Adire Audio Dharman...more bang for the buck than any other non-DIY sub out there? (1 Viewer)

[Bob_A]

Have you guys seen the Tom Nousaine data on the Adire Audio Dharman?

From Adire Audio's website:

We sent a Dharman to legendary reviewer Tom Nousaine to measure. After all was said and done, here's the results of the 10% SPL tests:

Average SPL 25-62 Hz: 107.9 dB

Average SPL 20-62 Hz: 105.9 dB

Bass Extension: 20 Hz @ 96 dB SPL

Maximum Output: 114.6 dB SPL @ 32 Hz

Here's the 10% THD limit SPLs Tom measured in his large 7500 cubic foot room:

20 Hz 96 dB SPL

25 Hz 102 dB SPL

32 Hz 114.6 dB SPL (system at maximum)

40 Hz 111.8 dB SPL (system at maximum)

50 Hz 108.1 dB SPL

62 Hz 103.1 dB SPL

Tom summed it up: "This system has excellent output especially at this price point. Both output and extension put the unit in the top quartile of subwoofers without regard to cost." None too shabby for a sub-$600 subwoofer!

You can compare this to the others on the data list:

__________________________________________________ _________

STRYKE HE15 proto-type 115.3 / 16hz~99 / 25hz~106

VELODYNE F1800 - 111.9

20-39cs - 109.5 / 20hz~91dB / 25hz~105.8dB

VELODYNE FSR15 - 109.1 / 16hz~90.1 / 25hz~103.1

MISSION 700as - 108.1 / 25hz~102

Paradigm PW2200 - 108 / 20hz~84 / 25hz ~104dB (112.8dB peak)

VELODYNE HGS15 - 107.7 / 16hz~89.1 25hz~102.1dB

Paradigm Servo15 - 107.3 / 27hz

VELODYNE SPL12 - 107.1 / 20hz ~90 /25hz ~ 99

HSU RESEARCH TN25(w/250w) - 107.1 / 30hz

HSU RESEARCH VTF-2 - 107.1 / 20hz~9325hz~99dB

Cerwin Vega cvt300s - 107 / 16hz~80db / 20hz~92(112.4dB peak)

KLIPSCH KSW300 - 106.0 / 25hz~92 *

Cerwin Vega LW12 - 106.0 / 20hz~89

POLK 650 -105.9 / 25hz~90

Infinity 1.2s - 105.5 / 20hz ~90 / 25hz~95

BW asw1000 - 105.4 / 25hz~92.4 *

MK mx125 mkII - 105.3 / 20hz 89 / 25hz 95

VELODYNE ct150 - 105.3 / 20hz~82(111.4dB peak)

JBL D112 - 105.2 / 25hz~95

KLIPSCH KSW12 - 104.9 / 25hz~90

Boston Acoustics PV800 - 104.4 / 20hz~85

Infinity interlude100 - 103.5 / 25hz ~ 94

BW asw2000 - 103 / 29hz *

PSB Subsonic6 - 102.7 / 25hz~94

Sound Dynamics rts1200 - 102.1 / 25hz~92(110.9dB peak)

Infinity IL100s - 102dB / 25hz ~94dB

VELODYNE ct120 - 101 / 20hz~87

MK - mx105 -100.6 / 25hz~86

ATLANTIC TECH 272 PBM - 100.5 / 20hz~85

INFINITY hps250 - 100.2 / 25hz~82(112.8dB peak)

