1. Sign-up to become a member, and most of the ads you see will disappear. It only takes 30 seconds to sign up, so join the discussion today!
    Dismiss Notice

A Few Words About A few words about...™ Sweet Charity - in Blu-ray

Discussion in 'Blu-ray and UHD' started by Robert Harris, Aug 2, 2019.

  1. Kyrsten Brad

    Kyrsten Brad Cinematographer

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2014
    Messages:
    2,291
    Likes Received:
    1,183
    Trophy Points:
    1,610
    Location:
    Merritt Island, Florida
    Real Name:
    Brad
    First time viewing now, roadshow version.

    Nice way to spend a stormy Florida afternoon.
     
    PMF and ahollis like this.
  2. Chuck Pennington

    Chuck Pennington Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    May 11, 2001
    Messages:
    925
    Likes Received:
    278
    Trophy Points:
    610
    An update...

    I ended up buying the Kino Lorber SWEET CHARITY even though I though the French release (and my hybrid putting back the entr'acte and exit music) would suffice. Some observations:

    * The scene missing from the DVD is back in the "roadshow" version, but it is NOT in the alternate version. I'm assuming a reel from the shorter cut was used when making the DVD and that would explain its absence. The scene is presented here:



    * The sound synchronization on the last two sections of Rich Man's Frug look perfect on Kino's release whereas those same sections are off a bit on the French Blu-ray.

    * The new commentary track is only on the shorter alternate cut of the film. The commentator makes no more of the extended dialogue scene missing on that cut.

    * The trailer and bonus vintage featurettes are the same standard definition, dot crawl filled transfers as were on the DVD.

    * The intermission card created for video stays on the screen for nearly 30 seconds with no audio. As the entr'acte is missing, the audio suddenly fades in as the second half of the film begins.

    * The gate weave that has always been in the opening credits has been stabilized.

    * Opticals still stick out but the difference between them and the surrounding footage is less pronounced when compared to prior releases.

    * The contrast for the feature is a bit lighter, revealing a bit more to see in the darker areas of the frame and black costumes.

    * The feature has a less gritty look now, which is pleasing and subtle. The grain is now quite slight and the lower contrast reveals a bit more details in the costumes. Solid colors (like the hot red background during The Rich Man's Frug sequence) no longer have the noticeable swimming grain breaking up the hue as before.
     
    PMF, JohnMor, KPmusmag and 1 other person like this.
  3. Chuck Pennington

    Chuck Pennington Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    May 11, 2001
    Messages:
    925
    Likes Received:
    278
    Trophy Points:
    610
    That was me.

    This sequence is in sync on the Kino Lorber Blu-ray release. The last two sections of The Rich Man's Frug are NOT in sync on the French Blu-ray of several years ago. The dancers don't punch on the beat on that release but they do on this new one (and the old DVD).
     
  4. JohnMor

    JohnMor Producer
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2004
    Messages:
    5,024
    Likes Received:
    2,162
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    Real Name:
    John Moreland
    That explains a lot about the cut dialogue on the dvd. Very interesting.

    Any thoughts on the sound quality/levels on the Kino vs. the French, Chuck?
     
  5. haineshisway

    haineshisway Producer

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2011
    Messages:
    4,517
    Likes Received:
    5,205
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Real Name:
    Bruce
    I find it astonishing that you don't mention the lower than low sound - it's so obviously botched. Yes, you can turn it up about 10db and it will match the French Blu or any other movie, but something clearly went wrong and no QC was done at all.
     
    Stephen PI, Ken Koc and usrunnr like this.
  6. TJPC

    TJPC Producer

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2016
    Messages:
    3,559
    Likes Received:
    3,098
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Location:
    Hamilton Ontario
    Real Name:
    Terry Carroll
    I watched this on our “everyday” TV which only has a sound bar, and noticed no deficiency in the sound what so ever. Now, lately we have been going to bed too late. I start a movie, and my wife, who is only 1/2 watching anyway, falls asleep. Then I put the sound way down and turn on the subtitles. Perhaps that was also the case this time, so I didn’t notice. :)
     
  7. Mark B

    Mark B Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2003
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    98
    Trophy Points:
    610
    Location:
    Saranac Lake, NY
    Real Name:
    Mark
    This could have been a stellar release, yet due to so many sloppy production errors it ranks as only OK. The missing music is a bone headed screw up, the commentary is on the wrong disc and sounds like it was thrown together after watching the featurette on Fosse and a Google search, the sound is adequate but frustrating, and I feel if they were going to produce a second disc they may as well have given us the shredded version that eventually hit neighborhood movie houses, as that would be interesting to see. I find it hard to believe that this particular trailer was what was seen prior to release. It feels like a last ditch effort to drum up some business. Honestly, as much as I like the film, the trailer we have been seeing for 30 years on home video does the film no favors and almost calls out the film as a "turkey." Overall, a missed opportunity for no reason other than carelessness.
     
    usrunnr likes this.
  8. haineshisway

    haineshisway Producer

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2011
    Messages:
    4,517
    Likes Received:
    5,205
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Real Name:
    Bruce
    Ya think? Because if you put on any other movie and set a comfortable sound level and then put on this disc if you don't notice it then new ears are in order - it's BLATANT - it's not just a db or two lower - it's TEN db lower.
     
