DLP component vs DVI (1 Viewer)

[Eric Ehedstr]

John_F - I ran through all the settings when I got it, Ill try and pay more attention this time but I don't remember really being able to tell a difference between the modes. I need to try it with the DVD essentials DVD test patterns as well.

BTW, what is the 'native' mode for my DVD player? I understand your therory but the TV and DVD instructions are very 'end user' manuals.. they don't elaborate on the technical details. If I went on the manuals alone I would just switch it to 1080i (assuming its best) and be done with it.

Lets say I had a TV which 1080i 100% capable by both the TV and the DVD player, using DVI. Everything else being the same, what is the best mode to have your TV in? 720p or 1080i? Does the P make up for the I's higher resolution? Said another way, if given the ability to do anything I wanted which resolution/setting would I choose?

FYI - for those who have the HD931 DVD player.. I got mine almost 3 weeks ago and there is a software update available already. I have ordered it and am waiting. I think it helps with the DVI picture but again, I have forgotten where I read that info.. hopefully it mentions it somewhere in the packaging when I get the update.

 

[John_F]

Eric, I am no video expert, so take anything I say with a little skepticism.


I will let someone else answer this. I'm not sure what you mean by "100% capable".

 

[Sam Pat]

Man, this thread keeps jumping everywhere. Sorry for hijacking it earlier.

But for those who are like me, and needed more information about deinterlacing 480i DVD sources, I found a terrific link here. It certainly cleared everything up for me.

 

[Eric Ehedstr]

OMG I had a LONG note that had a URL included in it (samsung.com no less) and the message board gave me a "dont use URL warning and deleted my message!!) I'm not typing all that again.

John_F -- I tried all the resolutions on SW2, 720p was slightly more clear and vivid than 480p.. 1080i seemed jumpy or a little 'empty'. Its really hard for me to tell a difference. Tried them all again on Band of Brothers (HBO series).. its not letterboxed.. but the film style is grainy so can't really check out the resolution differences (filmed like Saving Private Ryan), BUT in 1080i the last line on the screen was messed up.. not sync'ed with the pic.

800-Samsung.. called them regarding the best resolution for my setup, he didnt know so I asked him to have a tech call me back.

DVD player upgrade was for non-sammy TVs using DVI so didn't help me.

I was told there was an upgrade for my HLN507W TV but went to the URL and it didn't work.. couldn't find anything in search either. Oh well, this time I calling samsung was not a big help.

 

[Eric Ehedstr]

Just an update, Samsung never did call me back. The rez of the TV is 720p so thats what I set my DVD player to. Also, that upgrade was for the older version of the 50" DLP.. man that guy wasn't helping at all. BTW, lots of my questions were answered via this FAQ for the Sammy TVs: (can't post URLS) so goto AVSFORUM website and search for thread titled, "My unoffical Guide to Samsung HLN Series DLP Sets".

 

[Andrew Lillie]

John_F and Eric,
All things being equal 1080i displays more information than 720P. Yes it is interlaced, but there are more lines of video information. The difference between progressive and interlaced only deals with the refresh rates of the displayed information.

1080i/p
1080 rows by 1920 columns = 2+ million pixels

720p
720 rows by 1280 columns = 921 thousand pixels

Problem is, only way to see all 1080x1920 pixels natively(or 1920x1080 in PC speak) is on a really good computer monitor and maybe(?) some REALLY expensive Front Projectors.

I think we are all waiting for the day when our displays are natively 1080x1920 and *everything* is converted to 1080p (or i).

Andrew

 

[John Warner]

Just a little comment...
DVI in my oppinion should only be used for HD Satellite inputs. Unless your TV has more than 1 DVI input, which very few do.... why use DVI for a DVD player instead of highgrade Component.... say MonsterVideo3?

 

[John_F]

I believe I have heard of two advantages of using DVI on a DVD player: 1) it may allow the elimination of extra D/A and A/D conversions, and 2) a digital versus analog signal, no noise.

Andrew,

I guess the key here is that "All things being equal" is pretty hard to achieve.

 

[John_F]

... Problem is, only way to see all 1080x1920 pixels natively(or 1920x1080 in PC speak) is on a really good computer monitor and maybe(?) some REALLY expensive Front Projectors. ...

And LCOS RPTVs?

 

[Rick Radford]

1080i/p
1080 rows by 1920 columns = 2+ million pixels

720p
720 rows by 1280 columns = 921 thousand pixels

But:

in 1/60th of a second:
1080i gives 540 lines (rows) x 1920 columns = 1,036,800 pixels
720p gives 720 lines (rows) x 1280 columns = 921,600 pixels

in 1/30th of a second:
1080i gives 1080 rows x 1920 cols = 2,073,600 pixels
720p gives 921,600 x 2 (complete refresh) = 1,843,200 pixels

which is why I believe 720p is preferred for motion and 1080i is preferred for detail. From what I've read, they seem to be pretty much indistinguishable from each other.

For anyone who's researched this: can you really tell any difference between 1080i and 720p? Or does this drop to the level of the cable quality debate?

 

[Andrew Lillie]

Still though, the amount of information presented to the eye:

in 1/60th of a second:
1080i gives 540 lines (rows) x 1920 columns = 1,036,800 pixels = 62 million pixels/second (of displayed info)
720p gives 720 lines (rows) x 1280 columns = 921,600 pixels
= 55 million pixels/second

in 1/30th of a second:
1080i gives 1080 rows x 1920 cols = 2,073,600 pixels = 62 million pixels/second
720p gives 921,600 x 2 (complete refresh) = 1,843,200 pixels = 55 million pixels/second.

Perhaps this is what you are saying? 1080i displays 12% more info than 720p per second.

John_F, you are absolutely right about LCoS... That 57" Toshiba has got native 1080p! Yummm. (of course it weighs 300 lbs and costs 9 G's.)
Andrew

 

[Richard Paul]

Though the 57" Toshiba displays at 1080p it can not accept 1080p. This is not because it would be a significant cost for the TV to accept 1080p signals so much as Toshiba deciding not to include it. I personally think that Toshiba is being a bit shortsighted by not having their LCOS TV's accept 1080p. Also though the 2002 LCOS model is $9,000 the 2003 1080p LCOS model's coming out in September will be $5,500 for the 57" and $7,500 for the 65".

The biggest argument in support of 720p is not that 1080i is worse than 720p, but the fact that the vast majority of current 1080i displays can't do 1920 horizontal lines of resolution. The vast majority of direct view and rear projection HDTV's can't resolve more than 1200 horizontal lines of resolution and therefore have a horizontal resolution lower than 720p's 1280 horizontal lines of resolution. The only type's of CRT's that can resolve 1080ix1920 are 9" front projection CRT's that make up a very small part of the HDTV market. Also I know their are RPTV's that have 9" CRT's, but they are then limited by their fresnel screens which tend to keep their horizontal resolution from reaching 1920. This why people can see little difference between consumer HDTV's displaying 720p and 1080i.