KLIPSCH LF10 - 100.1 / 25hz~90

PSB subsonic 3i - 100 / 28hz *

MISSION ms70asa - 100/32hz~92dB

SUNFIRE Jr. - 100 / 25hz~95

VELODYNE VLF810 - 100 / 25hz~91

Canbridge - 100 / 20hz ~82dB

POLK PSW350 - 99.8 / 25hz~82

VELODYNE FSR12 - 99.7 / 20hz

JAMO E 8sub - 99 / 25hz~ 86dB

VELODYNE VA1012 - 99 / 29hz

JBL PB10 - 99 / 25hz 82

POLK RMDS-1 - 98.6 / 25hz- 77

VELODYNE FSR10 - 98.4 / 20hz

BW asw2500 - 98 / 25hz~86dB

ENERGY ES12xl - 98 / 28hz *

Paradigm PDR10 - 98 / 25hz

PHASE tech power8 - 98 / 25hz~84

Polk psw250 - 97.3 / 32hz~91

ATHENA S3 - 97.0 / 25hz~87

Energy S8.2 - 97 / 25hz ~82

VELODYNE CT80 - 97.0 / 25hz~81

MIRAGE frx s10 - 97 / 25hz~84

JAMO sw505 - 97

Klispch KSW10 - 96.9 / 25hz~85

TANNOY PS110 - 96.8 / 20hz~71 / 25hz~84

CANTON AS25 - 96.8 / 25hz~80

MK V-1250thx - 96 / 25hz~86

Atlantic technology 4.5 - 96 / 25hz~82

ATHENA S2 - 96 / 25hz~87

ACI titan - 96dB / 25hz~80

PSB alphasubzero - 95.2 / 32hz~88

Aura Lss-107A - 95.2 / 25hz~73

Celestion cswII - 95 / 25hz~78

GALLO MPS-150 - 95.0 / 25hz~86

ENERGY ENCORE - 94.4 / 25hz~78

ENERGY XL8 - 94 / 25hz~78

POLK PS-120 - 94 / 32hz -no SPL given

Wharfedale Modus - 93.1dB

Paradigm PD8 91.4 / 25hz~73dB

MK k9 - 90.1 / 25hz~77

Cerwin Vega hts15 - 89 (107 from 40-100hz) / 39hz

ATHENA P1 88.5/ 32hz~85.5

-----------the following use a 25-50hz range----------

Based on the data...the Dharman seems like a bargain for a sub-$600 subwoofer. Maybe the most bang-for-the-buck that you can currently find with a non-DIY subwoofer? What do you guys think?

 

[JerryW]

Yeah, it's a monster, especially for

 

[ColinM]

I'd have to consider my labor to be worth $15 per hour, and it'd take me about 8 to do it right, I'd expect.

$600 - $120 = $480 for materials.

Driver = $130

Amp = (?) $200 ?

Materials = $30 - 50 including finishes

Maybe $380 + ?

So for an extra $100 and a phone call I can have it delivered, plug-and play. Money back g'tee,

Sounds like a deal!

 

[Jack Gilvey]

Here's a thread on this sub and this test. You'll notice the conversation was steered away from the actual data at points for the sake of semantic discussions, so there's lots of wading to do.

 

[Kyle Richardson]

Yes, the Dharman is an excellent value in consumer subwoofers anywhere near its price range. Basically, the performance of a Velodyne HGS15 for A LOT less money!

Kyle Richardson

Acoustic Visions

 

[Bob_A]

Can anyone tell me...how come nobody talks about this sub???

 

[Tom Vodhanel]

The adire looks to be a great unit,pretty much what everyone expected output wise.

Of course Bob didn't bother to post the response measurements that TN measured...so it's hard to compare the response to other good units in the same price range. And TN also mentioned the grille began to bang against the driver a dB or two from max output....but Bob didn't post that either.(but I see Bob decided to use MY list to make some point here...typical) So you're looking at about the same measured output as the HSU VTF-2 before the driver bangs inbto the grille. From what I remember, the VTF-2 had a big advantage in response performance too.

Of course several subs on the list are represented by very old test data now. The 20-39cs has been improved extensively,and the VTF-2 has a new driver and some amp mods too(the servo15 and titan are two others that have been improved). Whereas the adire numbers are extremely recent...so I would factor that in.

Being close to the performance/cost ratio of the HSU is a good goal to shoot for though...well done.

TV

 

[Bob_A]

There is always a catch when it comes to Adire Audio, isn't there Tom? I've never seen anyone provide response data charts for any of those other subs when comparing them on these forums. In that older monster thread, Dan Wiggins pointed out what could have led to the problem, and basically assured us that there were no problems with the frequency response of the subwoofer. And since when have you claimed "ownership" of a data list? Is that list patent-pending? That is news to me. I've seen probably at least a dozen people reference "your" data list on various forums...and I have never seen you jump on their back. If I can recall, one of the reviewers also mentioned something about some (grill?) noise with the SVS. So sure, you can ultimately always find faults with a product. As for how much some subs have been improved...sure, even Adire has probably been trying to improve their sub...but this is clearly something we cannot quantify. Going strictly by the data (as many, including yourself, have been known to do in the past), it would take dual SVS 20-39CS's ($1200?) to match the Adire Audio Dharman at 20Hz...not bad for a sub-$600 subwoofer

 

[Jack Gilvey]

Anyone interested should read the thread for the FR information or see the Dharman page at Adire.

BTW, Tom Nousaine did notice a small amount of grille rattle just before full SPL output between 20 and 40 Hz; it's less than it was before, but still if you're looking to listen at extreme levels, it may be best to remove the grille.

That's the info. from Dan W. on the "grill noise".

 

[Tom Vodhanel]

Bob,the sad part is your using the fine adire product for your current agenda against svs. You got spanked by another forums moderator for your classless posting style in a debate with me..and the next day you are the new cheerleader for a svs competitor....lotsa class bob.

there's not really a need to provide response charts because all the data is PUBLISHED bob. Unlike the adire data of course.

you questioned Ron's integrity at AVS recently because he pulled a quote from a PUBLISHED review to post a the website. Here,you take numbers from a website that has ERASED half of TN's measurements and inserted their OWN response curve! But that's ok...and Ron is *misleading* people simply because of your new agenda against SVS now.

