Dune (Movie ver.) vs. Dune (mini-series) (1 Viewer)

[Nick_Scott]

I have a question-

I loved the Lynch Dune, but I can understand why some people did not like it... Kinda like "The Shining". Its a pretty good movie when NOT compared to the book. Anyway...

But why is DUNE always on every list of "10 worst movies of all time"???

I can understand "Ishtar" and maybe "Waterworld".... but "Dune"?

 

[Adam Lenhardt]

Counting me in as a fan of the miniseries over the Lynch film. The former is an overall successful adaptation of the book. The latter is utter blasphemy that was boring besides.

 

[Randall Dorr]

Yee-Ming

And there are aliens: the time/space folders. (or are they just trained 'pets'?)

Those are severely mutated humans. Guild Navigators eat, sleep and breath melange. That's what they look like as a result.

 

[todd s]

Another couple of things. The actress who played Jessica in the mini-series reminded me of Marina Sirtis. I thought it was her sister. Also, if the Navigators need spice to make the trip through space. What did they do before Arakis was found and how did they get there?

 

[Jeff Kleist]

sublight vehicles, took years/centuries

 

[Todd Terwilliger]

Lynch's version is extremely flawed but I have to say that I love it. The miniseries just didn't do anything for me. I really didn't like the "stage" look that they apparently were going for. To me, Dune needs to feel epic and that is one thing that Lynch nailed and the miniseries wholly was unable to do.

 

[Matthew_Millheiser]

Query: did the freedom fighters of the Butlerian Jihad wore an onion in their belt? Because that was the style at the time....

 

[RayG]

I love both cuts of the Lynch's version that are available, and hope we will see a defintive version someday (though of course we won't). Also I can't get enough of Brian Eno's Prophecy Theme.

 

[Yee-Ming]

Randall:

where does the timeline come from? fascinating stuff, but I don't remember any references in Dune that tie back to our own calendar (save for the 10,191 figure itself). and it's been ages since I read any of the other books.

 

[Dan Lindley]

Randall,

I thank you for this:

"Those are severely mutated humans. Guild Navigators eat, sleep and breath melange. That's what they look like as a result."

Altho, that is a really scary thought... Slip into a dreamy state and wonder what would happen if all someone ate was french fries and all they drank was beer... Presto, a navigator!

But another serious question: they must have evolved over generations, yes? And why don't the Fremen look like that? And what of Paul?

Thanks, Dan

 

[Todd Terwilliger]

Dan,

I think the Guild hypersaturate people far beyond any level of natural ingestion, even at the level of a Fremen, to induce the mutation into Navigators.

 

[Randall Dorr]

Matthew_Millheiser

But another serious question: they must have evolved over generations, yes? And why don't the Fremen look like that? And what of Paul?

I haven't read the Encyclopedia cover to cover, (and there is no entry specifically for Guild Navigators or Steersmen) but it does mention that Steersmen are bred. I assume that applies to Navigators, too. Genetic mutation are induced in a human embryo, and the Steersman/Navigator has their bizarre form from "birth". (There's an illustration of a Steersman in Wayne Barlow's Guide to Extraterrestrials. You can see a small image on the cover.)
Dan,
In your earlier post you mentioned that the Navigators were aliens. I've never come across any info in Herbert's writing (although I still haven't read Chapterhouse: Dune :b ) to indicate there are any creatures of non-Earth origin, but in Barlow's Guide, part of his description for the Steersman reads:
"The Guild Steersmen's planet of origin is lost to history. They are now born, live and ultimately die in the weightless environment of deep space."
This may be an accurate description about the Steersmen's origin, but more likely it is just Barlow taking some dramatic license.
I guess it's unfair to completely rule out the possibility of aliens in the Dune universe, but if there were any, wouldn't they have had a greater presence (or at least have been mentioned a few time) in any of the Dune stories proper? Virtually any story involving aliens deals with them in some direct way. It seems unlikely Herbert would create self conscious beings who originate somewhere other than Earth, only to have them be a glorified footnote.
But sorting out what is or is not official Dune History can be complicated. What is our basis? Anything in Herbert's original six novels should be correct. The Dune Encyclopedia had Herbert's approval, but there may be things in Chapterhouse: Dune (published a year after the Encyclopedia) that contradict it. There are definitely things in the prequels that contradict the Encyclopedia, and (apparently) the original six.
But are we even talking about the books? This thread was started to contrast the film and the miniseries, both of which contradict the first novel in some way. . .
(My fingers are tired, perhaps I'll post more later.)

 

[Yee-Ming]

Randall

thanks for that clarification. I had seen the Encyclopedia in shops once, way back in the early/mid-80s, before I'd read the Dune books. shortly thereafter, the Lynch movie came out and I watched it, before having read the book. (by then, the Encyclopedia could no longer be found -- out of print by then, I guess -- after 1986 or so?)

to say I was confused is an understatement. but a subsequent reading of the book clarified things. I have to say that Lynch's movie is a triumph in production design, casting in some respects, and in bringing to life some of the set pieces, even though overall it does not do the book justice. but what production ever can or will?

 

[Randall Dorr]

Also:
Here's a description of the film Alexandro Jodorowsky was planning to make in the late 70s.
Here are some conceptual designs by H.R. Giger.
And a few ship designs by Chris Foss.

 

[Rich Malloy]

I'm certain that Jodorowsky's version would have alienated the DUNE purists even more than Lynch's.... but I would have loved to have seen it!

If you want some more info on this, rent/buy the DVD of Jodorowsky's first film, "Fando y Lis", and check out the pertinent chapter in the feature length documentary that's included. (BTW, Pink Floyd was envisioned as providing the soundtrack.)

 

[Peter Mazur]

Randall,

Arrakis may contain a north pole, but this is not where they are in the final scene of the movie. It is just a ridiculous moment.

 

[Matthew_Millheiser]

According to the Dune prequels (House Atreides/Harkonnen/Corrino), the Navigators are humans mutated by the spice.

BTW if you haven't read them they are definitely worth the endeavor. Of course, they can't touch Brian Herbert's original novel, but they're much more enjoyable than the sequels. Not classics, but definitely fun reads.

Hell, the prequels are more addictive than sniffing melange off of Halle Berry's abdomen!! Well...

 

[Aaron Silverman]

If only we could go and film a 6 hour miniseries with his cast at that time with those sets

IIRC, in the book EYE, Frank Herbert says that the Lynch film was planned as a 13-hour miniseries, but they couldn't get the financing.

I can see that. . .a lot of that movie is parts of the book strung together with huge gaping holes in between. I remember liking it, but it's been years.

The miniseries had its issues (a mass knife-fight between Fremen and Imperial Pastry Chefs? Worse than the Uzis in Starship Troopers!), but overall was pretty good, especially for a TV movie. And that Chani! Yowza!!!

 

[Randall Dorr]

Here's the introduction to Eye.
Eye is worth picking up for for The Road to Dune, a "walking tour" of Arrakeen with brief description of significant places and persons, and illustrations by Jim Burns.