A few questions regarding American Football.

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Dome Vongvises, Aug 11, 2002.

  1. Dome Vongvises

    Dome Vongvises Lead Actor

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    Ah yes, the NCAA and NFL football seasons are starting up. [​IMG] I'm only a basic football fan, so I naturally have these questions to ask.
    1. Who was the first team to use "Shotgun"?
    - when you think about it, it's pretty dangerous to use.
    2. Why do pure West Coast offensive minds reject the "Shotgun", but have seemed to embrace it recently (eg. Mike Holmgren)?
    - I can't exactly recall, but there was this show on ESPN talking about the explosion of the "West Coast" offense being used by a lot of teams. They made a mini note that it's only been recently that these "West Coast" offenses have only begun to embrace the shotgun formation recently.
    3. Who was the first team to use the "Wishbone"
    - I may be wrong, but I'm thinking Texas or Oklahoma.
    4. Why can't you run the option in the NFL?
    - This isn't a rules question, but why is the option not used as a viable offensive play in professional football? I'm pretty sure that Donovan McNAbb and Michael Vick are pretty fast guys.
    5. What advantages do certain "old school" formations have over other "old school" formations?
    - For example, what's the difference (as in usage, not how the guys line up) between the power I and wishbone?
    6. Who exactly invented the "West Coast" offense?
    - I'd say Bill Walsh and Lavell Edwards, but I could be wrong as well.
     
  2. Howard Williams

    Howard Williams Supporting Actor

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    I'll take a crack at #4. As always this is just my opinion but I think the option is rarely used in the NFL because it puts your Quarterback at risk. The option leaves the quarterback totally exposed. If Ray Lewis is screaming towards the line of scrimmage towards McNabb or Vick, even if they dump it off to a running back, Ray Lewis is gonna key and nail the quarterback. Hard! How many full speed Ray Lewis hits do you want your $50 million quarterback taking? The answer is "none". Today's defense places a very high priority on speed. Also, most quarterbacks aren't fast or moblie enough to make it work well and stay healthy enough for the whole season. The NFL sees quarterbacks as "The Little Darlings of their Sport", their best commodity, their meal ticket. No good healthy quarterbacks = no good passing = no good running = no good games and more importantly....no large wagering. I just had to get that in there.

    #1: My geuss would be the Dallas Cowboys
     
  3. Chuck Frady

    Chuck Frady Second Unit

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    Don't know why you are asking these questions, as you have pretty much already answered them for yourself.
    [​IMG]
     
  4. Jim_F

    Jim_F Screenwriter

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    6. I think Don Coryell gets credit for bringing the basic concept to the NFL, when he was coaching the Cards circa 1970.
     
  5. Dennis Reno

    Dennis Reno Supporting Actor

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    1. The Cowboys. For years they were the only team that ran the Shotgun. Landry was the head coach and I think Staubach was the QB. I know they ran it with Danny White (QB/P)

    2. I'm not sure. It could be that the Shotgun is used primarily in passing situations. The West Coast system thrives on the fact that the formation does not necessarily give away the focus of the play. For example - a two back set (HB+FB) is usually used for running plays. But with the West Coast system it could very easily be a pass play. Just a guess...

    3. I don't know, you may be correct.

    4. Howard nailed this one. Keep in mind that in college a team may have a starter and three or four additional QBs riding the bench. In the NFL teams usually invest big money in the starting QB. Exposing him on a regular basis to linebackers and safties does not result in the best ROI!

    5. It really depends on the situation and the personnel you have available. For example - for the wishbone to work, you must have three healthy RBs. Preferably, to keep the defense on their toes, at least two of them should be considered a potential ball carrier. They must be able to block as well! However, if you are down by five points with less than a minute left and you have the ball on your own 20, the 'Bone probably won't get the job done.

    6. I thought it was Bill Walsh, but I may be wrong.
     
  6. Scott Merryfield

    Scott Merryfield Executive Producer

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    2. The West Coast offense relies on quick drops, quick reads and a lot of short passes, along with a reasonable threat of running the ball. The shotgun formation does not give an advantage for these types of plays. It's mainly a way to place the QB farther away from the defense on obvious passing situations.

    4. Along with the QB being very valuable and teams not wanted to subject them to the punishment of the option, also keep in mind that defenses in the NFL are much faster than in college. Only the very fastest QB's would be able to outrun today's NFL defensive players. The option relies on outrunning and "out-quicking" the defensive. And not only are the NFL defensive players fast, but they are big. A 275lb. linebacker running at full speed can put a big hurt on a 190lb. quarterback who is being paid $5 million.
     
  7. Denward

    Denward Supporting Actor

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    I think running the option offense is more about power than speed. Your offense line has to be able to consistently overpower the defense in order to run the option. That's not going to happen very often in the NFL. In college where every conference has its cupcakes, you can rack up some big offensive numbers by ramming the ball with the option.

    Many of the most productive option plays happen when the QB tosses the ball at the last millisecond and gets totally creamed by the defense. As noted, not too many NFL teams want to see that happen.
     
  8. Matt Stryker

    Matt Stryker Screenwriter

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    The option is run every once in a while in the NFL, for the same reason it is run in college: If you don't know its coming, it is nearly impossible to defend as long as everyone hits their blocks. But if you run it every play (see Nebraska v Miami last year) and you have speed on defense, it is easy to stop and dangerous for your personel.

    The shotgun is good becase about 0.5 seconds after the ball is hiked, the ball and the QB are 5-7 steps behind the line. Less blockers are needed, so you can use more personnel as receivers, or give fewer receivers more time to run their routes.

    As for #5, the Power I is extremely useful because you get the best blockers on the field. Two TEs and two FBs give you a lethal run block setup, and you can still pass out of it.
     
  9. Scott Weinberg

    Scott Weinberg Lead Actor

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    It's like you guys are talking about sex and I've been in jail for 10 years.
    FOOTBALL! Can't wait!
    I'd offer some answers to the original questions, but they've been handily answered by those more informed than I. (Weinberg's an NFL guy; not too 'up' on the NCAA aspect. Too many teams, and my alma mater SSSUUUCCCKKKSSS.)
    Personally, I'd love to see Donovan McNabb in a Wishbone offense! [​IMG] GO Eagles!
     
  10. Mike__D

    Mike__D Supporting Actor

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    The Eagles have been toying w/ the shotgun in practice this year... They also lined up in the shotgun once or twice last season, but that may have been for one of Reid's trick plays...
    Yes, GO EAGLES!! [​IMG]
     
  11. Jon_Are

    Jon_Are Cinematographer

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  12. RossTerry

    RossTerry Guest

  13. Dome Vongvises

    Dome Vongvises Lead Actor

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    Thanks for the article, RossTerry. Unfortunately, there's too few people out there who not only enjoy football, but also enjoy the history and nuances behind it as well.
     

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