DVD-A has 5X the market share of SACD, despite fewer titles

Discussion in 'Music' started by Michael St. Clair, Apr 23, 2004.

  1. Michael St. Clair

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    http://www.highfidelityreview.com/ne...umber=18483611

    The RIAA survey concludes that DVD-Audio sales in 2003 were over five times the level of competing high-resolution audio disc formats, with a 2.7% market share – up from 1.3% in 2002 – in comparison to SACD’s 0.5%.

    I've always believed that DVD-A was outselling SACD. It's all about giving consumers surround without making them buy new hardware. While we may be interested in better-than-CD stereo, 'regular' consumers are not. And surround is the only hook that might distract the mainstream from iPods and the like.
     
  2. Phil A

    Phil A Producer

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    Michael, I'm fairly sure the statistics are based on DVD-A discs vs. single layer SACDs. Hybrids are excluded. We'll never know the % of people buying hybrids for the SACD layer or who bought the DVD-A disc for the DVD-V layer. There is no way to track hybrids since they are mixed in with CD sales.
     
  3. Michael St. Clair

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    Phil,

    The following are the hybrids that are marketed as CDs and could have decent sales:

    ABKCO Rolling Stones
    Bob Dylan
    Pink Floyd - Dark Side of the Moon
    The Police - EBYTtC

    A drop in the bucket. Not enough sales to boost SACD over DVD-A (not that either are anything to write home about).

    If the latest albums from Beyonce and Christina were stealth hybrid, I'd expect SACD to be outselling DVD-A by a large margin. Classic rock reissues are high profile to older, 'audiophile' guys like us but not to the mass market.

    Also keep in mind that we are talking RIAA survey and not just scan data.
     
  4. Mark Hedges

    Mark Hedges Second Unit

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    I find that hard to believe. I would be stunned if the combined sales from the Rolling Stones hybrids, the Dylan hybrids, and DSOTM were not more that all the DVD-audio disks sold last year.

    This reeks of corporate spin doctors putting the best read possible on the numbers.
     
  5. Todd Phillips

    Todd Phillips Second Unit

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    Here's the link to the report:
    http://www.riaa.com/news/marketingda...merProfile.pdf

    By the way, this was a telephone survey of consumers, and therefore relied on consumer knowledge of the technologies. I wonder how many music DVD-Vs were mis-classified as DVD-As.

    Also interesting from the report:

    Rock genre is the top at 25% with rap/r&b/country trailing at 10-13% each. Comparing this with the list of top selling albums of 2003 makes me question the usefulness of this survey.
     
  6. Phil A

    Phil A Producer

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    The majority of single layer discs released have been by Sony and they have not released a whole lot of stuff recently (as has been noted). As to people confusing DVD-A with DVD-V that happens quite often. I've actually seen on multiple occasions both Best Buy and Circuit City employees tell customers that concert videos as the same as DVD-A.
     
  7. Darryl

    Darryl Stunt Coordinator

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    That could give DVD-A a 2.7% market share without selling a single disk. Of the 5-ish times I've asked where the DVD-Audio section of a store is, I've been taken to the concert DVD-Video section every time but once. If the data came from consumer phone surveys, the only number I even come close to believing is the zero credence I give the results. I'm not anti-DVD-A, but this data is absolutely worthless.
     
  8. Justin Lane

    Justin Lane Cinematographer

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    I would like to see the actual survey/report referenced in this article. If true, this says a lot about Sony's apparent abandonment of the SA-CD format.

    Sales numbers cannot be obtained through survey, so I would assume they used actual data provided by the manufacturers for that portion of the press release. This is the RIAA, so I would also assume they would not put out a report which would purposefully infuriate members who also solely support SA-CD.

    Very interesting indeed.

    J
     
  9. Darryl

    Darryl Stunt Coordinator

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    How This Report Was Compiled
    The Annual Consumer Profile is compiled by Peter D. Hart Research Associates from a monthly national telephone survey (Hart surveyed more than 2,900 music buyers in 2003). Data from the monthly survey, tabulated annually and semi-annually, is weighted by age and gender, and then projected to reflect the U.S. population age 10 and over. The reliability of the data is +/- 1.8 percent at a 95 percent confidence level. The consumer profile is based upon the distribution of units purchased by the consumers interviewed in this survey. This data is separate and apart from the RIAA's annual and semi-annual shipment statistics reports, calculated by PricewaterhouseCoopers.
     
  10. Michael St. Clair

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    Exactly. Sony is one of the most powerful members of the RIAA.
     
  11. Phil A

    Phil A Producer

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    The report also indicates that 2003 was the first yr. collected for SACD purchases and 2001 for DVD-A. The report further indicates that DVD-As outsell music DVD-Vs by about 5-1 and also around the same margin more for DVD-As vs. vinyl, hardly factual data for the real world. Not useful for anything except the people who got paid to do it.
     
  12. Darryl

    Darryl Stunt Coordinator

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    I found this on the same site: http://www.riaa.com/news/newsletter/pdf/2003yearEnd.pdf

    According to this report, which is based off of shipments to stores, 400k DVD-A's were shipped last year vs 1.3 million SACDs. Of course that doesn't indicate how many of those SACDs are gathering dust on shelves...
     
  13. Dennis Nicholls

    Dennis Nicholls Lead Actor

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    Cassette singles? Who the heck ever thought of that dumb idea?
     
  14. Phil A

    Phil A Producer

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    Darryl. I believe (but could be wrong) that report might count hybrids and of course it excludes online sales which likely would take up a huge chunk. The bottom line is that there is little reliable data. We have 2 niche formats that seem to be slowly releasing back catalog stuff and few and far between releases of current titles. Neither format can move past niche until current titles released on the format are commonplace.
     
  15. Darryl

    Darryl Stunt Coordinator

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    ...A dumb idea that sold 80 million a year 10 years ago...
     
  16. Chris_C

    Chris_C Agent

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    hmm....they surveyed 2900 people....hmm

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]


    This "news" is not news, pure obfuscation.
     
  17. Kevin C Brown

    Kevin C Brown Producer

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    I remember a stat in Stereophile an issue or two ago that put forth that *total* SACD/DVD-A sales were a small percentage of ... lp. Based on real sales, not a telephone poll.

    Man, I want at least one of DVD-A/SACD to survive, but they sure could do a better job of selling them.
     
  18. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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  19. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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    But if they are basing results on 2,900 people, a few questions come to mind:

    1. The total people combined with an hirez interest would seem to be around 100. How can one make valid forecasts based on just a hundred people who know what hirez is?

    2. How do we know they called on audiophiles or serious music fans who would be more familiar with the formats?

    3. How do we know the sample included both lower and upper income levels? The RIAA says the hirez customer profile is usually a person of means.

    This seems to be similar to the presidential polls where they call 800 people and try to make the case that the split is indicative of the whole country. It's silly but they keep reporting it.
     
  20. John Kotches

    John Kotches Cinematographer

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    Lee,

    So how does this differ from your Sony/SA-CD cheerleading?

    The RIAA conducted the survey (no external funding) and reported the results. That the DVD-Audio marketing council published the results is only smart marketing which you're now criticizing.

    Time for you to be intellectually honest here, if the results had been in SA-CDs favor, wouldn't you be touting these same results?


    Cheers,
     

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