A Few Words About A few words about...™ 1776 -- in Blu-ray (1 Viewer)

[Garysb]

No, The Music Man is a perfect stage to screen adaptation - it didn't lose a "few song changes" - it had ONE song change - My White Knight to Being in Love, which uses the bridge of My White Knight. That's it. Everything else is there. It's a wonderful movie, wonderfully adapted to the screen, well directed by its original stage director, Morton da Costa and Onna White's choreography (also from the stage version) is stellar. The cast could NOT be better, from Preston to Shirley Jones to the brilliant comic performances of Paul Ford and Hermoine Gingold.

I think we are agreeing that the film version of the "Music Man " is essentially the same as the stage version. It didn't improve on the stage version, it more or less recreated the stage version on film. It did it very well. This is opposed to the "Sound of Music" where the movie version improved what was done on stage by filming on location and changing the placement of songs like having Maria sing " My Favorite Things" to the children during the lightening storm instead of the "Lonely Goatherd" and not having the children instantly liking Maria as soon as she arrived. Where I think the stage version of the Sound of Music did better than the movie was having the reason for the Baroness and the Captain ending their engagement being because the Baroness was willing to get along with the Nazis to maintain her business,which the Captain refused to do.

 

[JohnMor]

No, The Music Man is a perfect stage to screen adaptation - it didn't lose a "few song changes" - it had ONE song change - My White Knight to Being in Love, which uses the bridge of My White Knight. That's it. Everything else is there. It's a wonderful movie, wonderfully adapted to the screen, well directed by its original stage director, Morton da Costa and Onna White's choreography (also from the stage version) is stellar. The cast could NOT be better, from Preston to Shirley Jones to the brilliant comic performances of Paul Ford and Hermoine Gingold.

I actually prefer "Being In Love" to "My White Knight." Love that film.

 

[JohnMor]

I think we are agreeing that the film version of the "Music Man " is essentially the same as the stage version. It didn't improve on the stage version, it more or less recreated the stage version on film. It did it very well. This is opposed to the "Sound of Music" where the movie version improved what was done on stage by filming on location and changing the placement of songs like having Maria sing " My Favorite Things" to the children during the lightening storm instead of the "Lonely Goatherd" and not having the children instantly liking Maria as soon as she arrived. Where I think the stage version of the Sound of Music did better than the movie was having the reason for the Baroness and the Captain ending their engagement being because the Baroness was willing to get along with the Nazis to maintain her business,which the Captain refused to do.

This may be a minority view, but I also think the film version of West Side Story improves over the stage version, although not to nearly the same degree as The Sound of Music. But, of course, the stage piece is a much stronger one to begin with than The Sound of Music, imo. I think the switching of "Cool" and "Gee, Officer Krupke" is exactly right, as well as the change of "Somewhere" from big ballet to a delicate 2-character piece (and cutting the intro to it) and the expansion of "America" to include the Sharks. Add to that the terrific location footage of the soon to be torn down neighborhood (as opposed to only filming on a Hollywood backlot) and superb jazz-inflected arrangements and I think the film edges out the stage version.

 

[John Maher_289910]

This may be a minority view, but I also think the film version of West Side Story improves over the stage version, although not to nearly the same degree as The Sound of Music. But, of course, the stage piece is a much stronger one to begin with than The Sound of Music, imo. I think the switching of "Cool" and "Gee, Officer Krupke" is exactly right, as well as the change of "Somewhere" from big ballet to a delicate 2-character piece (and cutting the intro to it) and the expansion of "America" to include the Sharks. Add to that the terrific location footage of the soon to be torn down neighborhood (as opposed to only filming on a Hollywood backlot) and superb jazz-inflected arrangements and I think the film edges out the stage version.

To me, WEST SIDE STORY is the first great screen musical. Up to that point, there were certainly good ones, but it leaves everything that came before it, in its wake, and most that came after it.

