw her in the first film those doubts died out. The sequence with her before Rivendell is one my favourites throughout the entire trilogy. She may not have many lines, but the gal acts though her eyes.

 

[Colin Jacobson]

All these arguments about casting don't make much sense to me, for they seem to imply that everyone in LOTR should have been completely unknown prior to it. I'd seen many of the actors in other projects, but that didn't cause problems. I'm not sure why Weaving seems more distracting than the others...

 

[Carlo_M]

Quote:
I'm not sure why Weaving seems more distracting than the others... My thought on why this is:

1. He is a prominent character in another very popular trilogy out at the same time.
2. That trilogy appeals to a similar demographic.
3. His voice and delivery is very unique and immediately identifiable.
4. His looks (features) are very distinct and there's not much makeup hiding them (as opposed to the long hair and huge prosthetic nose for McKellan).

 

[Rob Bartlett]

Quote:
Hell, Connery could have played Aragorn, who's 87, right?
Yeah, but then they would have had to recast Arwen with someone who wasn't too old for Connery.

Weaving is far from the most distracting if, such a thing exists in the trilogy.

It's amazing how in this entire thread, only one person remembers the issue with Liv Tyler. Tolkien fans were frightened, if not livid over her casting. You have to realize, Liv Tyler comes from the same kingdom as Alicia Silverstone, and considering how Alicia was not even up to a Batman film, imagine how we might react to her being cast in the movie? While no one in LOTR was truly an A-List actor, it's an outright lie to say no "name" actors were cast, especially since at that period Tyler was considered more "name" then "actor".

Elijah Wood is no stranger either to blockbusters (Deep Impact) and geekcentric films (The Favulty.) In fact, Bernard Hill and Miranda Otto have appeared in big hits (Hill in Titanic and Otto in What Lies Beneath.) Yes, they weren't in the same "demographic" as The Matrix but once a movie gets 200 million worth of viewers, "demographic" is a concept that goes right out the window.

And I think McKellen and Weaving are fairly comparable. So McKellen ahd a beard? Weaving had glasses in one movie, pointy ears in another. Plus, McKellen was playing stately men of world-weary wisdom, even though Erik Magnus used that wisdom for evil. While Smith and Elrond are both technically men in power, Smith is more slight and beauricratic, while Elrond is the elven equivilent to a monarch. Actually, when I saw FOTR, I wasn't thinking "Agent Smith" in his appearance, but more "The Scorpion King".

If you found Weaving distracting in the role, that's your perogative, but to single him out is to hunt for ponies where there be elephants.

By the way, in Rhode Island, I always got the impression of The Matrix being pretty megapopular. But no one I know is very good at telling one actor from another.

 

[TheLongshot]

Quote:
It's amazing how in this entire thread, only one person remembers the issue with Liv Tyler. Tolkien fans were frightened, if not livid over her casting. You have to realize, Liv Tyler comes from the same kingdom as Alicia Silverstone, and considering how Alicia was not even up to a Batman film, imagine how we might react to her being cast in the movie? While no one in LOTR was truly an A-List actor, it's an outright lie to say no "name" actors were cast, especially since at that period Tyler was considered more "name" then "actor".

Except that Liv Tyler did some nice work in "Stealing Beauty". I don't think just because they were in an Aerosmith video together, that you can say that they are the same actingwise. I actually never had a problem with Liv being cast...

Jason

 

[Andy Sheets]

I don't recall any particular uproar over Liv's casting because it was the rumor that Arwen was being changed into a warrior princess that was the real issue and therefore it wouldn't have mattered who played her.

 

[Carlo_M]

I too remember that most of the uproar for Arwen was the character change to make her a warrior (and indeed she was shot fighting at Helm's Deep (Two Towers EE DVD featurette) but it was thankfully cut from the final and EE cuts of the film.

Re: Hill and Otto being in "blockbusters" - sure they were, but they were not the *centerpieces* in those movies, like Agent Smith in the Matrix.

And again, what gives Weaving away is that slow drawl delivery. "You shall be the fellowship of the ring...Mr Anderson!"

 

[Marvin Richardson]

Quote:
And again, what gives Weaving away is that slow drawl delivery. "You shall be the fellowship of the ring...Mr Anderson!" That doesn't really make sense. We always said "Welcome to Rivendell...Mr. Anderson!"

 

[Robert Anthony]

I remember the Liv Tyler controversy very well. As a matter of fact, whatever skepticism there was about the adaptation kinda got it's jumping off point when she was cast as Arwen. And then when news came that they were going to put Arwen in Helm's Deep, a lot of fanboys online lost their mind. They didn't like her as Arwen to begin with, then to find out she was going to be "Liv Tyler, Warrior Princess" they pretty much peed themselves. Liv even mentions this in the supplementals on Two Towers, and how angry fanboys poison pen rantings on the internet drove her to tears one day as she was reading through.

