Buffy Season 4 cover art (1 Viewer)

[Dan Rudolph]

Joss directed 4 episodes in season 4, which is as many as anyone except James Contner (who did 6). I'd say he's in a good position to say what OAR is. Besides, unless we have a statement from the creators saying otherwise (ie X-Files), it's logical to assume that OAR is however a show was presented in its native market.

In the case of Angel s2, we know they wanted to do widescreen, but WB wouldn't let them do their broadcasts that way. Whether they shot wide anyway is unknown AFAIK.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

I'd much rather have the opinions of the individual season 4 directors & cinematographers on their intended OAR.

This is Joss' show, what he says goes. He says Buffy is 1.33:1, it's 1.33:1. Deal with it

 

[Marc_Sulinski]

Still, do you really watch a show with big black bars on the sides on your 16x9 TVs? Seriously? I think the zoom is not that bad....you still see all that you're supposed to see. Am I a bad person because I think so....?

I can't believe that I am seeing this attitude on this forum. I thought everyone was here because he/she believes in OAR and does not care if there are black bars on the screen. When you watch a widescreen (2.35:1) movie on your TV, aren't there black bars there too? why are horizontal bars OK and vertical bars bad?

 

[Kenneth_C]

For a few comparisons of 4:3 vs. 16:9 framing in Season 4, go to http://www.buffythevampireslayer.de/dvd.htm (About halfway down the page.)

The crowd fills the frame in the second shot, whereas in widescreen you can see a lot of empty space on the left, occupied by only one guy (whose light-colored wardrobe really looks out of place).

And The Gentlemen are much more imposing and ominous, as they dominate the full-frame composition, without all the empty street space seen in the widescreen shot.

Buffy in 4:3

 

[PhilipG]

This is Joss' show, what he says goes. He says Buffy is 1.33:1, it's 1.33:1. Deal with it

I've always considered Mr Whedon a bit of a J6P, based on quotes from him in the past [flame suit on]. However, since he directed four of the episodes, 4:3 is OK with me - at least for those four. I don't rate JW as a writer at all, but I think he's a pretty good director.

And by the way, I don't have to "deal with it", since there are the R2/4 discs. I'll be getting the R1. In the back of my mind it'll annoy me that certain episodes may (stress may) not be the director's intended AR, but I'm damned either way, knowing that the widescreen versions are incorrect in at least four cases (not to mention the PAL speedup). This would have been a perfect time to utilise pan and scan on the fly...

But hey, it's only BTVS, and Riley season at that.

 

[AlexSchwarz]

@Marc_Sulinski: I'm sorry I offended you. If I'm not entitled to post here anymore, it's alright.

Horizontal bars are okay with me. In fact, I even defended them from my girlfriend. Vertical bars, however, are a different story. The whole picture becomes rather small and they look pretty TV-generated, unlike the horizontal ones. I can't explain it better.

I honestly don't see the problem, though. The zoom is marginal, I do it just a little so the people look natural. But it would seem I'm not enlightened yet.

 

[Ted Todorov]

Can someone post a complete run down on ARs for Buffy & Angel DVD sets in R1, 2 & 4? Are R2 & R4 always the same? Was R4 censored or only R2?

Thanks,
Ted

 

[David Lambert]

FWIW, the end of the show is in sight, and therefore the end of the DVD sets. I just read over on CNN that it's official: Gellar is quitting after this season. It looks like Season 7 will definately see the show's Final Hour .

 

[Martin Rendall]

John,

Those who want the 16x9 version just to fill their 16x9 screen need to seriously take a long hard look at themselves in the mirror.

You want your screens filled and be damned with the OAR...does this sound familiar to you? Nothing personal, but if you have this mentality your really no wiser than the Wal-Mart shopping Joe and Jane who are trying to destroy OAR forever.

Sigh. There is such a thing as taking something too far. I view cinema and (some) television as art form. As with other art forms, the viewer is an equal participant, if not a more important participant than the artist. If the viewer perceives something a certain way, it is that way. After all, art is nothing without people to appreciate it. And it means something different to each person.

OAR is important. Personal enjoyment of the material is also important. Statements like yours really don't aid your cause. They just make you sound fanatical, and makes me wonder about the value of what you preach.

The whole J6P argument is condescending and counter productive.

In the best world, where OAR and public desires conflict, both should be offered. Fortunately, this is happening a fair bit. With Buffy, people who shop out of region have the choice. And that's good.

Martin.

 

[Adam_ME]

Can someone post a complete run down on ARs for Buffy & Angel DVD sets in R1, 2 & 4? Are R2 & R4 always the same? Was R4 censored or only R2?

