OMG Just received this from Gershwin Estate 1959 Porgy and Bess! They want it restored! (1 Viewer)

[dana martin]

Okay so let's muddy the waters just a little bit more because this is really becoming one big mud hole you have the gold one estate the Gershwin estate, and if I'm reading correctly this was originally released by Columbia Pictures. Interesting! Think those individuals know their way around a large format restoration and display I don't know Lawrence of Arabia Bridge on the River Kwai they've got a little experience in Grover crisp and the guys at Sony seem to do such a bang-up job. So we have the talent now we need the other two out of the three.

Sorry just thinking out loud for a moment.

 

[RobertMG]

Okay so let's muddy the waters just a little bit more because this is really becoming one big mud hole you have the gold one estate the Gershwin estate, and if I'm reading correctly this was originally released by Columbia Pictures. Interesting! Think those individuals know their way around a large format restoration and display I don't know Lawrence of Arabia Bridge on the River Kwai they've got a little experience in Grover crisp and the guys at Sony seem to do such a bang-up job. So we have the talent now we need the other two out of the three.

Sorry just thinking out loud for a moment.

By the way I think the LJ Strunsky is Gershwin's Daughter or niece his wife's maiden name was Strunsky - think Columbia was just the releasing arm - the key players seem to be Goldwyn and Gershwin Gershwin - no interest in funding it - thats sad their best bet would be to get Hollywood heavy hitters involved or create a LLC to fund the restoration

 

[Thomas T]

Not to be a Debbie Downer, but I'm not holding my breath for a major restoration and a physical media release. But dreaming doesn't hurt.

I suspect if (and it's a very big if) it does get released on physical media, it would be accompanied with an apologetic discussion of its historical context (racial attitudes of the era, etc.).

 

[RobertMG]

Not to be a Debbie Downer, but I'm not holding my breath for a major restoration and a physical media release. But dreaming doesn't hurt.

I suspect if (and it's a very big if) it does get released on physical media, it would be accompanied with an apologetic discussion of its historical context (racial attitudes of the era, etc.).

Yep ---- but that would avoid any controversy to me its exciting that at the least they are interested sadly the name Gershwin and Goldwyn does not carry the clout it did -- heartbreaking - this film deserves to be seen - does anyone know the condition of the elements?

Bosley Crowther from New York Times says: “The most haunting of American musical dramas has been transmitted on the screen in a way that does justice to its values and almost compensates for the long wait…It bids fair to be as much a classic on the screen as it is on the stage.”

TV Guide Staff from TV Guide says: “The brilliant score by the Gershwins and DuBose Heyward, however, will last forever, while Preminger’s veteran cameraman, Leon Shamroy, did a wonderful job and the art direction by Serge Krizman and Joseph Wright is sensational.”

 

[RobertMG]

Yep ---- but that would avoid any controversy to me its exciting that at the least they are interested sadly the name Gershwin and Goldwyn does not carry the clout it did -- heartbreaking - this film deserves to be seen - does anyone know the condition of the elements?

Bosley Crowther from New York Times says: “The most haunting of American musical dramas has been transmitted on the screen in a way that does justice to its values and almost compensates for the long wait…It bids fair to be as much a classic on the screen as it is on the stage.”

TV Guide Staff from TV Guide says: “The brilliant score by the Gershwins and DuBose Heyward, however, will last forever, while Preminger’s veteran cameraman, Leon Shamroy, did a wonderful job and the art direction by Serge Krizman and Joseph Wright is sensational.”

 

[RobertMG]

View attachment 166814

Sammy Davis Jr was talent and this is what we are missing

 

[RobertMG]

You’re stepping into very muddy waters. Keep an eye out for ‘gators!

Do u think it is possible? The gators?

 

[Robert Harris]

It was shot on 65mm and WB just got a 65mm scanner too! Maybe WB can restore it?

Please don’t take my comments as negative personally, but why don’t YOU fund the restoration.

Why should WB pay for it?

I can tell you that it can be done. I’ve tested the OCN, which shows fade. I did a budget several years ago. I don’t recall the numbers offhand.

The film is owned by two entities with the capability to fund it, if they so desired. I’d be happy oversee the work.

But why should anyone except the owners pay for it?

It ain’t brain surgery.

