Twin Peaks returns in 2016 on Showtime

Joe_H

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Anyone able to read lips and tell what Dougie mouthed to Janey-E's "I love you" while watching their son?

That whole scene definitely felt creepy with the spotlight going back and forth, I half expected the Giant to show up with a warning the whole time.

Looks like pretty much none of the characters we loved are happy 25 years later though, huh*? Out of everyone, I really thought that Norma and Big Ed would end up happy together, but not them either.

The way Richard looked at Evil Coop through the screen made me think that the guess people made about his parentage is definitely true, and Richard knows it. But I guess he could just be terrified by what they observed.

I think people have speculated on it before, but I'm really thinking that Donna must have died in the car crash that they referenced in his first appearance, and that's left James sort of mentally stuck in the past. Or maybe I'm reading too much into the appearance of that horrible song.

Also, if not for that phone call Charlie had last week which seems to connect those scenes to the outside world, I'd really think that Audrey was still trapped in her coma.

*I guess Nadine and Jacoby are the closest to having a decent time of things nowadays, but they're both clearly lonely as well.

Edit: Also, I found this episode to be really funny overall. Most of all the arm-wrestling thing though.
 
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TravisR

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Sinclair's confession to his boss was really funny. He's on the verge of a breakdown and Dougie is just bumbling into saving his own life and catching criminals.


I think people have speculated on it before, but I'm really thinking that Donna must have died in the car crash that they referenced in his first appearance, and that's left James sort of mentally stuck in the past. Or maybe I'm reading too much into the appearance of that horrible song.
:laugh: I loved hearing that song again. He even got an intro from the Roadhouse announcer (I think Nine Inch Nails is the only other band to have warranted that). I like your theory behind it though.
 
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Joe_H

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Sinclair's confession to his boss was really funny. He's on the verge of a breakdown and Dougie is just bumbling into saving his own life and catching criminals.
Yeah, at episode 6 or so, I was getting tired of Dougie, but I've come back around on him lately. Like you mention, that scene was hilarious.
 
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Adam Lenhardt

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Another great episode. Lots to digest and examine.
Last week's episode was probably my least favorite so far, but this one was right back to the show's strengths. There wasn't a single scene I wasn't interested in, from the exhuberant conga line through the insurance office at the beginning to the poignant sadness of Big Ed's silent dinner in the darkened gas station at the end credits rolled.

The dueling narratives of Dark Coop and "Dougie" definitely provide a strong propulsive element to the episodes they feature strongly in. Dark Coop is this unstoppable force; no matter what obstacle is placed in front of him, he calmly and mercilessly keeps moving forward. "Dougie" is this immovable object. All manner of forces have conspired to destroy him, and he's operating with maybe 5 percent of Special Agent Dale Cooper's faculties, but all of the forces have fallen away and Dougie's still there, mostly vacant, mostly impenetrable.

What to make of that Sarah Palmer scene? Is something screwy going on with time in the Palmer household? Or was her DVR/cable company/TV station just on the fritz, and she didn't notice and/or care that that same thirty seconds or so of that old boxing match was on an endless loop?

I was so happy to see him and Norma in the booth together, quietly content in each other's company, and so sad when Big Ed was again forced to step aside so the corporate hack could outline how to destroy the RR Diner's reputation and then sweep her off into another toxic entanglement. Even after all of these years, Norma and Big Ed haven't been able to completely make it work.

Anyone able to read lips and tell what Dougie mouthed to Janey-E's "I love you" while watching their son?
I think it was just "love you", a half-power version of the Dougie echo.

That whole scene definitely felt creepy with the spotlight going back and forth, I half expected the Giant to show up with a warning the whole time.
It definitely felt like two casino magnates' idea of what a kid's gym set should be, not the reality. If I were the Joneses' neighbors, I would hate all of those lights.

I think people have speculated on it before, but I'm really thinking that Donna must have died in the car crash that they referenced in his first appearance, and that's left James sort of mentally stuck in the past. Or maybe I'm reading too much into the appearance of that horrible song.
I like that theory. It would explain why she's not part of the show (other than that Lynch doesn't want to work with
Lara Flynn Boyle and knows the flack that would come with hiring Moira Kelly again).