Here's a brief rundown:

Region 1

Buffy Seasons 1-4: 1.33:1 aspect ratio, uncut
Angel Season 1: 1.33:1 aspect ratio, uncut

Region 2

Buffy Seasons 1-2: 1.33:1 aspect ratio, uncut
Buffy Season 3: 1.33:1 aspect ratio, 2 episodes are edited for content
Buffy Seasons 4-5: 1.78:1 aspect ratio, uncut
Angel Season 1: 1.33:1 aspect ratio, uncut
Angel Seasons 2-3: 1.78:1 aspect ratio, uncut

Region 4

Buffy Seasons 1-3: 1.33:1 aspect ratio, uncut
Buffy Seasons 4-5: 1.78:1 aspect ratio, uncut
Angel Seasons 1-2: 1.33:1 aspect ratio, uncut
Angel Season 3: 1.78:1 aspect ratio, uncut


Angel Season 3 is due out in Region 2&4 on March 3 and 18 respectively. Buffy Season 6 hasn't officially been announced yet(its release is expected in May), but I imagine it'll be in widescreen.

 

[Inspector Hammer!]

Martin,

I AM fanatical when it comes to OAR, your just now figuring that out about me!?

I speak it the way it is, their is no grey area for me. If the creators intend and compose for a certain ratio, that's the ratio it should be viewed in, television show or otherwise.

This may not be percieved as a popular opinion and does sound elitist, however i've always been of the opinion that we the viewing public, and even the studios for that matter, should not possess the right to alter the original intent of the creators of a film or television program. Only the original creative team behind said medium should have that right, unfortunatly they do not, this not a perfect world I agree.

My problem here lies with the fact that we have people here who are wanting the 16x9 editions of Buffy simply because they have 16x9 screens and want them filled, even though the show was intended for 4x3 by Joss Whedon.

This is not supporting OAR, but a personal desire to see something in an altered and incorrect form simply to appease their equipment, in this case, the AR's of their screens.

Let the mind rule the art, not the equipment the art will be viewed on.

Bottom line, for me anyway, the OAR of ANY medium is not open to interpretation or percieved desire. Buffy was intended for 4x3, the 16x9 editions are incorrect, this is fact.

I'm one of the biggest supporters of OAR that your likely to come across here, I sound fanatical at times yes and I apologize, however I only sound like that because I hate altered forms of art by outside forces with a passion and burning hatred so freakin deep it's not even funny.

I just took my chill pill, i'm cool now.

 

[Robert Ringwald]

Joss may not have directed each and every episode. But he's always on the set, so I'd imagine every director working on the series would know of the 4:3 rule.

 

[Robert Ringwald]

http://www.alanna.net/screencaps/

Season 5 clips show the widescreen versions. They're is dead space on the sides in almost every single shot.

Even on the episodes not directed by whedon

 

[Inspector Hammer!]

Yep, they knew Robert. The series would be a mess of mismatched ratios if this were not the case. Either that or the directors knew that every other episode was 4x3 and they shot it that way on their own just to remain consistant.

 

[Martin Rendall]

John,

I can appreciate all that. The one thing I never want to see is a lack of desire for OAR by the public cause OAR DVD's to not be made anymore. Beyond that, to each their own, IMHO. On a side note, I could sure use a chill pill now and again.

Martin.

 

[Inspector Hammer!]

Martin,

I got a whole bottle if you want some, but be careful, they give you cotton mouth somethin aweful!

 

[Christian Preischl]

Region 2

Buffy Season 3: 1.33:1 aspect ratio, 2 episodes are edited for content

A slight correction there: Only one episode was edited for content (Dead Man's Party), and this only applies to the UK version, all other R2 countries got the episode uncut. The edits were in the scenes where Giles hotwires his car, and later when a teenager gets his neck broken at the party. Both cuts were compulsory according to BBFC standards which makes the fact that the neckbreak is intact in a Season 5 featurette rather infuriating. Ah well, I've got the uncut German set anyway.

Chris

 

[Christian Preischl]

double post, sorry :b

 

[Geoff_D]

For some bizarre reason, the individual video (in the UK S3 vhs boxset) containing DMP had to be rated at 12, not 15, which meant that the neck-break had to be cut under the BBFC's compulsory guidelines. As for the hotwiring, it wouldn't be allowed for any other rating apart from an 18 (as the recent cut in the 15-rated dvd release of Lucky Stars proved). And due to the BBFC's ridiculous stance on future releases, the vhs cuts had to remain for the Buffy dvd set. But aside from one jump-cut when Giles hotwires the car the episode is perfectly watchable, as you still know exactly what Giles has done. And the fixed book packaging kicks ass!!

 

[Adam_ME]

My bad. I knew there were 2 edits. I just didn't know they were in the same episode. Oh well, that's why I bought the R4 version. I do love the book packaging, but I really hate censorship.