 

[WilliamMcK]

To WilliamMcK: As someone who also thinks of himself as a musical aficionado, I'm curious to know which other musicals of stage and screen you'd rank highly.

1. OLIVER! (the only stage to screen musical that genuinely improves on its stage source... IMO)


2. THE SOUND OF MUSIC is a better movie than a play by virtue of the use of Salzburg as an additional "character" -- this is something the play couldn't do. I do strongly disagree however, that the placement of the songs are an improvement... for the stage play, the original placement of the songs is ideal... and I've never seen a stage production work that utilizes the movie song order.


3. CABARET... not better than the stage show, but so utterly different... and so cinematic that it becomes virtually an original movie musical... and one of the best!


OKLAHOMA!, THE KING AND I, WEST SIDE STORY, THE MUSIC MAN, MY FAIR LADY, and FIDDLER ON THE ROOF are all better on stage, but their respective film versions do a good job at capturing what made the stage shows so special.


And special mention should go to the 1936 film version of SHOW BOAT, probably the first great movie that was a reasonably faithful adaptation of a Broadway musical.


Finally, an off-beat minority opinion... HELLO, DOLLY! is a show whose charms have always escaped me (I don't dislike it... I just don't see what all the fuss is about). The movie, however, I enjoy immensely!

 

[ahollis]

Two days. Amazon says it shipped. I will finally be able to sit down.

 

[Cineman]

Along with THE SOUND OF MUSIC and WEST SIDE STORY, FUNNY GIRL would be another screen adaptation that I think is a noticeable improvement over the stage version. Unless (I can only assume, never having the opportunity), we're talking about watching Barbra live onstage in the original, which would likely overwhelm any considerations of song juggling, song replacement, story structure changes, alternate character emphasis and so on! THE MUSIC MAN is a tie, imo. Great movie, great stage show, virtually unimprovable in each case and the changes feel minor, although I do prefer Being in Love in the movie vs My White Knight in the stage show.


When watching the movie versions of FIDDLER ON THE ROOF and OLIVER!, both of which I like, I never think anything like, "Oh, I'm glad they changed that from the stage version. Much better," so I cannot say they are improvements for me. My overall response to those movie versions and their stage versions is essentially the same. And, as alluded to in previous posts, the movie versions of HAIR and CABARET are so different from the stage versions, the concept of "improvement or not" doesn't reasonably apply.

 

[Joe Lugoff]

I just wanted to say that I think THE MUSIC MAN is the best stage-to-screen adaptation -- at least, it's certainly my favorite. Seeing it at the age of 12 in one of those big city movie palaces on a summer day helped, but I still feel the same way 53 years later, after seeing it about 25 times.


The few changes were all for the better. The short added scenes, such as Mrs. Shinn confronting Marian in the library, or the "I love music, Mommy" scene, are just as good as anything in the original play. My only complaint would be that the filmed "Pickalittle" reprise was cut before release, for reasons unknown to me.


I believe it was Magill's Survey of Cinema which said it was a textbook example of how to bring a stage musical to the screen, and I agree.


With that movie as my standard, 1776 ranks very high, being a faithful adaptation with no songs cut, no miscastings, and everyone doing their own singing. It's cinematic enough without overdoing it (as I'd say something like SWEET CHARITY does). But my cinema sensibilities are very conservative, if not reactionary. I can't even watch something like CHICAGO, for instance.

 

[Noel Aguirre]

1776 has shipped- arriving tomorrow!
My fav stage to screen is My Fair Lady because it's basically a literal translation with a stage look. West side story is great but the stage version is better as the sequence of songs is different and works better- especially the Somewhere ballet.

