Scott Atwell Star Trek Discussion thread (Series and Films) (1 Viewer)

[Ockeghem]

Nelson,

"I have been sent to welcome you."

I saw Antoinette Bower on one episode of Perry Mason last night. She is in at least two episodes from that series.

I know this is me romanticizing a bit, but I've frequently fancied seasons one and two of TAS being the fourth and fifth seasons of TOS. Some of the writers are common to both series. My only gripe is that I think Chekov's work on TAS left much to be desired.

 

[bryan4999]

It's kind of an odd thing to think about a span of time and apply it to a different time. For example, I was just thinking about an improvement I made to my house in the Summer of 2011 and it suddenly struck me that, "Wow, in that same amount of time ST:TOS had come and gone." But three years later I am at the same job, in the same house, and the only thing that has really changed for me is that my blu-ray collection has grown.

My fantasy is that if TOS had gone on to a 4th and 5th season, it would have been done for syndication (not that such things happened in that era). But then NBC would not have been involved and there would have been more leeway for more difficult stories - after all, this was still the era of censoring Jeannie's belly button.

 

[benbess]

My son asked me this question yesterday, and so I'll ask you. There are no right or wrong answers:

"Which c. 5 episodes of Star Trek are so bad for you that they are good? In others words, which episodes do you realize are bad, and yet their entertainment value for you remains high?"

We found out that he and I had a high level of overlap in naming 5 episodes like this. In fact, 4 matched.

It's not really a trivia question, I realize, and I thank everyone here for indulging this kind of query.

PS Some of our answers were: The Gamesters of Triskelion, The Omega Glory, The Way to Eden, and Operation: Annihilate!

 

[FanCollector]

Nelson, I think that's as great a description of the Coon/Lucas distinction as I can imagine. That's exactly it.Bryan, I never even thought of syndication! Plenty of shows in those years that went to first-run syndication, although I can't think of one that started on a network and then moved to syndication until the 80s. That's a really interesting way to imagine a fourth season.

 

[FanCollector]

Oh, and Scott...I think you just don't appreciate really subtle voice acting.And Galt was the last thrall! Nelson edged out the question.

 

[Nelson Au]

Thanks Lee, the Coon Lucas distinction is something I hadn't considered before since we are reading about it in the Cushman book. Interesting! I like Scott's notion that the two seasons of TAS are the forth and fifth season of TOS! We got to see more Tribbles, more Kor, more aliens on the bridge! This will color how I view TAS from now on.

 

[Ockeghem]

Lee,

That's wonderful! Take a peek at your post (#10864) above and then leave Walter Koenig out of the equation. That is truly remarkable, unless of course you meant it both ways. Either way, I am impressed.

Nelson,And we also get to see much more of the Shore Leave planet and (maybe) the prototype of the holodeck.

 

[FanCollector]

Scott, like the actor who gave the performance of a lifetime, I'm glad I impressed you but I have no idea what I did! I was just making a joke about Walter Koenig's participation in the animated series.Ben, I'm not entirely sure what you mean. I thought you were talking about unintentional humor or camp value, but then you listed Operation:Annihilate, an episode whose quality you eloquently defended here recently. So how do you mean "so bad they're good" in this case?

 

[Ockeghem]

Lee,

Your mention of Koenig was good, and of course I expected you to know I was joking when I said his work in TAS left much to be desired. But your line about subtle voice acting was also mentioned within one and the same post as a line discussing the late, great Joseph Ruskin -- a man whose voice (and vocal quality) I have commented on as having greatly admired numerous times. When you wrote that "I think you just don't appreciate really subtle voice acting," I thought immediately of my appreciation for Ruskin. But more than that was the fact that he actually 'appeared' in an episode of Trek (DS9) as only a voice -- and a subtle one at that as the hidden Cardassian informant to Odo. That to me was truly impressive and it was what caught my attention!

I watched me some Darras and Daystrom tonight. Both on the same disc, and both excellent offerings. One of the things I noticed tonight was the comedic elements in "Lieutenant!" Sure, we know about a couple of them, but there are about a half dozen or so. I found myself smiling (and laughing a couple of times) at some of the lines and reactions to those lines tonight.

 

[Nelson Au]

Happy Fourth everyone!I thought I'd watch a TAS episode now. One of Our Planets is Missing. It made me wonder if William Shatner had actually re-recorded the opening narration. It sounded the same. The plot feels similar to The Immunity Syndrome and TMP. I haven't seen this episode in a while. It's amazing TAS was made 4 years after TOS and 5 years before TMP.

 

[FanCollector]

Happy holiday to everyone!Was it here that we established to my amazement that the animation opening narration was the same? After the discussion, I checked to my satisfaction that they really are the same recording.

 

[Nelson Au]

I'm sure you did establish that Lee. I can't recall it, but I bet you did! They must have borrowed the tape from Paramount in order to use it at Filmation. It's interesting that the TOS Complete Soundtrack set doesn't include a version of the opening titles with Shatner's monologue. I suppose it's because it's about the music. But I would have thought it would have been good to have a version unless I missed it in the set. The tape must still exist if the remastered title track has the monologue.I liked how "One of our Planets is Missing" still retains that TOS feel of not destroying other forms of life if possible. But the episode also has that Devil in the Dark feel to it.

 

[FanCollector]

I didn't realize that about Ruskin's voice-only performance. He did have a marvelous instrument!Nelson, I think LaLaLand implied that they made an economic choice not to include Shatner's narration because it was available in many other places and would have cost them a lot.

 

[bryan4999]

My son asked me this question yesterday, and so I'll ask you. There are no right or wrong answers:

"Which c. 5 episodes of Star Trek are so bad for you that they are good? In others words, which episodes do you realize are bad, and yet their entertainment value for you remains high?"