And while it’s an interesting film, it is not one of the greatest films ever made.

Should it be saved? Sure.

Then what?

Here’s a frame from the OCN.

 

[DigniT@DigniT!]

Approximately five years ago... Lincoln Center Film presented a remaining 70MM print of the film in pretty rough shape (scratches, fades, skips pops etc...) A sold-out presentation and I was happy to see many of the best talents of the era in a film I'd only seen excerpts from on television. There are moments that are strong but the film is wildly uneven. nowhere near the sustained excellence found in CARMEN JONES. (I make the comparison because they share a director, a leading lady, and some supporting players). If you are a fan of the complete opera, the cuts, and revisions for the screen can be jarring and unsatisfying. I was glad to see it and would like it restored so others can judge for themselves. As a major production featuring Black talent, I'd like very much for this to be available for future generations, along with HALLELUJAH! CABIN IN THE SKY, ST LOUIS BLUES... all seminal works featuring extraordinary Black talent. It's an important body of work by performers underrepresented, even when many were at the peak of their considerable powers.

 

[roxy1927]

Those initial roadshow runs are very disappointing. Did it make its money back? Also wouldn't the Dubose Heyward estate have any say in it? I saw it once as a boy on TV(I remember very little about it) then it seemed to have vanished except for one showing at the Ziegfeld. I would think restoration of a number of other 70MM films would be higher on many lists for funding.
I guess as well having seen The Houston Grand Opera production decades ago 3 times at the Uris and then the Mark Hellinger has pretty much made me feel well nothing is ever going to top that and I'll live with those memories.
I think even Preminger said Clamma Dale was superior to Dandridge. One of the very best things I'll ever have seen in my life.

 

[Robert Harris]

Those initial roadshow runs are very disappointing. Did it make its money back? Also wouldn't the Dubose Heyward estate have any say in it? I saw it once as a boy on TV(I remember very little about it) then it seemed to have vanished except for one showing at the Ziegfeld. I would think restoration of a number of other 70MM films would be higher on many lists for funding.
I guess as well having seen The Houston Grand Opera production decades ago 3 times at the Uris and then the Mark Hellinger has pretty much made me feel well nothing is ever going to top that and I'll live with those memories.
I think even Preminger said Clamma Dale was superior to Dandridge. One of the very best things I'll ever have seen in my life.

Funding by whom?

 

[uncledougie]

If the owners of the film elements and copyright aren’t motivated to see to a restoration, whatever devotees feel about it is moot. And I have absolutely no doubt Mr Harris could produce another brilliant rescue of a film, whatever its weaknesses, that is still an appreciable example of mid 20th century Black talents lending their efforts to an important musical work. But such projects don’t fund themselves, and this isn’t a likely candidate for crowdfunding that a forgotten B picture or documentary might have materialize. Unless an established financial backer such as a foundation or motivated filmmaker group (Scorsese, Spielberg, whomever) take an active interest, this is likely a nonstarter, sad to say.

 

[Will Krupp]

Perhaps my inner cynicism is bubbling up, but that email from the Gershwin Estate reads (to me) as nothing but: "Oh, we'd be perfectly HAPPY with any royalties gained from a restoration/release, but we're not willing to outlay any of our own millions to make that happen. You should get busy on it and let us know when you make it happen. Have a nice day."

 

[Robert Harris]

Perhaps my inner cynicism is bubbling up, but that email from the Gershwin Estate reads (to me) as nothing but: "Oh, we'd be perfectly HAPPY with any royalties gained from a restoration/release, but we're not willing to outlay any of our own millions to make that happen. You should get busy on it and let us know when you make it happen. Have a nice day."

Which is precisely why it should be funded by those who will receive royalties and passive income from the restoration - the Gershwin and Goldwyn families.

I’ll make a public offer.

If the owners of all underlying and copyrights are willing to gift those rights, or channel all income (no admin fees) to The Academy Archive, I’ll help raise the funds and restore the film with no restoration fee or passive income, ie expenses only.

I’ll do a rough budget so we’ll know how much is needed.

And then see if we have cooperation - or silence.

 

[RobertMG]

Please don’t take my comments as negative personally, but why don’t YOU fund the restoration.

Why should WB pay for it?

