Building my first Sonotube Sub.....questions

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Ron-P, Mar 23, 2002.

  1. Ron-P

    Ron-P Producer

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    I've decided to start gathering materials up next weekend.
    My main question is what is the smallest size sonotube I can use with a single 12" driver?
    I've been going thru all the sonotube links and it is overwhelming.
    Any tips or direct links for a virgin sonotube sub builder?
    Peace Out~[​IMG]
     
  2. Cam S

    Cam S Screenwriter

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    You could probably get away with using a 12" diameter sonotube, you would just have to be a little creative with the endcap that the driver will be on, and the tube will have to be alot taller than if you used a 14-18" diameter tube.
     
  3. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    You'd also have to mount the legs on the sides of the tube as there won't be room on an endcap. I would recommend 14"-18". To get 120L(just an example you need to deside on a driver and what kind of sound you want before you pick the actual value) volume would be 28" tall using 18" diameter tube and 49" tall using 14" diameter tube. Still have to add endcaps, legs and baseplate to these heights.

    Have you put any thought into which driver you plan to use, or what your design goals are?
     
  4. Cam S

    Cam S Screenwriter

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    what about having the sub mounted on top of the sonotube, and the port (if it isn't sealed) at the bottom with the feet?
     
  5. Ron-P

    Ron-P Producer

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  6. Jack Gilvey

    Jack Gilvey Producer

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    I think it would be a pain to go with a 12" tube, and the height could get out-of-hand pretty quickly depending on alignment. Is 16" OK?

    Maybe we could start with basics like budget, size constraints, performance goals (reference capable?), room size, stuff like that. All those sonotube links can indeed be overwhelming, but it is a good place to start.
     
  7. Harry Lincoln

    Harry Lincoln Stunt Coordinator

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    I built 2 shiva sonotubes using 16" tube, I think any smaller would be quite hard to fit the legs on the bottom endcap.

    -----------

    what about having the sub mounted on top of the sonotube, and the port (if it isn't sealed) at the bottom with the feet?

    -----------

    This would make the sub top haevy, If you use a small tube you reduce the footprint of the sub and increase the height, which makes the fact that its top heavy more of a concern.

    Harry.
     
  8. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    I guess I should have expanded my design goals to resemble Jack's post :p)

    Those are the key questions that will allow some more meaningful suggestions.
     
  9. Pete Mazz

    Pete Mazz Supporting Actor

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    Ron,

    One off-the-wall thought would be using your 12" platform for your second row of seats as the enclosure for a sub. Nearfield seating positions can negate most room interaction problems. Just a thought!

    Back to on-the-wall-thoughts...

    I would lean towards a 15" driver. You will have more choices for alignments that can achieve reference levels. Some of the newer 15s can be used in relativeley small enclosures, and if you're willing, or intended to use an EQ, can make for excellent candidates for the driver.

    If your room has an attic or another usable space, you may also want to consider an IB (Infinite Baffle).

    Pete
     
  10. Ron-P

    Ron-P Producer

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  11. Pete Mazz

    Pete Mazz Supporting Actor

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    An IB is basically a huge sealed sub using, in your case, the attic as the box. The advantages are ease of box construction (small manifold recessed into ceiling), sound quality, power efficiency, low cost. Disadvantages are cutting hole in ceiling, transmitting sound into attic.
    ThomasW is the Infinitely Baffled
    guy, along with some of the other sub humans.[​IMG]
    Pete
     
  12. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    http://home.att.net/~tom1/page100.html
    If you didn't catch that link on the baffelled forum the pictures will mean a lot more than words.
    With that info my personal reccomendation would be an Adire Tempest in a net ~280L enclosure tuned to 16-18hz using a 6" diameter port (just remember I have one [​IMG] so I'm a little biased). If you used 24" sonotube you could keep the height under 48" including legs and a base plate. For power get the Parts Express 250W plate amp (supposed to be shipping with the boost disable, but if not, it just takes the swapping of two resistors to do so.
    Costs would be $142 for the Tempest and $135 for the plate amp plus shipping. Add whatever you spend on construction and finishing materials to that. So unless you get really fancy with the finish should be able to keep it well under $500.
    Expect performance that would at least equal if not exceed an SVS Ultra.
     
