Spider-Man: No Way Home (2021) (2 Viewers)

[Ejanss]

And I never really understood the animus towards Affleck's DD film. I didn't love it, but I liked it. In the pre-MCU world of superhero films, it did a pretty good job adapting the comics. Hell, I even thought Elektra wasn't nearly as bad as its reputation would have it (though to quote Opus, "Lord, it wasn't good." Both films were at least better than Tim Story's two FF movies -- which is admittedly a low bar to hurdle.

Oh, I remember: This was right around the same early-00's time as the celebrity-news crowd all went nuclear over calling Gigli one of the "Worst films ever made", simply as a big tantrum against the offscreen Ben Affleck/Jennifer Lopez shenanigans at the time--
Even though Daredevil didn't seem as self-indulgent a film, Affleck still got fan-flack for it, and that ran smack into the comic-movie fan audience starting to be disappointed that FF, the Ang Lee "Hulk", and the Nic Cage "Ghost Rider" weren't carrying the banner that the first X-Men and Spiderman movies were.
A perfect storm of disgruntled fandom, and then the fans who were disappointed that Jennifer Garner's character of Elektra wasn't the cool ninja-babe from the comics.

And it's still a better movie than the Netflix version, since all the Netflix Marvel Universe has the curse of 10's TV:
It's trying so hard to be "cinematic" when it isn't, it tries to hammer us with Serious Writing and Acting by being dour, depressing, overwritten and bleak. That may get Emmy's, but it sure ain't fun.

 

[Adam Lenhardt]

There is a wide audience of MCU film fans who have never seen the Netflix shows. (I am included in that group.). So while I like Charlie Cox and have absolutely no problem with him being in the movie, they would need to be very careful about how to introduce him in a way that makes sense for people who haven't met that character before.

While everything in the MCU movies up through "The Avengers" is canon in the Netflix Marvel series, the fact that multiple actors from them have been cast as other characters in "proper" MCU productions leads me to think of them not as part of the MCU. I wouldn't be surprised if Cox's Daredevil is presented as being from another Earth in the multiverse.

And somewhere in between, we were supposed to get the passive-hostile feminists-vs.-sitcom humor of Disney+'s "WandaVision" series to help explain all the loose ends about Multiverses, and get Scarlet Witch and Vision to team up with the Doc.

Instead, we'll get snotty jokes from comics who thought June Cleaver and Laura Petrie were the same housewife, and some snarky Millennial jokes about how All Sitcoms were laughtracked Brady Bunch and Full House.

I didn't realize you'd seen "WandaVision" already, to have such concrete opinions about it!

 

[Chip_HT]

There is a wide audience of MCU film fans who have never seen the Netflix shows. (I am included in that group.). So while I like Charlie Cox and have absolutely no problem with him being in the movie, they would need to be very careful about how to introduce him in a way that makes sense for people who haven't met that character before.

It wouldn't be that hard to bring him in naturally. Spidey swings through Hell's Kitchen and stumbles across Daredevil in the middle of a fight in an alley. Or Peter Parker needs to hire a lawyer. Actually...that probably makes the most sense. He needs a lawyer to help with the secret identity thing, and Matt Murdock has experience in that area.

 

[Chip_HT]

Hell, I even thought Elektra wasn't nearly as bad as its reputation would have it (though to quote Opus, "Lord, it wasn't good." Both films were at least better than Tim Story's two FF movies -- which is admittedly a low bar to hurdle.

Nah, Elektra's at the bottom of the non-MCU Marvel movies for me (mainly because I have no intention of watching the FF reboot). I remember sitting in the theater, thinking we were near the end of the movie and glanced down at my watch to find it wasn't even an hour into it. The next half hour was pretty painful.

