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My 7.2 HT plan (1 Viewer)

DJVan

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Jun 5, 2015
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19
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Estepona, Spain
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Bob (Robert)
Hi,

This is my first topic since I've signed up this morning. :P

As I wrote in my introduction, I would like to set up a 7.2 surround system with:

- BenQ W1070 Projector DLP Full-HD 3D
- 135 "Electric HD Projection Screen HT 16:9 Matt Grey, or ... maybe 120" ?

- Harman Kardon AVR 370 AV-Receiver
- Harman KARDON HKTS 16 BQ Surround 5.1
- Harman Kardon HKTS 210SUB/230 Subwoofer
- 2 Harman Kardon HKTS 16/11 Satellite Speakers

The use of the HT will be movies only (practically), and needs to be "involving".

It will be in the semi-(concrete)basement; and looks somewhat like here in the image.
Red = Front/Sats, Yellow = Subs, Green = High Front (an option depending on my questions below)

missing image :( (can't upload)

This is my first HT, so please bear with me.

The questions I have are the following:

1. the layout in the attached image is based on a 120" screen. Therefore the sweet spot is in the center of the couch; and the speakers are placed in a circle at the same distance from that spot.
The question is: using a 135" screen, will I be able to create a decent layout? (I think the viewing distance, and hence the speaker distances will not fit ... and the speakers will be in front of the screen).

2. the type of sound layout: go for the standard 7.2 which supports all different decodings ... or ... Front Height speakers; which means the use of Dolby Pro Logic IIz. In the latter case it seems the HK receiver will not be able to interpret correctly DTS ???

3 due to the shape of the basement (lack of wall), and to the ceiling height (2,2 m), I was considering if it was a good idea to ceiling mount all speakers and have them point to the sweet spot.

This should cover it for now. If I get some advise, it will sure help me to get to a beginning.

When it comes to the realization, in August, I'll surely come up with new problems and questions ...

Thanks
 

Robert_J

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1. Check the optimum viewing distance and see if it works in your room - http://myhometheater.homestead.com/viewingdistancecalculator.html

2. I'm picky but there is no such thing as 7.2. The audio is encoded in with a single LFE channel. So you will actually be doing a 7.1 with dual subs. If I follow your naming convention, I'd be doing a 5.2 now and planning a 5.6 or a 5.10.

3. Speakers should be at ear level. You can tell the sound is coming from above.


Starting now for August. I planned for a year and even had some things built in by my contractor and I still wish I had done things differently. It's a never ending quest.
 

DJVan

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Thanks for your answer Robert.


Maybe the (previously missing) image will explain better.


View attachment HT.jpg
  1. It's better to use the producer's calculator; I'd be viewing from approximately 3m (120") or 4,5m (135") as depicted in the image ... the problems that arise are the speaker placement and distance, in any case.
  2. OK, I'll be doing 7.1 in this case, 5.1 might become outdated in the near future(?)
  3. HK advises to place the speaker: " You should place the surround speakers 2 feet – 6 feet (0.6m – 1.8m) higher than the listener’s ears." (even though I'd agree with you Robert)
Therefore the questions remain:
  1. Is there any chance of using a 135" screen; seen the distances and placement problems with the speakers ?
  2. Are High Front speakers as good, or maybe even better, than the usual 7.1 layout ?
  3. How to mount the rear speaker(s). Would it be OK to lower the left surround speakers from the ceiling by using a bracket ? On the left there will be the bar counter, so should be above that to avoid bumping into the speaker.
Might I be forgetting stuff, please ask me.
 

DJVan

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Bahia Azul HT2.png
 

DJVan

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Estepona, Spain
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Bob (Robert)
Getting back to my questions, in the hope to get some answers.

  1. Regarding the screen; I think I should go with 120" (as shown in the images), due to the seating distance (maybe even 100"). I would have prefered a 135" screen, but that would make me sit outside of the 4m x 4m space (image top). It makes me kinda sad, having all this space, and carte blanche of my wife, having to go for a "small" screen.
  2. I think I'll have to go with the conventional 7.1 layout, and forget about the Front Highs (?)
  3. and probably ceiling mount the back surrounds (?)
The complete basement is as in the following image. A lot of space, but hard to figure out where to place the surround spekers.


HT.jpg



I'd really would appreciate some advise/help


thanks
 

citywalker

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I'd suggest at least 120" screen. I'm using 120" from 2,5-3,5m and it's ok.


