Upgrade/Progressive Scan Confusion - Please Help!

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Dom H, May 26, 2002.

  1. Dom H

    Dom H Agent

    Dec 17, 2000
    Likes Received:
    Please stay with me on this :b
    Last week lightening struck the telegraph pole next to my house sending a surge through the phone line (blowing the socket off the wall) into my ext modem blowing it to pieces through my pc (which is now dead as a dodo) down the co-ax, around to the other side of the room into my receiver then onto my TV/DVD/DigitalTV, destroying everything. Everything was on surge boards just not the phone points. Doh.
    So I'm now in the market for a TV, DVD and receiver, (sorry if this is the wrong forum). I have decided on the reciever(Denon 38002) and have narrowed down the TV/DVD choices.
    I want to upgrade and have a little future proofing in the process, here's where the confusion comes in.
    I understand there will be no HDTV broadcast in PAL's future (I live in the UK btw) First question are their any sets avavailable in the uk that can display the HD resolutions for the other non-broadcast um, thingies, such as games consoles etc.?
    Available in the UK are:
    CRT sets (100Hz, component in, 16:9 etc.)
    Rear projection (100Hz component etc.)
    Rear projectors (out of the question)
    Plasma Screen (also not viable for me)
    Progressive Scan
    Lets say I forget about HDTV, I then thought perhaps I should get progressive scan. My options;
    1. According to a recent article there is only one player capable of outputting prog pal(576p?) and this has to be done via a remote hack. It's too expensive for me so I ruled it out.
    2. Several players available here (Toshiba SD510E) list Progressive Scan in the specs, which I think is only NTSC 480p and only on R1 discs. If I were to go this route I would need;
    a Multiregion NTSC capable player with prog scan and component out.
    b NTSC compatible TV with component in and 100Hz.
    3. Some TVs here also claim to produce progressive scan by themselves. Is this from any source (from RGB?) Will it be PAL 576p? Is it any good?
    4. Buy a line doubler later (iScan pro thingy), feed it component from dvd and output 576p to TV. How will I know if the tv will take 576p signal and display it correcly? Seems awfully expensive too.
    Thanks alot
  2. Allan Jayne

    Allan Jayne Cinematographer

    Nov 1, 1998
    Likes Received:
    I think the best bet is to get a multi standard progressive scan TV that displays (scans) NTSC as NTSC and PAL as PAL (as opposed to converting everything to PAL or to NTSC first). Then you can use other components that are not multi standard.
    You have to read the specs to find out whether the progressive scan TV takes PAL only (576p), NTSC only (480p), or both PAL and NTSC. Also you need to read the specs to find out which input formats (composite, S-video, RGB, Y/Pb/Pr) are accepted. Y/Pb/Pr and RGB exist in both interlaced and progressive forms.
    Furthermore if the TV makes progressive scan you need to find out whether (a) PAL (576i) becomes 576p only and NTSC not accepted, (b) NTSC (480i) becoems 480p only and PAL not accepted, (c) both 576i becomes 576p only and 480i becomes 480p only, or (d) 576p becomes your choice of 480p or 576p and 480i becomes your choice of 480p or 576p, etc.
    And you have to find out whether a multi-region DVD player (a) plays all disks and outputs NTSC only, (b) plays all disks and outpus PAL only, (c) plays NTSC disks as NTSC only and PAL disks as PAL only, etc.
    Actually almost all progressive scan TV's also accept interlaced video and make progressive scan. How good is anybody's guess. But I do know that iScan Pro units do a very good job of making 576p (only) from 576i and 480p (only) from 480i.
    I am not exactly sure what 100 Hz is, I believe it is for progressive scan PAL where every progressive frame is displayed twice, while straight 576p is 50 Hz.
    As a general rule, converting PAL to NTSC electronically and vice versa without making progressive scan first gives poorer results compared with scanning PAL as PAL and NTSC as NTSC on the picture tube. If the TV or DVD player made progressive scan first and then converted PAL to NTSC (or vice versa) I would estimate the results to be in between the preceding alternatives.
    Video hints:
  3. Dom H

    Dom H Agent

    Dec 17, 2000
    Likes Received:
    Thanks Allan if I may pick your brains some more [​IMG]
    Firstly I'm having great difficulty finding the required specs from manufacturers sites, they all seem to offer very minimal info.
    Here in the UK crt sets at the moment seem to consist of two types.
    Those with component inputs, multistandard and no progressive scan i.e Toshibas (my first choice)
    Toshiba 32ZP18 (select home cinema->picture frame tv)
    Those without component inputs, also multistandard but with progressive scan i.e new Philips sets with pixel+
    There also seem to be two main types of DVD.
    Those with component out, multistandard/mutiregion and (what seems NTSC/R1 only) progessive output (my first choice)
    Toshiba SD510E (dvd -> audio/video dvd)
    Those with only component out, multistandard/multiregion but no progressive scan. i.e Sony DVP9000
    So lets say for example I go with my first choice;
    Toshiba TV (comp in/multistd)
    Toshiba DVD (comp out/multistd/multireg/NTSC prog scan)
    I assume the outcome will be;
    PAL dvd's - 576i
    R1 dvd's - 480p
    If I choose the alternative TV/DVD;
    Philips TV (no comp/multistd)
    Sony DVD (comp out/multistd/multireg/no prog scan)
    You say depending on the prog scan specs of the tv will determine the output, is it likely R1 discs will display 480p and R2 576p? Even though the dvd is not connected via component?
    Thanks alot

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