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New Star Wars Trilogy Announced (Rian Johnson) (1 Viewer)

Tommy R

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We can agree to disagree. There was an overall plan with the original trilogy, it's in Lucas's original notes. A plan is not details. A plan is "a son redeems a father." That's what the original trilogy is about. Lucas knew that on day one (see Star Wars Poster Book #2, 1978).
Well 1978 isn’t exactly day one, as the first movie was already out by then and planning of the second was underway. It’s been well documented that Lucas came up with the Vader being Luke’s father twist once the second film was being scripted. The outlines I’ve seen from those gigantic Rinzler books are very vague and don’t show any real plan for the original trilogy. Maybe somewhere he did have a “a son redeems a father” theme he put on a note at some point and wanted to explore, but he also had a fixation on having characters that were twins that he shoe-horned into Return of the Jedi by making Luke and Leia the twins, which, like Vader being Luke’s father, was not at all something he planned when making the first movie. One of my favorite bits of trivia is that Luke’s last name was still “Starkiller” when they were filming the movie in Tunisia and was changed to Skywalker at some point later in production.

But I digress. The point of comparing the OT and ST is that the lack of planning CAN be not-a-problem. I actually don’t think the ST is really ALL that bad as a whole. If TFA just had a more original story thread to follow it would have been better. And Carrie Fisher’s untimely death was a legit real life problem to deal with with TROS. I don’t think the final product was all that bad and I enjoyed it way more than TFA, but I’ll admit it probably would have been better with Carrie and Trevorrow. They still would have all felt like very different films from each other, but the OT all feel very different if you put them under even a little scrutiny.
 

TravisR

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We can agree to disagree. There was an overall plan with the original trilogy, it's in Lucas's original notes. A plan is not details. A plan is "a son redeems a father." That's what the original trilogy is about. Lucas knew that on day one (see Star Wars Poster Book #2, 1978).
How would Lucas have had a plan about a son redeeming his father from day one when Darth Vader being Luke's father was definitely a retcon for The Empire Strikes Back? Even if Lucas had that planned that (and he didn't), how is a vague idea like "A son redeems his father" considered a plan?

Also, Star Wars Official Poster Monthly #2 talks about Vader and Obi-Wan fighting on a volcano and Vader being a cyborg but not about a son redeeming his father.
 

Wayne_j

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The OT was greatly helped by George Lucas overseeing all 3 movies. This way even after he changed plans the movies were all coming from the same person.

In the Sequel trilogy it seems like Rian Johnson went in a different direction than JJ would have so then JJ tried to move things closer to the way he had in mind. And trying to fit in previously unreleased footage of Carrie Fisher definitely didn't help.

If you actually know you are going to make a trilogy you might as well write a treatment for the entire trilogy so anyone taking over can be on the same page.
 

Museum Pieces

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Even if Lucas had that planned that (and he didn't), how is a vague idea like "A son redeems his father" considered a plan?
It's a plan because it's an ending that keeps them on course. Margaret Mitchell never wrote an outline for GONE WITH THE WIND, but she wrote her last scene first. That way she knew where she was headed. It's the same idea. And if it's not poster book 2, it's one of them. Also, in The Power of Myth, Joseph Campbell talks about when Lucas chatted with him about the ending of the original trilogy (in the 70s). If you dig, Lucas had a plan. He had an ending. Disney never did. I don't think anyone denies it. Nine was going to end one way, then Fisher died. So even when they had the second or third ending after 8 was done, it got changed. There was never a plan. Kennedy would have us believe they intended to bring back Palpatine all along, which is patently absurd. Listen to KK for five minutes and it's abundantly clear what was going on.

BTW, Lucas's plan for his sequel trilogy was to flip his original plan. The plan for his 7, 8, and 9 was going to be "a father redeems a son." Which Disney could have easily done, except they convinced themselves they had to kill Han in the first movie, so that bright idea ended any hope for that plan. Also, any sane plan would have at least one scene with Han, Luke and Leia together--and that never happened, not once in three movies.

"What a wasted opportunity," Mark Hamill said on Twitter recently.
 
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Sam Favate

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Also, Star Wars Official Poster Monthly #2 talks about Vader and Obi-Wan fighting on a volcano and Vader being a cyborg but not about a son redeeming his father.
I have to admit, having read that circa 1978, I had a lump in my throat when I saw Revenge of the Sith and that sequence played out pretty much as Lucas described it 28 years earlier.
 

ManW_TheUncool

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Let me get this straight.