Also, if not for that phone call Charlie had last week which seems to connect those scenes to the outside world, I'd really think that Audrey was still trapped in her coma.
The thing is, though, we never actually hear the other side of that conversation -- only Charlie does. The situation with Audrey is definitely the biggest question mark right now.
 

Joe_H

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The thing is, though, we never actually hear the other side of that conversation -- only Charlie does. The situation with Audrey is definitely the biggest question mark right now.
True, but what we do find out about Billy and his truck and all that seems to have too much connection to the events we've observed. But yeah, something weird is going on there for sure.
 

Josh Dial

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A few thoughts:
  • Every week the Rancho Rosa logo is differently coloured: this time green. Stoplight symbolism?
  • The television looped on an electric/static sound. Originally The Man from Another Place/The Arm "sounded like" a whooping sound, but now The Arm has evolved into an electric tree thing. Perhaps the arm now sounds like electricity static?
  • Is Audrey in the Red Room? Last week the room in which she and Charlie were definitely evoked the Red Room. Plus Audrey had her red coat (stoplight symbolism again). This week we have two chairs and a lamp.
 
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Chip_HT

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There are too many of these inconsistencies, in both the show and in the Frost book, to be merely sloppy editing.

Between the mismatched crowd scence at the Double R at the end of Part 6, Part 12’s recycled Jacoby rant from Part 5, the inconsistent date on Hastings’ confession, the wrong date on Andy’s watch, Miriam’s two last names, and now the continuity lapse in the moon’s phase from once scene to the next, it seems that something is happening to the timeline.
I noted a few continuity/chronology oddities across the last two or three episodes. Before, it seemed like they had pretty much established that all of the different parts were taking place at the same time.

But, Cooper/Dougie was eating the pie with the casino brothers at the end of part 11. In part 12, I think his only scene was where he got hit in the head with the baseball. But then part 13 starts off with him returning to the office with the casino brothers, and the dialogue was suggesting that it was the next day.

Audrey's scenes in parts 12-13 were suggesting that they were the same night, which didn't match up with other scenes across the episodes. But if she's in the lodge or something, that could explain that weirdness.

And then in part 13, Bobby told Ed that they found something from his dad. I can't remember if he said "today" or "yesterday", but either way, it struck me as odd considering how much had happened since they found the item in the chair.
 

TravisR

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I noted a few continuity/chronology oddities across the last two or three episodes. Before, it seemed like they had pretty much established that all of the different parts were taking place at the same time.

But, Cooper/Dougie was eating the pie with the casino brothers at the end of part 11. In part 12, I think his only scene was where he got hit in the head with the baseball. But then part 13 starts off with him returning to the office with the casino brothers, and the dialogue was suggesting that it was the next day.

Audrey's scenes in parts 12-13 were suggesting that they were the same night, which didn't match up with other scenes across the episodes. But if she's in the lodge or something, that could explain that weirdness.

And then in part 13, Bobby told Ed that they found something from his dad. I can't remember if he said "today" or "yesterday", but either way, it struck me as odd considering how much had happened since they found the item in the chair.
I could be wrong but I'm taking all the chronological abnormalities as editing 'mistakes'. I think all the stories are taking place over the same basic period of time but the nature of editing 18 hours of footage into 18 episodes has resulted in points where today for some characters ends up being yesterday or even the day before that for the rest of the day/episode. That being said, there's a fairly popular theory that
the stories are taking place at various points in time.
I think that's way too complicated to explain and the editing mistakes reason seems much more likely.
 

Tino

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From Twin Peaks Worldwide:

Ok. It's now confirmed the timelines in #TwinPeaks are all over the place.

1. Dougie playing catch in between partying with the Mitchum Brothers all night...
2. Bobby saying he got something from his father "Today"...

Any others?
 

Joe_H

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I can't remember if it was here or some of the recap sites I read (Sepinwall maybe?) where someone suggested that maybe Lynch is basically just editing scenes together because he likes how they go together when next to each other. Who knows for sure, but either way I still tend to agree with Travis that sloppy editing / continuity is more the cause than any intentional timeline deviations. If it was consistent in its non-consistence, that'd be one thing... but instead the errors are all over the place and sloppy, which to me goes more to Lynch's tendencies towards feelings over details.
 
