Just what IS Anime? (incl. recommendations for newbies) (1 Viewer)

[Ken Stuart]

FYI, Bubblegum Crisis Tokyo 2040 on Encore Action Channel is dubbed in English. Whoever put "Language: Japanese" in the schedule must have only watched the first minute, because the opening/closing songs are in Japanese with subtitles, but the rest is English.

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

I love that BGC 2040 theme song...wouldn't want to be subjected to the dub though...yech!
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[Joe_C]

quote: I think Hideaki Anno was a psychologist or had some psych thing (not psycho) and knew how to have the characters act the way they did, which adds more realism to the story.[/quote]
Exactly. I saw the first half of the show before I took any psych classes or read any books on the subject. Afterwards, I understood SO much more. It was like watching a whole new show. I definitely recommend reading some literature on the Lilith myth as well. This is one of those shows that really helps to go in with a little bit of knowledge.
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I am Jack's Signature

"Here's to us poor schmoes, working for the man. Even if he is a hot, sexy female man."
"But as a gentleman, I must warn you, if you so much as glance at another woman, I'll be on her like a fly on a pile of very seductive manure."
[Edited last by Joe_C on August 05, 2001 at 01:43 AM]

 

[Ken Stuart]

quote: I love that BGC 2040 theme song...wouldn't want to be subjected to the dub though...yech![/quote]
It's nice that they left the intro and closing intact - I've heard that sometimes when Anime is on the big US networks, they often replace those with redone ones. In Asia, the "song" of the film or show is considered to be significant.
The dub was not too bad, the voice actors did good jobs of getting into their parts. I don't mind dubs too much with animation, because - unless it is CGI - the mouths of the characters are just opening and closing once for each sentence, so there isn't the same sensation of being out of sync that you get with live action actors and dubs.
Of course, you lose some of the Japanese flavor --- but for free, I can't complain.
BTW, 3 episodes seems the ideal intro - the events which setup what looks like it is going to be the premise, have all occurred by the end of the third episode.
PS Addition: I had a chance to watch the first episode of Macross Plus. As Jeff said, sort of like Top Gun, but this is set in 2040 (a popular year! Encore Action Channel should have simply called this "2040 Weekend"). The art work is very good, some of the best I've seen of non-computer-generated animation. An example is that the hot exhaust of the jets causes the sky and clouds behind to ripple, just as they would in real life. The sound effects are quite good as well. Whether the writing will measure up as well, remains to be seen. By the way, the English dub in this case is also pretty good, again, the voice actors spent the time and effort to get into the roles. Perhaps the standard of English dubbing is getting higher...
[Edited last by Ken Stuart on August 05, 2001 at 08:29 PM]

 

[Kong Chang]

You have to remember that with Neon Genesis Evangelion, Anno wrote the whole series when he was in his "depression" stage of his life. Rather than committing suicide, he wrote this lengthy screenplay about his thinking and thought process and about life and this and that, and every character is a piece of his mind. In an interview panel at AX when he came, he stated episode 25 and 26 were everything he was thinking about during the time he was depressed...what is life about, what do I have to live with humans, blah blah blah.
It's very interesting when you know the concept behind his emotions when scripting it.
K.C.

 

[Jim_K]

Ok. Let me start by saying I'm not exactly a newbie to Anime. I rented AKIRA about 8 years ago and then I was hooked. For a year I couldn't see enough Anime titles but after seeing some real stinkers I guess I just lost interest. Now fastforward to the present I watch AKIRA on DVD and now I'm hooked again (dammit). In the past two weeks i've picked up:
GHOST IN THE SHELL
PRINCESS MONONOKE
Both have been on my to buy list for some time.
Heres what I've seen and bought based on recommendations.
MACROSS PLUS OVA - I didn't think I'd like it but this really blew me away. It's a perfect blend of action, character drama and music. (Are their any other entries into the MACROSS series that are this good?)
SAMURAI X RUROUNI KENSHIN OVA - I bought this sight unseen and once again I was blown away. Is the Rurouni Kenshin Series as good as this? If it is I'm in trouble. 96 episodes yikes.
COWBOY BEBOP - I should be getting disc 1 this week. This is a blind buy but I have to check this out based on all of the positive reviews.
I did rent the first 2 episodes of NEON GENESIS EVANGELION on VHS (god my eyes hurt). I wasn't really hooked but it was interesting in a weird way.
Other recent rentals
PERFECT BLUE - great
CASTLE OF CAGLIOSTRO - good
WINGS OF THE HONNEAMISE - Beautiful animation but a bit slow a times. Good
NINJA SCROLL - OK
BATTLE ANGEL - OK (I did see this years ago and remembered liking it)
PATLABOR 1 - Didn't care for this one.
Here are the others I am interested in but haven't seen.
ESCAFLOWNE
GASARAKI
Based on what I like so far are these a good bet?
Also are there any plans for BLACK MAGIC M-66 on DVD? This was one of my favorites when I was into Anime before.
thanks,
Jim
[Edited last by Jim_K on August 06, 2001 at 08:03 AM]

