Denon 6700 or 4700+ an amplifier? (1 Viewer)

[George LL]

Hello all!

I’d like some thoughts on a decision I’m making. I can get a Denon avr-x6700h for $2,500 that has 11 channels of built-in amplification. This would be enough to power my 7.1.4 system with a single box. On the other hand, I can purchase a Denon avr-x4700h With 9 internal amps for $1,600 and add an external amp for the same total price as the 6700 (I am thinking Outlaw’s 5-channel for $650 or their 7-channel for $950).

I know the 6700 will process 2 more channels but that is moot for me as I have no plans to add speakers.


I’m wondering what your opinions are on these 2 choices? Which way would you go?

 

[JohnRice]

What are your speakers?

 

[George LL]

What are your speakers?

My 7.1 base layer is all SVS Ultra (ultra towers, ultra center, ultra surrounds). My sub is also a very large SVS. The 4 Atmos speakers are Yamaha NCIS800WH.

 

[JohnRice]

Personally, I would go with the 4700 and the Outlaw 5000 to power the front 3 and side surrounds. The 4700 does process 11 channels, doesn't it?

 

[George LL]

Personally, I would go with the 4700 and the Outlaw 5000 to power the front 3 and side surrounds. The 4700 does process 11 channels, doesn't it?

It does process 11 channels. The 6700 will do 13 (with an external amp) but I don’t have 13 channels in my system.

 

[JohnRice]

It's unlikely most people would ever have any need to go beyond 11 channels (7.x.4) and I'm a big fan of the benefits of sufficient, high quality power, so I'm solidly in the X4700H + Outlaw 5000 camp.

 

[Sam Posten]

I can't tell you what YOU should do, I can only tell you what _I_ did and I would do it again. I am a fan of having it all in one box and not pushing features that I want built in off to external devices. I went with the 6000 series. Now, the downside is that if I want to upgrade to 2020 capabilities (VRR for example!) I have to upgrade the whole box. I'd still make the same choice.

 

[JohnRice]

I'm amused that the argument Sam has often made in opposition to using an external amp is the "outrageous" cost. Yet, when the cost for that route is actually lower, that door remains shut.

We've been going back and forth on this for years, so I just had to chime in.

 

[George LL]

That was another benefit to doing the 4700. Using a 4700 plus that Outlaw 5000 is less money than the 6700. Thing is, if the 6700 had some slam-dunk feature (aside from two extra amps), I don't mind spending.

 

[JohnRice]

I do both. My good system is all separates, so external amps are a requirement. There have been times when money was scarce and I had to drive at least some of it with a receiver, and the sonic sacrifices were surprisingly obvious. Also, because of that approach, I never worried about how difficult speakers were to drive. So I went with what sounded best. Every channel other than Atmos (which are seriously frequency limited) has from 300 to 800 WPC. Real world watts, as in, all channels can be driven simultaneously to that level. The result is a relaxed awesomeness. The impact, when needed, is impressive. It's the relaxed power, which probably sounds like a contradiction, but it isn't. It's about dynamics and optimal control of the speakers by the amp. A lot of people think an amplifier is just a source of power, but the interaction between amp and speakers is extremely complex and precise.

 

[Sam Posten]

I'm amused that the argument Sam has often made in opposition to using an external amp is the "outrageous" cost. Yet, when the cost for that route is actually lower, that door remains shut.

We've been going back and forth on this for years, so I just had to chime in.

Do I contradict myself? Very well then I contradict myself. I am large, I contain multitudes.

I don't think I'm contradicting myself here tho and you are comparing apples and oranges. On one hand you are talking about having external amps for 11+ channels. That's a non starter. On the other you are talking about having the complexity of managing channels that are not under the integrated amp's direct control.

 

[JohnRice]

On the other you are talking about having the complexity of managing channels that are not under the integrated amp's direct control.

Sam, I'll just leave it with that quote you typed and state unequivocally that you have NO IDEA what you're talking about... when it comes to this particular topic. That sentence has no basis in reality.

Like I said, leaving it at that.

 

[Sam Posten]

Sam, I'll just leave it with that quote you typed and state unequivocally that you have NO IDEA what you're talking about... when it comes to this particular topic. That sentence has no basis in reality.

Like I said, leaving it at that.

So you can manage your amp assignment without managing in the receiver?


And with the 3000/4000 series you can only set it to externalize 1 pair of speakers, so the suggestion to put LCR on an external makes even less sense?

 

[JohnRice]

Like I said, you don't understand what you're talking about and I will simply leave it at that. Confirmation bias won't accomplish anything.

I am curious about that video and what you're misinterpreting about it, or if it's inaccurate. So, I'll watch it later.

...and any or all of the channels on the 3600 can be sent to an external amp. Not just two. You're misunderstanding something about that.

 

[JohnRice]

Sam, after some thought, I've decided I simply will not discuss this topic with you, hopefully ever again.

If you wish, ask @Dave Upton , but I'm done.

 

[John Dirk]

To the OP, as is obvious, opinions do differ on this topic. If you have a decent sized room or want the best overall sound quality, I would personally recommend dedicated power. Any integrated receiver's output per channel will decrease dramatically as more channels are driven. Dedicated amps do not have this limitation. I would, however, caution you to read this before settling on Outlaw Audio.

 

[Dave Upton]

I'll be getting a sneak preview of the D-Sonic 11 channel amp in the next week or so. It was much delayed but it's nearly ready. Exciting times now that you can have a full atmos setup with external amplification, and no extra chassis!

 

[JohnRice]

I'll be getting a sneak preview of the D-Sonic 11 channel amp in the next week or so. It was much delayed but it's nearly ready. Exciting times now that you can have a full atmos setup with external amplification, and no extra chassis!

Dave, is that equal power to all channels, or (hopefully) more power to three of them? Or... as D-Sonic is known to do, does it have optional configurations?

 

[George LL]

Thank you! I think I will go with the 4700 and buy an external amp. This will also allow me a future upgrade path for a better processor/receiver since the amp should hopefully last quite a bit longer than the processor/receiver.

 

[George LL]

To the OP, as is obvious, opinions do differ on this topic. If you have a decent sized room or want the best overall sound quality, I would personally recommend dedicated power. Any integrated receiver's output per channel will decrease dramatically as more channels are driven. Dedicated amps do not have this limitation. I would, however, caution you to read this before settling on Outlaw Audio.

Thank you! I think I will go with the 4700 and buy an external amp. This will also allow me a future upgrade path for a better processor/receiver since the amp should hopefully last quite a bit longer than the processor/receiver.