Y'all are just arguing exactly how bad and ultimately why (or what made) the sequel trilogy sucked (so bad), right? And regardless of who's more right (or wrong), it still sucks (so bad)... and y'all won't wanna go see the new-upcoming-some-day, supposedly unrelated, RJ SW trilogy that might not (or probably will not) actually happen anyway, right?

Just making sure I got the most important finer points and nuances right... so I can properly ignore all y'all geeky-est of SW fanatics while I move along and smell some roses at the other end of the galaxy (that's perhaps in an entire other universe), LOL... :lol:;):D:laugh::laugh::laugh::cool:

:popcorn:

Party on, my fellow HTF dudes... :cool: :cheers:

_Man_

PS: I definitely avoid getting into "just how bad the sequel trilogy sucks" w/ my now-early-20's son since I've mellowed out some (and found them alright enough, except the awful retcon ending of IX of course) and already went thru that w/ him (from opposite end) for the prequel trilogy, which he enjoyed (quite) well enough since he was just a grade-schooler when he first saw them (on DVD), LOL. :lol:
 

Tommy R

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and y'all won't wanna go see the new-upcoming-some-day, supposedly unrelated, RJ SW trilogy that might not (or probably will not) actually happen anyway, right?
For the record, I’m 100% on board with a Rian Trilogy. I’ll be heart broken if he never gets to do it. I have absolute faith in him with Star Wars! 😃
 

Museum Pieces

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I have to admit, having read that circa 1978, I had a lump in my throat when I saw Revenge of the Sith and that sequence played out pretty much as Lucas described it 28 years earlier.
He first outlined it in 1974.

Whatever the particulars, Lucas put DECADES of thought and writing into these movies. By their own admission, Iger and Abrams put no time into an overall plan to link the three sequel movies. My entire point is that it is unfair to blame the fans for the recent dearth of Star Wars movies; that is due to Disney's own bungling.

To put it another way: the making of the original trilogy has been put under a microscope. Lucas acquits himself well. To my knowledge there isn't a single licensed book on the making of the sequel trilogy. Plenty of art books, yes, but no books that chronicle the making of the trilogy (or any Disney SW movies, for that matter). Why? Because the making of the trilogy (and other movies, like ROGUE ONE) was a disorganized mess. It would be an embarrassment to the studio to chronicle it.

Blame them all you want, but Johnson's trilogy being shelved, and Disney's reluctance to move chronologically forward in time with movies or TV shows, is not the fans fault. They're an easy target for Disney's colossal ineptitude with the sequel trilogy.
 
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TravisR

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Let me get this straight.

Y'all are just arguing exactly how bad and ultimately why (or what made) the sequel trilogy sucked (so bad), right?
"Y'all" equals one person and it isn't me. While TROS certainly wasn't the finest hour in Star Wars, I still enjoy the sequels overall and think The Last Jedi was the best thing in Star Wars since The Empire Strikes Back.
 

MattBradley

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I do think if they had planned ahead to somehow have Palpatine return by the time of TROS, they really could have done some cool things leading up to that moment in the other two movies. Vader's spirit could have been shown in The Force Awakens talking to Kylo even though it'd have been revealed later to just be Palpatine "in Kylo's head".
 

dpippel

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Star Wars Fans.jpeg
 

Sam Favate

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^ I don’t dislike TROS but I agree that the Palptine revelation comes out of nowhere and if they really wanted to reintroduce him, there could have been some cool foreshadowing.
 

Osato

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This thread should be retitled to rumors and speculation?

Is there any
Plans for a new Star Wars movie at this
Point
 

Wayne_j

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I think SOLO pretty much killed Star Wars as movies for now. The problem with SOLO is that nobody wanted to see a Han Solo movie without Harrison Ford when they just saw him in that role a couple of years earlier. The movie itself was pretty good.
 

ManW_TheUncool

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I think SOLO pretty much killed Star Wars as movies for now. The problem with SOLO is that nobody wanted to see a Han Solo movie without Harrison Ford when they just saw him in that role a couple of years earlier. The movie itself was pretty good.

Agreed for the most part... though Rise of Skywalker came after and still made big (enough) $$$ despite being one of the worst SW flicks (for me, mainly because of the awful retcon ending... as I guess I've become more forgiving than most wrt SW movies)...

I guess the vast majority of such franchise fans seem to care more about fan service than an actually good film. Basically, they'd probably have to make a SOLO movie to be like the recent Spiderman flick, which I personally felt was quite blah, essentially committed character assassination of sorts in ways most fans apparently don't care, etc and just a general mess, especially in light of what we already got from Into the Spider-verse, a far far better movie that also introduced the multiverse... but hey, it scored big on the fan service side, so most just lapped it all up and gave the mediocre-to-awful rest a pass...

_Man_
 

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