I can tell you that it can be done. I’ve tested the OCN, which shows fade. I did a budget several years ago. I don’t recall the numbers offhand.

The film is owned by two entities with the capability to fund it, if they so desired. I’d be happy oversee the work.

But why should anyone except the owners pay for it?

It ain’t brain surgery.

And while it’s an interesting film, it is not one of the greatest films ever made.

Should it be saved? Sure.

Then what?

Here’s a frame from the OCN.

View attachment 166821

I did not take it as an insult - I agree! What was strange was being told for years Gershwin estate does not want it out - I got that response in five minutes! Goldwyn now is a shell of its old self kind of sad! But there is interest in the title - NO i wasn't saying Warner could pay for it but if they got the vid rights that might kick up interest knowing it might be a project that can make a profit that is what drives Hollywood! Thanks Mr H!!!! And that frame looks good!

 

[RobertMG]

Which is precisely why it should be funded by those who will receive royalties and passive income from the restoration - the Gershwin and Goldwyn families.

I’ll make a public offer.

If the owners of all underlying and copyrights are willing to gift those rights, or channel all income (no admin fees) to The Academy Archive, I’ll help raise the funds and restore the film with no restoration fee or passive income, ie expenses only.

I’ll do a rough budget so we’ll know how much is needed.

And then see if we have cooperation - or silence.

I was hoping you would try to move this YOU ARE THE right person for this!

 

[Robert Harris]

I did not take it as an insult - I agree! What was strange was being told for years Gershwin estate does not want it out - I got that response in five minutes! Goldwyn now is a shell of its old self kind of sad! But there is interest in the title - NO i wasn't saying Warner could pay for it but if they got the vid rights that might kick up interest knowing it might be a project that can make a profit that is what drives Hollywood! Thanks Mr H!!!! And that frame looks good!

Actually that frame is pretty, but shows yellow layer dye failure. Note the blue shadows.

And this is a fully exposed ext shot.

Int footage would be more problematic, as the negative would be thinner, hence more affected by fade.

 

[RobertMG]

Which is precisely why it should be funded by those who will receive royalties and passive income from the restoration - the Gershwin and Goldwyn families.

I’ll make a public offer.

If the owners of all underlying and copyrights are willing to gift those rights, or channel all income (no admin fees) to The Academy Archive, I’ll help raise the funds and restore the film with no restoration fee or passive income, ie expenses only.

I’ll do a rough budget so we’ll know how much is needed.

And then see if we have cooperation - or silence.

I posted it in the new FB page by Tim Millard too and look at this comment
Stan Taffel
This has been a problem title for many years. The late film collector Ken Kramer had the best 35mm print that was also in stereo. He traveled with the print from Los Angeles to New York and would screen it in his private theater. I was there for a few of his screenings including when Brock Peters came to see it. Sidney Poitier hated the film and wouldn’t come to the screening.
Ken offered it to the Gershwins for a loan for restoration (they needed the stereo tracks) but they weren’t interested. It seems that they are still unwilling given the price to do a full restoration. It would be nice to have it done and I know where the print is now that Ken has passed away but it’s the price for restoration and who would pay for it that is one of the obstacles.

 

[Robert Harris]

I posted it in the new FB page by Tim Millard too and look at this comment
Stan Taffel
This has been a problem title for many years. The late film collector Ken Kramer had the best 35mm print that was also in stereo. He traveled with the print from Los Angeles to New York and would screen it in his private theater. I was there for a few of his screenings including when Brock Peters came to see it. Sidney Poitier hated the film and wouldn’t come to the screening.
Ken offered it to the Gershwins for a loan for restoration (they needed the stereo tracks) but they weren’t interested. It seems that they are still unwilling given the price to do a full restoration. It would be nice to have it done and I know where the print is now that Ken has passed away but it’s the price for restoration and who would pay for it that is one of the obstacles.

That print is not necessary, and there is no problem with the stereo tracks.

Love the inter-web!

 

[RobertMG]

Actually that frame is pretty, but shows yellow layer dye failure. Note the blue shadows.

And this is a fully exposed ext shot.

Int footage would be more problematic, as the negative would be thinner, hence more affected by fade.

Were you trying at the time to get the film restored? The film was a staple on WPIX TV NYC for years during the late 1960's before Goldwyns license expired on the film - -