  13. Jack Gilvey

    Jack Gilvey Producer

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    Well, the sky's the limit in that room with those limitations.
    My first suggestion would be a dual-Tempest IB like Rich Kraus' using your attic as the enclosure as Pete suggested . Not only would I feel safe in saying that it'd be the best bass you've ever heard, but output levels in that size room would likely be much more than you could ever use, down to frequencies you didn't even know existed. [​IMG] Even with amp, should come in well below budget.
    If, after checking out those IB projects, you find it's not do-able, I'd second Dustin's recommendation of a Tempest-based tube sub with the PE amp. Again, the extension and output levels would be world-class. No reason to limit yourself to a 12" driver if you don't have to.
     
  14. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    Damn it, I'm seeing things again. I swear you wrote I don't have an attic above the green room.

    If you do, I agree with jack, dual Tempest IB would be my first choice. You just have to buy MDF for the manifold as well as trim and grille material for the opening. So construction costs will be very low.

    Add a 2ch amp with moderate power output (100-120Wx2 at 4ohms would be lots) and you'll be in bass heaven.
     
  15. Ron-P

    Ron-P Producer

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    Thanks guys. Looks like I'll give it a shot using the 250watt subwoofer amp from Parts Express and the Daton 12" Titanic Tempest 12" subwoofer. Is this a good combo? I want to try the free standing sub first, before I go the IB route.
    All in all, looks like I can sneak buy with a cost of under $400.
    Peace Out~[​IMG]
     
  16. Jack Gilvey

    Jack Gilvey Producer

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    What do you like about that driver over the other suggestions?
     
  17. Ron-P

    Ron-P Producer

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    You know Jack, I just noticed the suggested Tempest. I did not see that over at PartsExpress. Not sure what I was thinking or why I picked that subwoofer. I'll go with the Tempest as suggested. Do you know where to order it from. I just ordered the amp although it is out of stock until the 26th. No big deal as it will give me a bit more time to get the remaining materials.
    With this amp/tempest combo, do you know what size sonotube I'll need?
    Peace Out~[​IMG]
     
  18. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    You can order the Tempest (which by the way is a 15" driver) from Adire Audio or Acoustic Visions:
    http://www.adireaudio.com/
    http://www.acoustic-visions.com
    If you go through Adire, go through the link on HTT and you get a 5% discount, makes it 142.50 + shipping. Kyle at Acoustic Visions is $150 including shipping.
    As for dimensions, we need to know if you height limit is exactly 48" or if there is some play. Do you want to put a base plate on it (like SVS) if so how thick. Do you want to use 24" sonotube or would you really prefer to go smaller in diameter. Are you going to put a wood finish on the endcaps, or are you just going to paint the MDF (can effect overall height by an inch or two).
     
  19. Jack Gilvey

    Jack Gilvey Producer

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    The Titanics are great, but I do think that, with the size tube you've alotted and your speaker/amp budget, the Tempest is easily your best choice. The Tempest is made by, and available from, Adireaudio.com. Also you can order them from Kyle at Acousic Visions and Ampman.com.

    In that room, you can aim for max extension and not give up SPL, so I think I'd go 300 liters tuned to 16Hz. With 24" Sonotube, you'd be somewhere around 45" tall with endcaps, driver, etc.
     
  20. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    I'll expand out Jacks suggestion a little bit more for you. If you used 1.5" thick endcaps (1" of each inside the tube, 1/2" out side the tube and painted), 4" long legs, and a 1.5" thick base plate. You would use the following dimensions.

    24" dia sonotube cut to 45" length

    6" dia port cut to 22 14/16" length

    So 45"+1"+4"+1.5" would total 51.5" total height.
     

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