Pioneer receiver - is it defective or am I defective?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by ThomasL, Jan 2, 2002.

  1. ThomasL

    ThomasL Supporting Actor

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    I'm hoping some expert out there can give me a hand with this.

    I have a "low end" Pioneer D309 receiver in a home theater setup and I was doing some testing with low frequency test tones and the crossover setting. To my surprise, or my dismay, this doesn't seem to work. I set all my speakers to small, have the subwoofer connected via the receivers subwoofer out RCA jack to it's line in jack and do not have the front speakers "daisy-chained" through the subwoofer (which is the Sony I've mentioned in a previous thread). So, I went in and set the crossover to 150 hz (the Pioneer allows settings of 100, 150, and 200) and then went into Avia and did the low frequency left front sweep. To my surprise, the tone continue to come out of the left front speaker well after 150 hz. In fact, it continued to come out of the left front all the way till it dropped off at 70 hz which is the left fronts minimum range. At the same time it was also coming out of the subwoofer and continued to come out of the subwoofer down to its lowest point - 39 hz. I then powered the subwoofer off and redid the test. I clearly heard the tone coming from the left front and my Radio Shack soundmeter verified this...all the way down to 70-80 hz or so. I then decided to power up the subwoofer, disconnect the left front speaker and do the test again. This time I lowered the crossover to 100 and then did the test sweep. Amazingly enough, the subwoofer played the entire sweep from 200 hz down to 40 hz until it then dropped off. This makes no sense to me. Should not the crossover setting tell the receiver to only begin sending frequencies to the subwoofer when they hit ~100.

    Does anyone know what the heck is going on?

    Am I doing something wrong?

    Is the receiver broken?

    Or is the receiver simply so low end that the crossover frequency is simply a marketing gimmick and doesn't work or works extremely poorly?

    Should I junk this receiver and look to invest in a better low end receiver, perhaps the Onkyo494 or other receiver that comes in around $300.

    Help!

    thanks,

    --tom
     
  2. Marcelo T

    Marcelo T Stunt Coordinator

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    crossovers are not brick walls. The sound is atenuated at a rate of 3 to 6db per octave, so it is normal to hear sound coming to the speakers way pass the crossover point. So if you set the crossover to 100 hz, your speakers will produce sound down to 50 kz, but 6dbs atenuted. This is done to smooth the transition between the speakers and the sub.

    There´s nothing wrong with the receiver.
     
  3. ThomasL

    ThomasL Supporting Actor

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    Thanks Marcelo. Does this also explain why the sub seemed to be responding to the entire frequency sweep from 200 on down when I disconnected the left front and ran the left front low frequency sweep with the crossover set to 100 hz? Or did disconnecting the left front (the wires from the speaker, not at the receiver's end) somehow taint this test?
    thanks very much for any and all help [​IMG]
    --tom
     
  4. Chris PC

    Chris PC Producer

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    You are defective. I'd return you. Ask for your money back and see what you get. Of course, once you refund yourself, you're gone!
    Just teasing.......one thing for sure, your room changes the sound dramatically. I tested speakers rated to only 45 Hz -3 dB and in my room I was able to measure a few dB's of output below 20 hz. Your room totally changes the sound. In order to determine if the crossover is working, you'd need to do testing another way. I don't know how, other than measuring the signal coming out of the receiver, before it is played by speakers.
    ....but seriously, did you come with an extended warranty? [​IMG]
     
  5. ThomasL

    ThomasL Supporting Actor

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    Thanks for the reply Chris. I think my wife often wonders if she got me with the extended warranty [​IMG]
    Does anyone else have any thoughts?
    cheers,
    --tom
     
  6. Marty Neudel

    Marty Neudel Stunt Coordinator

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    >Does anyone else have any thoughts?

    I have some thoughts! Mostly when my wife and I are in bed together late at night; BUT, I'd rather not express them in public. O H ! ! ! ! You meant about your subwoofer & receiver's xover. O.K. I'll express those.

    Marcelo hit the wall with great precision. Your equipment is acting the way it should. If possible, however, you may want to shut off the xover in the sub and rely on your receiver's circuitry only. Then, if you like the sound, sit back and enjoy. If you don't like the sound, audition some other receivers, untill you come up with the speaker/amp combination that makes you happy.

    Remember, the object of h.t. should be to enjoy the show even more than you enjoy showing the numbers.

    Marty
     
  7. ThomasL

    ThomasL Supporting Actor

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    Thanks for the replies everyone...after reading Guy's detailed description of bass management with Avia, I see this is a detailed area of study! My main goal in asking my questions was to better understand what exactly the crossover option does and how it is handled and in general how things work. My goal is to try (within my small budget) get the most consistent and balanced sounding system across all frequency ranges. Impossible I know but it's nice to dream. For my ears, I've made a big step by chucking the Sony tin can satellites and getting the CSW Newton M50s. I think what I've learned is don't opt for the small satellite setup for the fronts, invest the money in a decent set of bookshelf speakers for $150-200/pair if you want smallish speakers. You'll still need a sub but the sub and bookshelves will mate much more nicely than small satellites that are geared toward only handling the midrange. So, now I still must decide on whether or not to get a sub replacement for the Sony sub that came with the SA-VE315 [​IMG]
    thanks everyone!
    --tom
     

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