 

[Sam Favate]

Netflix's Daredevil is among the very best comics adaptations ever done. It's often said that what makes the MCU so successful is respect for the source material, and the Netflix shows have a lot of that. The reason there is such a push to get the film division to continue to use these actors (Cox, Kristen Ritter as Jessica Jones, Mike Colter as Luke Cage, Jon Bernthal as the Punisher, and - to a lesser degree - Finn Jones as Iron Fist, not to mention all the great supporting casts, such as Vincent D'Onofrio as the Kingpin) is because they nailed it. Replacing any of those actors would inevitably lead to unfavorable comparisons. There is no reason the Netflix characters, as well as Agents of Shield, can't be brought into the MCU.

Having Cox in Spider-Man 3, even if he's just Peter Parker's lawyer, is a big first step in that direction.

Also, Affleck's Daredevil wasn't bad, but it wasn't that good either. And the Netflix show at least had the sense to cast an actress who was not American as Elektra.

 

[TravisR]

...Jon Bernthal as the Punisher...

Bring back Lundgren!

 

[Sam Favate]

Bring back Lundgren!

He played a villain in one of the later seasons of Arrow. He was good too.

 

[Ejanss]

I didn't realize you'd seen "WandaVision" already, to have such concrete opinions about it!

They've been showing us enough clips--well, the same TWO, over and over--to make us realize it's being made by people who don't know the difference between June Cleaver, Laura Petrie or Samantha Stevens, and thought they all vacuumed in pearls and aprons.
And, even more unforgivably to a classic-TV nut....didn't even appear to want to, so long as a shameful pop-cultural legacy was being righteously "punished" for its crimes.

...Look, just skip the angry Millennial humor, guys, and just cut to the franchise-ready Dr. Strange sequel already!

It wouldn't be that hard to bring him in naturally. Spidey swings through Hell's Kitchen and stumbles across Daredevil in the middle of a fight in an alley. Or Peter Parker needs to hire a lawyer. Actually...that probably makes the most sense. He needs a lawyer to help with the secret identity thing, and Matt Murdock has experience in that area.

In the comics, Spidey, Daredevil and Luke Cage (and sometimes Wolverine, who's just a cycle ride away upstate) are B-team "local" Avengers, since they operate in NYC, and at one point were allowed to form their own citybound "New Avengers" B-team if anything threatened Manhattan.
Well, except for Daredevil, who still operates as a private-sector vigilante like the Punisher, but at least he gets to attend the meetings occasionally.

Nah, Elektra's at the bottom of the non-MCU Marvel movies for me (mainly because I have no intention of watching the FF reboot). I remember sitting in the theater, thinking we were near the end of the movie and glanced down at my watch to find it wasn't even an hour into it. The next half hour was pretty painful.

The insistence for ten years that we "had" to have a Black Widow movie--just because Paramount couldn't figure out why Iron Man 2 disappointed at the box office, and thought the mainstream audience "really" wanted to see more of Scarlett Johansson in tight outfits--has already coined the term of "Elektra syndrome":
Back when Fox didn't know whether box office justified their stubborn promise of doing an official Ben Affleck DD sequel anyway, and finally thought, F this, the fans just wanted to see more of Jennifer Garner.

 

[Ejanss]

Bring back Lundgren!

No way: Forget Netflix, Ray Stevenson in "Punisher: War Zone" IS the MCU Punisher.

(It's just too bad he couldn't have had a better movie, as by that point, we'd given up on low-budget pre-MCU Lionsgate movies after the Thomas Jane/John Travolta Punisher.)

 

[TonyD]

They've been showing us enough clips--well, the same TWO, over and over--to make us realize it's being made by people who don't know the difference between June Cleaver, Laura Petrie or Samantha Stevens, and thought they all vacuumed in pearls and aprons.
And, even more unforgivably to a classic-TV nut....didn't even appear to want to, so long as a shameful pop-cultural legacy was being righteously "punished" for its crimes.

You don’t think that’s part of the joke?

 

[Sean Bryan]

It’s posted in the Doctor Strange thread, but should be mentioned here as well that Kevin Feige confirmed that Spidey 3 and WandaVision tie into The Multiverse of Maddness.

 

[Sean Bryan]

The other possibility is that all of the extra Spider-characters are just glorified cameos, as part of a set up for a future movie, but instead of leading into another Spider-Man/Spider-Verse movie, it leads into Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness. Esepcially given that Strange is supposed to be in the Spidey film.