 

[Dave Dugan]

Animation in France is called dessins animés, which literally means "animated drawings."
Animé simply means "animated" in French.
-Dave

 

[Kong Chang]

Jim,
Do try out Escaflowne and Gasaraki when you get the chance. Gasaraki may be slow at the beginning but it gets pretty deep. Right now after 16 episodes up to volume 5, a lot of us are dying to see what the last 10 episodes are all about.
And as for Patlabor TV series, give it a shot. Patlabor is very slow at the beginning but picks up its pace after 8-9 episodes. It's actually a very witty dramatic show with mechas, but you will tend to adore the characters because they are so different.

 

[Morgan Jolley]

For Evangelion, you need to keep watching it. The first two episodes are good, but it gets way better.
I heard that episodes 25 and 26 were rewritten because the Japanese PTA was whining about the content of episode 18 or 19, and so they had to reuse footage and rewrite the episodes. Episode 26 is close to the original script, but the original script for episode 25 became part of the movies. Then they rewrote episode 26 for the movies, so there are two versions of each episode.
The movies are great. Has anyone else seen them?

 

[Jim_K]

Kong,
I think after I check out COWBOY BEBOP I'll try ESCAFLOWNE next and then GASARAKI (since the series isn't complete yet). As for PATLABOR the series, (I rented PATLABOR the movie 1) maybe down the line I'll give it another shot.
Morgan,
As for EVANGELION I did think it was good and I do want to see the rest of the series if I can rent it (on DVD this time), but I really don't want to buy it because of all of the negative reviews of the end episodes.
thanks guys,
Jim

 

[Morgan Jolley]

I don't think the end episodes were that bad. There are 8 DVDs (the first two have 4 episodes, the rest have 3) and I own them all. The reason people might not like the end episodes is because the last two episodes are weird. Episode 25 was rewritten because of protests, and doesn't fit as well with Episode 26 as it should have. I guess people don't understand what is going on, so I suggest that you watch the last two episodes several times, and watch the movies (being released on video in december, DVD in january by Manga) right after. Both movies are great, and the second one is pretty much a different way of telling the ending of the series. The reason the first movie was made was so that some things could be conveyed that weren't conveyed in the series (like character motivations or thoughts about things) and to show the original script for Episode 25. Many people didn't like the ending and still didn't understand it, so the second movie made it more literal. The first movie is made up of Death (TRUE)^2 and Rebirth (death is a sum up of the series with added footage, rebirth is the original episode 25 script), and the second movie is The End of Evangelion (the second part of the first movie (episode 25's original script) and a rewritten episode 26). Both movies have the original episode 25 in them. I saw them, and they were good.

 

[Joe_C]

COWBOY BEBOP - I should be getting disc 1 this week. This is a blind buy but I have to check this out based on all of the positive reviews.

Jim,
The Kenshin OVA's are a lot darker and serious than the series. From the handful of TV episodes I've seen, there was the serious undertone present but with quite a bit of humor tossed in as well. Someone who's seen more episodes than I have (like Andy) will be able to give you a better description.
You should definitely pick up Cowboy Bebop. It's an amazing and unique (in a good way) series. Plus the best thing is that if for some strange reason you DON'T like it, there is enough demand for it out there that you should have no trouble reselling it.
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I am Jack's Signature

"Here's to us poor schmoes, working for the man. Even if he is a hot, sexy female man."
"But as a gentleman, I must warn you, if you so much as glance at another woman, I'll be on her like a fly on a pile of very seductive manure."

 

[Ken Stuart]

