New system subwoofer problems Pleasee help!! (1 Viewer)

[lukeharrington]

Hi guys, Im using a pioneer 819 receiver with 2 polk monitor 60's front and 50's rear with a polk cs2 center. I have been using a cheap sony saw2500 10 inch sub but recently came about a second one. So i decided I would stand my two fronts on top of the two subs to clean up my floor area. ( they fit perfectly, and do not rattle) Im using one cable from the sub out port on the receiver to a splitter from radio shack and a cable to each sub. My problem is that it seems i now have less bass than i had before? I have the subs set exactly the same as far as the crossovers on the rear and the volume and both in standard( ie not reverse mode) . I have the crossover on the receiver set at 80 hz. Im at a loss for what may be wrong here!! Thanks so much for the help.

 

[Robert_J]

Cancellation? Try stacking your subs in the original location with the same settings just for a test.


Did you re-calibrate after installing the new sub?

 

[lukeharrington]

Hi they are in the original location i just added another one to the other side of my entertainment center

 

[Robert_J]

As a test, try stacking them. Make sure both have the same phase setting on the amp. This will confirm or disprove my idea that there is some sort of cancellation going on.

Also, did you calibrate after adding the 2nd sub?

 

[lukeharrington]

In my thinking shouldnt one of them be on forward and the other in reverse mode>?

 

[Robert_J]

No. If they are equal distance from your seating position then the phase should be the same on both subs.

 

[Kevin Haskins]

You could have them wired out of phase (don't always trust the manufacture) or more likely... you are just finding out the reality of bass. Below about 200Hz the room really starts to have its way with the in-room response and changing the location of the sub or the listener drastically changes the response. Try changing the location of the two subs.... push them into the corners and try listening to one, then two at a time to attempt to find out the source of your problem. You won't have twice the output with twice the subs due to the cancellation issues but you should be able to obtain smoother in-room response on average along with a slight increase in output.

If you want monster bass.... build a single massive sub for good output and use multiple smaller less expensive subs to smooth your in-room response.

 

[Robert_J]

Originally Posted by Kevin Haskins You have been a member for 7 years and this is only your 3rd post.

 

[Kevin Haskins]

Originally Posted by Robert_J Any sub that is capable will do. Most people are not going to need a 21" Maelstrom to do the trick. A 21" driver is only necessary for those who are really sick.

 

[chuckg]

I'm waiting on the 52" sub.

 

[Robert_J]

Originally Posted by Kevin Haskins Any sub that is capable will do. Most people are not going to need a 21" Maelstrom to do the trick. A 21" driver is only necessary for those who are really sick.

Hence the name "Sick-o"? Did you ever do a prototype? The multiple piece basket is a great idea. I've just started building subs as a hobby and getting a good basket like a TC Sounds/Eclipse 18" is very difficult. I'd love to build my own if I had the tools.

 

[Robert_J]

Originally Posted by chuckg

Small compared to these - http://www.noiseaddicts.com/2008/07/loudest-subwoofers-in-the-world/

 

[Kevin Haskins]

Never did.... came to the conclusion that it just wasn't going to be cost effective. The DIY market is amazingly fickle and it was probably a $60K investment to build the first small production run. So.... we punted on the Sicko.

For a wealthy client though we could design just about anything. It all just comes down to money.

Right now I'm working on the other end of the frequency spectrum with an XBL^2 ribbon tweeter. It is something we can prototype in-house without spending a ton of money and it overcomes many of the limitations of a typical ribbon. IE. It is durable, high power handling and can run very low in frequency compared to a typical ribbon.

 

[lukeharrington]

I suppose I just assumed that since I had great luck with the single sub that one more certainly wouldnt make it worse !!! So am I correct in how i "hooked them up" a single cable out to a splitter to a cable to each sub. Also im really not sure where to set the crossover on the receiver I think I set it at 80hz or so. But then there are the adjustments on the rear of the subs themselves.......

 

[lukeharrington]

One more question... For the speakers im using, is the receiver I have ok or is it really close to being down on power to run the above listed speakers.?

 

[Robert_J]

Luke,

The Pioneer is more than adequate. Does it have MCACC?


Splitting the LFE/sub out is the correct method. That's what I do. Except my sub signal runs through a parametric EQ, then a pro amp and finally to a pair of 15" subs like this - http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=293-642 . Set the crossover on the receiver to 80hz. Set the crossover on the sub as high as it will go.


Kevin,

When I hit the lottery, I'll order up a few Sick-o's. Until then I was thinking about a pair of dipole 10's in my wife's car. 100w each in an IB install. What do you think? A guy is selling some new in box for a great price at a car audio site I frequent.

 

[yepimonfire]

Hey guys i'm new to the forum just thought i'd chime in here.


Another thing you might try is increasing the pre-amp gain on the sub in the receivers setup menu, if your daisy chaining those subs there maybe a problem with insertion loss or just bad outputs on the sub. use a Y-splitter. also mess around with the phase switches indepenently and see if it helps, i wouldn't trust sony to have wired them in phase even if it says they are.

 

[Kevin Haskins]

Originally Posted by Robert_J

Luke,

The Pioneer is more than adequate. Does it have MCACC?


Splitting the LFE/sub out is the correct method. That's what I do. Except my sub signal runs through a parametric EQ, then a pro amp and finally to a pair of 15" subs like this - http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=293-642 . Set the crossover on the receiver to 80hz. Set the crossover on the sub as high as it will go.


Kevin,

When I hit the lottery, I'll order up a few Sick-o's. Until then I was thinking about a pair of dipole 10's in my wife's car. 100w each in an IB install. What do you think? A guy is selling some new in box for a great price at a car audio site I frequent.

Sure.... most cars don't fit the technical description of an IB but most trunks are close enough. Anything with a fairly high Qts (.5-.8) and lowish Fs will probably work fine. In reality and IB is nothing more than a large sealed box so there is nothing all that different about it other than the fact that you might choose a driver with a weaker motor than one you are cramming into a little sealed box.

The little 6.5" we designed is a little beast in a car too. Run it ported... about a half a cubic foot tuned to about 38-40Hz and you will have people thinking you have a 12" back there. It has modest power requirements too.... 100W is plenty.

Back to the original poster though. As said by others.... don't trust the manufacture to have the phase right. I'd bypass the splitter to troubleshoot it because how you are hooking it up is correct. Just walk through the problem step by step. Test just one unit, then the other. It is best to use a test track with a known bass track. Play it back each time with the same levels and make sure each of the units are working individually then try them together. If everything is right you will be getting slightly more bass with the dual but room location and listening location can have some profound effects on what you hear. You may have a big hump in the response with one that is getting slightly flattened with the second sub and that could give you the perception that you have less output (because you do at that one frequency & location). But overall it sounds like you are hooking them up correctly. You just need to troubleshoot the problem further to make sure.

 

[Robert_J]

Originally Posted by Kevin Haskins

Back to the original poster though. As said by others.... don't trust the manufacture to have the phase right.

That's why I mentioned testing them in a stacked formation. Co-locating should yield a 6db increase if they are in phase.