The latest “insider scoop” rumors I‘m reading suggest that Marvel will be going more along this route with a storyline flowing through three projects with WandaVision as the start, Spidey 3 as the middle piece, and Multiverse of Madness as the conclusion. Though these same rumors are saying Spidey 3 would be quite the sprawling epic, so I don’t think the other Spidey’s will be just cameos.

Looks like Marvel will be doing things a bit differently post Phase Three with more shorter multi-film stories that lead to ”event” climaxes instead of just doing that at the end of a “Phase”.

I’m only completely guessing here, but I feel like we may see a similar thing with Ms. Marvel, Secret Invasion, and Captain Marvel 2.

 

[Jake Lipson]

Rumors are now going around about more potential cast returns. All of the other cast returns have been posted here without spoiler tags, so I'm not sure if I should have them here or not. Just in case some people are very sensitive, I'll go ahead and do that because these haven't yet been reported by a trade. But it isn't much of a surprise considering the other returns which have already been discussed. To be clear, what I'm putting under the spoiler tags has nothing to do with knowing a plot point, just that more legacy characters are supposedly back.

Spoiler: Identities of Rumored Returning Cast Members

Willem Dafoe and Thomas Hayden Church are supposedly returning as well.

At this point, it seems like almost everyone is allegedly coming back, so why not? I don't know how they're possibly going to juggle this many characters, but they were both the main villain of their respective films, so it makes sense for them to be in, I guess.

I wonder, though, if they can manage to include Dafoe without having James Franco in it. Franco seems to be persona non grata right now due to some allegations and whatnot, so I'm not sure if Sony/Disney would want to deal with the associated PR of having him be part of this or not. But if you have Norman, it would make sense to also have Harry.

We'll see.

 

[Adam Lenhardt]

Spoiler: Identities of Rumored Returning Cast Members

I wonder, though, if they can manage to include Dafoe without having James Franco in it. Franco seems to be persona non grata right now due to some allegations and whatnot, so I'm not sure if Sony/Disney would want to deal with the associated PR of having him be part of this or not. But if you have Norman, it would make sense to also have Harry.

They could bring in Dane DeHaan instead. It seems to be a real mismash, so what the hell. I'm also not convinced that all of the actors reprising their roles from previous iterations of live action Spider-Man movies are necessarily playing the versions from those prior movies.

I'm thinking we could get cases similar to J.K. Simmons as J. Jonah Jameson: Same actor, same character, different take and different universe.

Some one of the ones who have been reported died in the movies they were in.

One thing that The CW's "Crisis on Infinite Earths" did well was sell the idea of a whole ton of Earths that weren't the basis of any movies or TV shows. And the glimpses we got of those Earths mixed and matched different elements from the more established Earths.

 

[Chip_HT]

It'll be a huge coup if they could get Cliff Robertson to return for this one.

 

[Jake Lipson]

Cliff Robertson

I can't tell if you are joking or not. Cliff Robertson passed away.

 

[Chip_HT]

 

[Sean Bryan]

Cross posting from the WandaVision thread, but it’s equally applicable to both topics.

I’m not sure how reliable this site is, but Small Screen is saying the Elizabeth Olsen will appear in Spider-Man 3. But considering her presence in Multiverse of Madness and the rumors about what Spider-Man 3 will deal with it’s not surprising if accurate.

Elizabeth Olsen's Scarlet Witch Will Be In Spider-Man 3

It's been revealed to us by sources reportedly close to Marvel Studios that Elizabeth Olsen will be playing Scarlet Witch in Spider-Man 3.

www.small-screen.co.uk

 

[Greg.K]

'Spider-Man 3' Has Officially Been Titled 'Spider-Man: No Way Home' - SlashFilm

After teasing with some fake titles, Marvel Studios and Sony Pictures have given Spider-Man 3 the official title of Spider-Man: No Way Home.

www.slashfilm.com

 

[Jake Lipson]

Thank you for posting that, @Greg.K! I have updated the thread title to reflect the news.