 

[WilliamMcK]

THE MUSIC MAN on film is basically a fine transcription of the show. We can argue about "My White Knight" vs. "Being in Love" (I think "My White Knight" is an infinitely better song in almost every regard... but I'm not a musician, so it's just my subjective opinion). But the one thing the film does that I think is a serious mistake is moving "Shipoopi" to later in the story. It's stage placement gives the number a reason to be there... namely to show the growing attachment of Harold and Marian... and then (in the Pick-a-little reprise) to show the beginning of acceptance of the town ladies for Marian. In the film, Harold and Marian's attachment is well established by the time of "Shipoopi" -- which renders the rather lengthy production number pointless. I'll admit it works in spite of itself... but it works only because it's such a delightful number... and is so well choreographed and performed.

 

[Kevin McD]

The only casting decision that I would change in 1776 would be using Betty Buckley, from the original Broadway cast, as opposed to Blythe Danner. While Blythe Danner is lovely, her singing of "He Plays the Violin" is nowhere near as wonderful as Betty Buckley's.

 

[JohnMor]

The only casting decision that I would change in 1776 would be using Betty Buckley, from the original Broadway cast, as opposed to Blythe Danner. While Blythe Danner is lovely, her singing of "He Plays the Violin" is nowhere near as wonderful as Betty Buckley's.

I agree. Granted, you don't need a belter in a film version, but Buckley's voice is just so fantastic.

 

[Rick Thompson]

I agree that The Music Man is an excellent film, one of those rare times a first-time director gets everything right. Musicals are particularly unforgiving in that regard because there are more moving parts than a nonmusical. As for The Sound of Music, they are both excellent in their own place.


The changes made for Sound of Music film don't work nearly as well when put back on stage (I know; I saw the 1997 Broadway revival which did just that). "Favorite Things" works beautifully onstage because it illuminates more of the Mother Abbess' character and also her relationship with Maria. "Goatherd" is a lighter number than "Favorite Things" (listen to the implied danger in the bridge music of "Favorite" -- "When the dog bites...", etc.) which is why "Goatherd" works in the storm sequence. Julie Andrews sings "Favorite" so cheerfully in that soprano of hers, downplaying the implied danger, that the film scene plays so well.


Proving once again that stage and screen are different art forms, and so it can be very dangerous to have an inexperienced captain try to pilot the transition. Sometimes the ship arrives safely (Music Man); more often it sinks (The Producers, A Little Night Music).

 

[Rob_Ray]

I agree that The Music Man is an excellent film, one of those rare times a first-time director gets everything right.

Morton DaCosta had directed AUNTIE MAME before THE MUSIC MAN, so technically he wasn't a first-time director. But both films are impressive achievements for one who otherwise had little or no experience with the medium.

 

[Garysb]

Morton DaCosta had directed AUNTIE MAME before THE MUSIC MAN, so technically he wasn't a first-time director. But both films are impressive achievements for one who otherwise had little or no experience with the medium.

Both films also used the theatrical device of darkening the background to highlight the faces of the actors at the end of some of the scenes.

 

[WilliamMcK]

Couldn't wait... my Amazon pre-order hadn't even shipped yet... I canceled it and will be picking it up at lunch at a Barnes and Noble...

 

[Reed Grele]

Just watched the Extended Cut of 1776 with my HTF pal Charles Smith. Very enjoyable film. It is everything that RAH says it is. A big THANK YOU for all those involved in bringing this to fruition.

 

[Charles Smith]

One word (for now):


Magnificent!


Many many thanks to all involved.

 

[WilliamMcK]

I watched the Extended Cut last night... I paid particular attention to John and Abigail's final scene, and I get why many think it plays better without the underscoring. I think it plays differently, and I prefer it *with* the underscoring, BUT, I really appreciate it this way too! I'm just bowled over by the presentation visually and aurally... Extremely Happy with this release!!! Thank you to all involved!!!

 

[Virgoan]

I received my Blu ray of "1776" yesterday and watched it last night.


I love the film.


I'm sorry to say that I wasn't wowed by anything...visual or aural. I may have been too tired.


Still, I can watch this movie at any time and be completely enraptured by the story, the performances and the score.