Improvements are easy to *qualify* Bob,as both SVS and HSu have outlined them extensively.Of course,if you have an agenda...then you won't care about fairness in these comparisons.

JG, ok...so the adire would have about the same measured output as the vtf-2 then...before you run into this issue. Both the HSU and the 20-39 extended to

 

[Bob_A]

Tom, I didn't even mention SVS in my initial post. Why are you trying to turn this into an issue about SVS? Your accusations against me are just not true. I have never questioned anyone's integrity. I think they understand this at HTS, and they have given me privileges to post again. If you think that I have an agenda against SVS, then you are sorely mistaken. If you have any further personal questions for me, feel free to email me.
So...back to ADIRE AUDIO...seems like a bargain to me...and it looks great too!
http://www.adireaudio.com/rpd/dharman.htm

 

[Michael R Price]

I think the measured response of the Dharman was something like 49-120Hz +/- 3dB... but that doesn't seem right, and I think they sent another sub for Nousaine to measure. Any word on those results? I'd think the Shiva would extend into the 18-20Hz range in a box of that size. Also... is the very high output at 20Hz (sans grill noise) because of the additional port area? (I think it has 2 3" flared ports.) And didn't SVS correct that 'issue' in the CS+ series with 3 3" ports?... There was a very big discussion about this a while ago, I think.

 

[Bob_A]

You are correct Michael...apparently that is not right...I believe that Adire has measured the response as -3db at 21Hz.

 

[Steve Zimmerman]

Hey, Bob! Are you thinking of buying an Adire? Go for it, dude. But I have a bit of advice for you first:

(1) Make sure you find out if that sub will sound good with your current receiver. Receiver matching with that sub is CRUCIAL, as I understand it.

(2) Regardless of what the manufacturer recommends, buy two subs and put 'em in opposite corners. Stereo bass, doncha know.

(3) Oh yeah, online purchases are a crapshoot. I mean sheesh, dude, don't you have any stores in your area that sell subwoofers?!?!

Good luck on the subwoofer purchase and please do report back with your findings.

--Steve

 

[Bob_A]

Very clever Steve...very clever. First of all, if I someday do purchase an external sub, I will almost certainly use it primarly for movies, and I will use it to effectively extend the frequency response of my system and to add shake down real low. I do not need to have "stereo" external subs because I already have built-in "stereo" subs. As for matching of components...I feel that it is not really necessary to match subwoofer with electronics. As for purchasing online...I was referring to main channel loudspeakers, not external subs. If you have any other questions, feel free to email me.
Now...back to Adire Audio...

 

[John Kotches]

Bob,

Don't forget that the SVS (listed as 20-39CS in the list) outperforms the Adire in every objective category and can be delivered (with purchase of an amplifier from parts express) for comparable price.

So, yeah the Dharman is good, but the SV 20-39CS measured better.

Regards,

 

[Bob_A]

John, going strictly by the data (which has been done many many many times in the past), it would take about 2 SVS 20-39's to match 1 Adire Audio Dharman at 20Hz. Also...this TN data is presumably on the 20-39 with Sampson amp...which costs $799 if I am not mistaken...a full $200 MORE than the Adire unit (which means that the SVS 20-39 with Sampson amp is roughly 33.3% more expensive than the Dharman). I am certainly not knocking SVS...I am sure that it is a fantastic product...but I am just curious why it seems that no one talks about Adire Audio, even though it seems to be a bargain.

 

[John Kotches]

Actually I posted the number for Nousaine at the AVS Forum thread before I realized they were hidden with no SVS reference just the model designation.

However, you still have not reconciled how this purchase (vs. a typical speaker) is not a crapshoot when ordering direct.

It would appear you have different standards for different manufacturers - which is fine so long as this is clear.

I notice you've shied away from posting a topic like this at the other board.

Regards,

 

[Tom Vodhanel]

>>>John, going strictly by the data (which has been done many many many times in the past), it would take about 2 SVS 20-39's to match 1 Adire Audio Dharman at 20Hz.

 

[Bob_A]

John, you are way off-base...my arguments hold for any manufacturer. Email me and we can discuss it. End of story.

Tom, this is true...based on the data, both products seem to be excellent performers. I really have no idea why some people seem to think that this is an anti-SVS thread. I have complimented Ron and Tom about their products and customer service in the past. In this thread, the main thing I was wondering about was why it seems that no one talks about the Adire Audio Dharman.