We found out that he and I had a high level of overlap in naming 5 episodes like this. In fact, 4 matched.

It's not really a trivia question, I realize, and I thank everyone here for indulging this kind of query.

PS Some of our answers were: The Gamesters of Triskelion, The Omega Glory, The Way to Eden, and Operation: Annihilate!

I think this is an interesting question as most of the episodes I don't care for are pretty much universally disliked. However, I did come up with these:

TOS - "Spock's Brain" - I had disdained this episode for years and had not seen it in a long time when the blu-ray of season 3 came out. I decided to watch it from a fresh perspective and without prejudice and I found that I enjoyed it. I think the actors do a good job of staying true true to their characters even if the premise is really out there. I think DeForest Kelly has some really good moments. And, frankly, the idea of Spock having the composure and grasp of his situation to assist in his own surgery is pretty cool. I mean, please, I don't see this one as a peer of "City on the Edge of Forever" but I can enjoy it. For example, I can't stand to watch "The Omega Glory" at all, but my perspective on that one is pretty much shared from what I can tell (I recall back in the day watching it with my Dad who, although a Trek fan, just muttered "Oh, brother.").

TNG - "Sub Rosa" - This is the one where Dr. Crusher goes to settle her grandmother's estate and falls under the spell of a "ghost" (alien). I love this episode, but I hear it derided by a lot of Trekkers. I think it has fun, creepy Halloween feel to it and every time I watch it I get goosebumps. I like Gates McFadden's performance very much. I like Picard's devotion to Beverly; that is evident in other episodes as well, but Patrick Stewart really puts it across in this episode. I also like that the episode begins with Crusher attending to her blood family but she is rescued by her Enterprise family who simply won't retreat. That camaraderie is one of my favorite aspects of all Star Trek iterations.

VOY - "Threshold" -also known as the "Salamander episode" - OK, I hate the salamander part and I remember thinking the series was going downhill fast when it was first broadcast. But I really, really like the first half because it shows Paris as a passionate flyboy who is dtermined to break the warp 10 barrier, and that part has elements of "The Right Stuff" and other great Treks. Unfortunately, the second half devolves into weirdness. But I put up with it for the first half, which is an exciting Trek IMO. I have ambitions of doing some kind of "fan edit" with this episode but I haven't fully thought it through and gotten around to it.

ENT - "Unexpected" - all I can say here is that I am a fan of Connor Trineer and I think he manages to deliver a sensitive performance despite the cheap jokes and head-scratching science.

TOS - "The Alternative Factor" - I have always thought of this as a rather smart and interesting episode and have been surprised to discvover over the years that it is looked down on. I have no real defense of the episode other than to say it makes sense to me and I have always appreciated it.

 

[Nelson Au]

It's always interesting to read someone else's take on episodes. Especially the episodes that are not as well regarded. In honor of today, I just watched The Omega Glory. I happen to like this episode. But I can see someone thinking they went too far with the parallel, the Constitution of the United States probably went too far. It's another in a line of parallel world episodes the second season had a prevalence of.The Alternative Factor was never my favorite, but I appreciate your fondness for it. It has a very Outer Limits feel to it and it makes sense as Gerd Oswald directed it. I got it over time and it has it's own sensibilities. My feeling on Spock's Brain is that I like it a little more now then maybe several years ago. I was neutral about it 20 years ago.

 

[Ockeghem]

Guys,

As is our custom for the Fourth of July, we shot some of our own fireworks off. One of the items we had was this long tubing that my wife shot. We didn't know how many shots it had, so we just waited until it finished. Anyway, I couldn't help but think she was doing an imitation of one of Landru's 'henchmen.' She even said "Come" a few times and of course I had to respond with "You will be absorbed" and "Then you will die." And now you know which episode I have to watch tonight.

 

[FanCollector]

As usual, I am deeply envious of your family events. In this case, however, I hope no neighbors overheard your responses, lest the uninitiated among them think you are less peaceful and gentle than you are!

 

[Ockeghem]

Thanks Lee. One of the benefits of living on 20+ acres is that our closest neighbors are about a half-mile from us. Of course, Landru is everywhere, so one never knows.

 

[Stan]

VOY - "Threshold" -also known as the "Salamander episode" - OK, I hate the salamander part and I remember thinking the series was going downhill fast when it was first broadcast. But I really, really like the first half because it shows Paris as a passionate flyboy who is dtermined to break the warp 10 barrier, and that part has elements of "The Right Stuff" and other great Treks. Unfortunately, the second half devolves into weirdness. But I put up with it for the first half, which is an exciting Trek IMO. I have ambitions of doing some kind of "fan edit" with this episode but I haven't fully thought it through and gotten around to it.

I loved this episode. Had never seen it, but it was being discussed and universally dismissed as one of the worst episodes ever made. Just happened to be showing in syndication on a cable channel and I liked it. Granted, it was horrible, but more along the lines of "so bad it's good".

 

[Nelson Au]

Nice having all those tracts of land Scott! I had been working on a project yesterday on the computer, so I had 5 Voyager episodes going, including Scientific Method. I always liked that one. I'll have a take another look at Threshold. I never had a super negative reaction to that episode. I just went with it.On an entirely different note, I was fascinated with the idea of the F-104 Starfighter jet, or Blue Jay 4 as it was known by its call sign in Tomorrow is Yesterday. I was fascinated with it because it may become another modeling project when I get to building my large scale Enterprise model kit. I found some YouTube videos of the models for the F-104 with one guy replicating Blue Jay 4.