For speakers, you should go for Dolby Atmos install to be future proof. Your best option is 5.2.4. But 7.2.4 should work also.

You don't need all the speakers at once, but cables should be ready for that.

Don't rise surround back speakers - why you do that? If you want to use surround back speakers, then they should be more center located than in your pictures. Use stands for speakers, if 7.1 is mandatory. If speakers are too close to you, use dipole/bipole speakers- they will solve your distance problems - diffused sound is quaranteed :)
 

schan1269

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Do you have to do wall mount?

Tower speakers in all 7 positions(three fronts behind a proper AT screen) leaves you flexibility.

What is the distance "screen to back wall"?(I'm not making anything out of your rendering...as what is wall vs open space isn't making sense)
 

DJVan

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Thanks for the feedback guys.


Some information that might be useful: I'm doing a budget "trial" HT ... my wife isn't convinced and therefore have to limit the budget. Furthermore, my wife does not like to see any tower speakers around the room. The basement is an open-space, without any walls. The entire space will be dedicated to: HT, bar/lounge and gym.


Marko:

I've already bought the receiver, and Atmos doesn't interest me at the moment. I've changed the plan, and the surround speakers will be mounted on the back wall (to be built). Stands like towers are out of the question ;) . Have a look at the image; the wall is marked red.


Layout

basement.jpg



view from the front

front view.png



view from the rear

rear view.png



Front row view

1st row view.png



back row view

2nd row view.png



Sam:

I will have to go with a budget screen, but it will be automated (16:9).

If the wife likes the cinema I will certainly be back for more assistance ... and get them towers in there :P

The distance to the back wall, as per the new layout, is approximately 6m (width 4m).
 

Jason Charlton

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Why the electric screen? Is there a window on that wall? Are you planning to have a regular flatscreen behind the projection screen?


I only ask because with the addition of the back wall, this doesn't really strike me as much of a "multipurpose" room. It's a home theater, so why bother with the added expense of a retractable screen?
 

schan1269

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That is good on the towers. By the diagram, those are aweful tiny speakers for a room that big.

Food for thought...

Bigger speakers, typically, require less power to achieve the same volume as their littler brothers.

Based on your drawing...your speakers are going to be 87db and under. Which will NOT fill that room up with sound without an "honest to God" 150wpc behind them. Not even a $1500 AVR coughs up that much power.

A "large" bookshelf with a 6" woofer in all speaker positions with around a 91-93db rating...is the very least I would get.
 

citywalker

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If you try to create very "budget" HT with small speakers, then it will sound so bad in this big room, that your wife doesn't like it at all and your "trial HT" is dead... :(

Like Sam said, get at least decent bookshelf speakers - this will do good for you - maybe even upgrade from trial to real HT :)

Wall will be great, it solves lots of problems and makes your job easier. But still, put more speaker cables in the wall and ceiling for future upgrade, later it is pain in ...
 

DJVan

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Estepona, Spain
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Bob (Robert)
Jason:

A retractable screen (matt grey 0.8 gain) costs me less (Italy and Spain have a very low HT culture).

And I have to get it from the UK; shipping included costs 50% less than any fixed screen I've seen.

I would prefer to buy a fixed one at a descent price.


Sam:

They are kinda small, but they should have a nice sound; maybe not fit for HT but I can always move them to the living room, since I threw away my BOSE lifestyle. Yep sound will be around 85db. Maybe the 2 subs will assist a bit.


Marko:

I'm a 50 year old sales person ... and I'm fed up with work, I'm retiring.

I will use the "bad sound" as an advantage to buy top knotch equipment ... my wife and I love movies so that is another advantage.

She wanted to buy a 75" Sony 4K LCD, but I talked her out of it, and we've decided to do HT instead. Be sure that she is going to "need" a HT like it should be.

Gimme time ;)


It's not a money problem ... just the usual problem of waiting for my wife to be convinced.

Obviously I can use the HK speakers for the patio as 2nd zone and in the bar & gym area ... I see it as a small investment in order to do it right, hehehe.

I'll finish this small "test" HT, and in about a year (I'm moving to Spain from Italy in October), once we've settled, we will do it right.


Thanks for the support guys. When I've got it all up in a few months I will let you know how it works.
I really appreciate your advice, thanks.
 

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