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Tim Gerdes

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I can't remember if it was here or some of the recap sites I read (Sepinwall maybe?) where someone suggested that maybe Lynch is basically just editing scenes together because he likes how they go together when next to each other. Who knows for sure, but either way I still tend to agree with Travis that sloppy editing / continuity is more the cause than any intentional timeline deviations. If it was consistent in its non-consistence, that'd be one thing... but instead the errors are all over the place and sloppy, which to me goes more to Lynch's tendencies towards feelings over details.
It's more than sloppiness. Last week there was an establishing shot of a moon, followed shortly by a scene with Charlie and Audrey where a new moon is referenced. I refuse to believe anyone as meticulous as Lynch (who, when filming the original pilot, personally arranged each grain of sand on Sheryl Lee's face as if she were a painting) would be so careless about other details.

At the end of this week's episode notice Big Ed's reflection in the window of the Gas Farm. It is inconsistent with his actions. Then there is the recycled footage of Jacoby and the looped boxing match on Sarah's TV.

When a TV show's mythology is built in part on the question, "is it future or is it past?" non-linear timelines shouldn't be dismissed as bad editing.

I'll also add that there were complaints about Mark Frost's book, because certain details had changed from the original series (e.g. Annie was no longer the winner of the Miss Twin Peaks contest, the backstory on how Nadine lost her eye, which was originally told in an episode written by Frost).

At the time many of these changes were also dismissed as errors. I am pretty confident it is all building to something, though.
 

Josh Steinberg

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Frost said in his "Reddit AMA" (im still struggling to understand what those things are) when the book came out that the inconsistencies were not an accident and that people should pay attention to the show.
 

TravisR

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Frost said in his "Reddit AMA" (im still struggling to understand what those things are) when the book came out that the inconsistencies were not an accident and that people should pay attention to the show.
To me, that indicates that history and memories have somehow been rewritten which seems like an idea that works within the show's universe.

For what it's worth, I'm not saying that each story absolutely can not be taking place at different points but I don't see how that is required for this story since all the stories aren't connected (yet anyway), there's only 5 episodes left and it just seems like a very hard thing to explain within the show. Who would know or explain something like "That time in the Double R was actually two months ago but Dougie stopped the assassin only 4 days ago"?
 
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Reggie W

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My personal feeling is that the show was basically thrown together as quickly as possible and so there are all kinds of sloppy on display. I think you can tell that they did very few takes on the scenes they filmed and worked as quickly as they could to finish the series. Some things do feel randomly thrown in with the editing as if this whole thing is a rough cut.
 

Josh Steinberg

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Yeah...I feel that maybe there are weird things going on with certain scenes, but not everything is a sign of something.

For instance, the cutaway last week with Dougie playing catch - I don't think there's any deep timeline conclusions to be made from it. I think it's just a matter of Kyle MacLachlan wasn't featured in that episode otherwise and they wanted to get him in there for a second.

The diner thing with Bobby is a little weirder, because the sequence of events from earlier episodes would seem to suggest that Bobby and Co visited the Briggs home and retrieved the item, opened it at the police station that day, and then Bobby went to the diner that night with Shelly and Becky, and then the random shooting happened probably that same night. (Weirdly, the deputy that shows up to assist Bobby is then seen in a scene at the station moments later, presumably the same night, asking if Sheriff Truman wants to see his new car. But I just assumed he returned to the station in between.) So in this week's episode, when Bobby says to Norma and Ed that finding that item was something that happened today, it doesn't seem to fit.

I don't think there's any evidence to suggest the show was put together quickly. They spent over a year writing it. They spent months shooting it. Then they spent over a year editing it. I think it's appearing exactly as they intend. I think more likely is that we don't yet fully understand those intentions.
 
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Reggie W

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Well, months to shoot a series that would need to provide 18 hours of actual shows is not a long time. It looks to me like a lot of things are thrown together...not really that they did not think out the arc and story, that I think they did...but when it came time to put it all together it looks like it may have been rushed. To me anyway.

I have to admit this far in and Dougie still being used for a laugh seems like way too much Dougie. The only way this pans out is the final episode of this series is amazing. Right now I am feeling that this show would be a really tough second watch for me. I mean at least going through it the first time I get to wonder what might happen...the second time through though knowing Dougie is a feature character...well...not sure I want to endure that.

I have a hard time believing at this point they will greenlight another season of this. Sadly, this means we may only briefly glimpse Cooper again before this ends.
 

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