But yeah, the biggest problems with casting weren't Hugo Weaving or Ian McKellen, but probably Liv Tyler and Sean Astin, actually. to them it was the RockStar's daughter and Rudy, and they hated it.

 

[Richard Travale]

yet both were pretty amazing in their roles.

I think the problem with Weaving (although I have no problem at all) is that his voice is only like that because he is doing his "American" accent. People forget that he is pure Aussie. It would be kind of funny to hear Elrond say "right mate, 'ow 'bout another shrimp on the barbie".

**my apologies to our Australian brothers/sisters on the forum **

 

[Carlo_M]

You know what, it is pretty curious that they didn't give the Elves some kind of British accents.

 

[Rob Gillespie]

Quote:
it is pretty curious that they didn't give the Elves some kind of British accents.
What accents would you call them then? Orlando Bloom is English, Cate and Huge are Aussie but their accent wasn't in the films. Liv even put on a 'posh' english tone. Sorry, but I don't see what accent you could call them except Brit, or at least Brit-based.

 

[Carlo_M]

I guess I should say "all of the elves" as Hugo was using his "American" voice as was pointed out earlier. Since he natively is Australian, why not just let him use the same type that Cate used? That way he wouldn't sound so much like Agent Smith (which was the point of my musing about the accent, not as a blanket criticism towards all the elves though it may come across that if not read in the proper context).

 

[Rob Gillespie]

I don't in all honest, think that Hugo does use his US voice in LOTR. It's not a 'pure english' voice, but I would have said it's a bit closer to that than american.

Either way, whether he sounds like Smith probably wasn't a concern at the time it was filmed. I'm not really sure why people get hung up on it.

 

[Andy Sheets]

Quote:
I remember the Liv Tyler controversy very well. As a matter of fact, whatever skepticism there was about the adaptation kinda got it's jumping off point when she was cast as Arwen. And then when news came that they were going to put Arwen in Helm's Deep, a lot of fanboys online lost their mind. They didn't like her as Arwen to begin with, then to find out she was going to be "Liv Tyler, Warrior Princess" they pretty much peed themselves. Liv even mentions this in the supplementals on Two Towers, and how angry fanboys poison pen rantings on the internet drove her to tears one day as she was reading through.
See, the way I remember it was that the original problems with Arwen began before Liv had been cast. What happened was that the casting sheet for Arwen had leaked out, and while I don't recall the entire paragraph used to sketch out her character, the phrase "hellbent for leather" was distinctly prominent (I don't know if you can find this on the net anymore because New Line suppressed it soon afterward). And then there was the auditioning script that also leaked out, an early version of the scene in which Aragorn and Arwen "break up", which ended with Arwen angrily cursing Aragorn with the slur of "you--you MAN!" Those things were what really got the ball rolling. After Liv was cast, and then the reports of her fighting at Helm's Deep came out, things certainly didn't improve, but it was the entire approach to the character that had really set the book readers against the production's handling of Arwen.

 

[Carlo_M]

Because to some people, the Agent Smith voice (and looks, Hugo is very distinct, unique looking) takes them out of the movie for a bit. Here you are lost in Middle Earth, going along for a ride, when lo and behold, Agent Smith greets them at Rivendell.

Now this clearly doesn't affect everyone equally. If it doesn't affect you, then all the better. But I can certainly understand when some people say that it was a bit distracting.

To his credit, I think Hugo is a fine actor, and if the Matrix movies hadn't been made yet, would have been fine for Elrond. Unfortunately the two trilogies are contemporaries, and appeal to pretty much the same demographic.

Very few people have the ability to resist typecasting as powerful as Agent Smith (Harrison Ford is the only example I can think of - being able to distance Indy from Han).

 

[Robert Anthony]

I happen to think he did it very well. Better than Indy and Han, actually. Those two characters are pretty similar, when you break them down. Elrond and Smith ave VASTLY different. As a matter of fact, to completely flip it, I know people who didn't even recognize that Agent Smith and Elrond were played by the same person.

I understand your view, tho, and for some, it's just how you described it. For me, I think not only did he delineate very clearly between the two performances, I don't witness any bleed from one into the other at all.

Andy: I don't remember that Hellbent for Leather thing, but I think I vaguely remember the "you MAN!" thing. Thank God there was extensive re-writing.

 

[Colin Jacobson]

Quote:
1. He is a prominent character in another very popular trilogy out at the same time.
2. That trilogy appeals to a similar demographic.
3. His voice and delivery is very unique and immediately identifiable.
4. His looks (features) are very distinct and there's not much makeup hiding them (as opposed to the long hair and huge prosthetic nose for McKellan).


The first three could obviously apply to McKellan and the X-Men flicks. In regard to the last, I don't thing the makeup hides McKellan terribly heavily as Gandalf - I think he's actually more recognizable as Gandalf vs. Magneto than Weaving is as Elrond/Smith. I think Weaving looks VERY different in the two flicks. I feel most people might see Weaving and think that he looks familiar, but they're not going to immediately connect him to Smith...