Some Impressions:
- Perfect Blue : Not bad, but not particularly great. On the plus side, it's very realistic (outside of the central story itself), and it's a decent psycho/thriller/mystery in the Hitchcock mold. Having said that, there a number of well regarded Hitchcock films that I have not seen, and I don't see the point in seeing this film instead. As some one else mentioned, this could just have easily been live action, instead of animation. In short, not remotely in the same league as Akira or Ghost in the Shell.
- Neon Genesis Evangelion 0:1 : First off, I tried both subtitles and English dub, and there is a problem in this particular series with the subtitles being out of sync with what is going on, ie in order to allow you enough time to read the whole thing, it has to go up earlier than the corresponding scene or dialogue. As a result, the English dub just works better. The series is fun, rather than being overwhelmingly innovative (so far a lot of it seems like a rehash of "Godzilla" in parts ). The title song is a great example of the type of music found everywhere in the world, except the USA, because MTV and the record companies have pointedly kept this style of music out, with the result being that any musical melodic or harmonic sense has died in the US.
Serial Experiment Lain : After one disc, this is so far easily the best of the lot. In this case, the Japanese with subtitles works properly. The atmosphere, characters, style, and overall story all seem more innovative and interesting than the other anime series I have seen so far. The closing song is an interesting revival of early-70's European rock. So far, I've rented all the disks, but I might end up buying this series, because it seems like it would be worth watching again after the first time through.
[Edited last by Ken Stuart on August 07, 2001 at 03:55 AM]

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

Just an FYI. Bebop is being rereleased in a box, if that makes any difference to you. It may be one of Paul Champagne's designs, and should be cheaper.
Lain is definately a keeper. Totally weird in a good way.
I wasn't that impressed with Perfect Blue.
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[Morgan Jolley]

I bought Lain because a friend reccommended it. I love that series, but not as much as Evangelion. I was considering getting Cowboy Bebop after someone had told me about how good it was, but I'll wait for the box set so I can get everything at once.
For anyone who watches Evangelion: if you are watching the DVDs, get the first two at the same time. The first few episodes just throw you into the series, so its kind of weird, but the second DVD introduces you to more, and brings the series to life and shows you some of its depth. Have patience with this series and pay attention.
I don't see why people hate the last few episodes of Evangelion. Episode 24 is one of the best for many reasons, and I loved 25 and 26. I guess the direction the series goes for in the end threw people off a bit.

 

[Ken Stuart]

My curiosity was piqued, and so I did some research on the original question of this thread, ie "What is Anime?". I have always found that this is best discovered through looking at the origins of the thing (the generally despised classroom subject known as "history" ).
Although the usual answer is "Japanese Animation", it seems to me that a more accurate and meaningful answer is "Osamu Tezuka".
This was the guy who created most of what are now considered the "traditions" of Japanese comic books and animation. He was the most influential force in Japanese comics in the 50's and then animation in the 60's.
A good example is the style of characters seen over and over in anime, ie the very large eyes and very small mouth. He originated this look, using early Disney cartoons as inspiration.
He also was the major force promoting the inclusion of non-child-oriented material in comic books and animation, another major characteristic of anime. As a result, comics are read by all age groups in Japan, which is probably unique to that country.
In the early 1970's, an animation series was made of a popular comic called Mazinger Z. The premise was that the Earth was being attacked by aliens, and could only be defended by giant robots that could only be controlled by teenage pilots. Since then, this premise has become another "tradition", and has become the premise of a vast number of anime series, including the recent hit "Neon Genesis Evangelion".
The other phenomenon a couple of years later was Space Battleship Yamamoto (aka "Star Blazers"), which established the "tradition" of space opera anime.
Then, in 1979, the two traditions were combined into a giant robot space opera, the popular and influential Mobile Suit Gundam. This spawned many sequels, including some that were adapted for the US.
The other major phenomenon that started in the 70's was the "magical girl" series. [So far, my research has not brought up much about the origins of this sub-genre.]
The 1980's were influenced by the style and content of the popular live action film "Blade Runner" and the advent of videotapes, which allowed a wider variety of themes to be addressed in anime, because smaller audiences could be targeted and catered to.
(This is far from being a complete history, it just touches on the most interesting and seemingly influential events.)

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

Looks like page 4 is busted... will posting again fix it?
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[Ken Stuart]

Yes !

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

Glad we didn't lose your post!
I'm kind of curious about the magical girl stuff. The TV bits of Sailor Moon I saw I hated, but that was a dub, same with Cardcaptors. What is different in SM in the uncut versions, and do they vastly improve in Japanese? I simply CAN NOT handle English voice actors in anime.
Magical girl shows I like would be Shin Cutey Honey, though that is more adult oriented.
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[Barry_B_B]

Ken, thanks for posting the reply. I've been doing a bit of research and renting. Found so far I like the horror and dark variety best, more adult oriented. Recently rented Biohunter and Fist of the North Star; BH reviews generally panned the movie which I liked, and FNS got great reviews. Fell asleep during that one but will give it a second chance. Just bought Akira, planning to give my theater a workout Thursday with that, Ghost in the Shell (if it arrives in time), Ninja Scroll and Perfect Blue. Also looking forward to Blood when its released at the end of the month. Not a fanatic yet, but its (Anime)sure got my attention