  9. AnthonyClarke

    AnthonyClarke Cinematographer

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2010
    Messages:
    2,078
    Likes Received:
    1,571
    Trophy Points:
    1,610
    Location:
    Woodend Victoria Australia
    Real Name:
    Anthony
    Sounds like the volume issues with the Todd-AO version Blu ray 'Oklahoma'.
     
    GlennF and ahollis like this.
  10. Ethan Riley

    Ethan Riley Producer

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2005
    Messages:
    4,016
    Likes Received:
    750
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Truth. I have a very sophisticated sound system--I had to put the poor thing on blast for this movie.
     
    RobertR and haineshisway like this.
  11. Robert Harris

    Robert Harris Archivist
    Reviewer

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 1999
    Messages:
    12,616
    Likes Received:
    15,651
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Real Name:
    Robert Harris
    I’ve gotten to the point with the way that tracks are being mastered, along with some corporate logos, ie the occasional Lionsgate (that comes on way above normal levels) that I no longer look at levels as a norm. On my system, I’m generally running anywhere from 58-73.

    I’ll have to recheck SC, and see where it falls.
     
    JohnMor and Robert Crawford like this.
  12. Paul Penna

    Paul Penna Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2002
    Messages:
    787
    Likes Received:
    292
    Trophy Points:
    610
    Real Name:
    Paul
    I have the mute button on my Denon receiver set to -20db below normal listening level and have learned to always engage it when starting a disc, just to avoid blasting logos and menu music.
     
  13. Robert Crawford

    Robert Crawford Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 1998
    Messages:
    46,131
    Likes Received:
    21,902
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Location:
    Michigan
    Real Name:
    Robert
    I just sampled both discs in my home office HT and I'm not noticing anything unusual with the audio level. I'll try to sample it again in my main HT to see if I notice anything with that system.
     
  14. Gary16

    Gary16 Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2006
    Messages:
    1,207
    Likes Received:
    1,746
    Trophy Points:
    1,610
    Real Name:
    Gary
    I had no sound issues with “Oklahoma.”
     
    john a hunter likes this.
  15. Robert Crawford

    Robert Crawford Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 1998
    Messages:
    46,131
    Likes Received:
    21,902
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Location:
    Michigan
    Real Name:
    Robert
    Perhaps, some of us normally have the volume set higher than others? That may explain why some of us didn't notice such sound issues.
     
  16. usrunnr

    usrunnr Writer

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2012
    Messages:
    396
    Likes Received:
    262
    Trophy Points:
    110
    Real Name:
    usrunnr
    Mr. Harris, what is your opinion of the quality of the sound as originally recorded?
     
  17. Robert Harris

    Robert Harris Archivist
    Reviewer

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 1999
    Messages:
    12,616
    Likes Received:
    15,651
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Real Name:
    Robert Harris
    Not a clue. One would have to sample the original full-coats, but knowing Universal, I’d bet they’d be superb.
     
  18. haineshisway

    haineshisway Producer

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2011
    Messages:
    4,517
    Likes Received:
    5,205
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Real Name:
    Bruce
    There's nothing really wrong with the sound on the Kino other than some person decided to make it ten db lower than most Blu-rays. No reason to do so and perhaps an error, but it's really annoying.
     
    usrunnr likes this.
  19. Robert Crawford

    Robert Crawford Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 1998
    Messages:
    46,131
    Likes Received:
    21,902
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Location:
    Michigan
    Real Name:
    Robert
    I didn't need to adjust my volume when sampling this Blu-ray. It's at the same volume level as when I played "Reap the Wild Wind" this afternoon.
     
  20. haineshisway

    haineshisway Producer

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2011
    Messages:
    4,517
    Likes Received:
    5,205
    Trophy Points:
    4,110
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Real Name:
    Bruce
    Well, I'm not at your house so I don't know your set-up. I'm not the only one who's said this, you know. There are several people who've pointed it out and we're certainly not making it up. I have a standard volume level and most Blu-rays and DVDs are perfect at that level. So, it's really easy to tell when one is mastered way too hot or way too low.
     
    Stephen PI likes this.

Share This Page