Did I buy the wrong version?

Discussion in 'DVD' started by Meaux, Apr 2, 2003.

  1. Meaux

    Meaux Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    May 27, 2001
    Messages:
    168
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I just bought Red Dragon Widescreen. When I got home and read the back, it says, 2.35:1.
    I have a toshiba 50H81 TV. Should I have gotten the regular version? I really don't want to see bars on the screen.

    I'm new at this stuff, I just don't know. I thought if I have a 16:1 TV, I should buy a "widescreen" version. I notice it dosen't say DTS on it either. I thought all new movies would be DTS.

    Thanks
     
  2. JoeyPalmiotti

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2002
    Messages:
    40
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Late April Fool's joke?
     
  3. Joel C

    Joel C Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 1999
    Messages:
    1,633
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    It's a complicated answer, actually. 16X9 TVs will still show black bars on some widescreen releases, because there are many widescreen ratios. The most common, 1.85:1, will more of less fill a 16x9 TV. But Red Dragon is 2.35:1, which means you will still have thin black bars on the top and bottom. They take up much less screen space than the bars on a 2.35:1 film on a square TV.

    As for the "right" version, yes, you got the right on. You will see the film as originally intended, albeit with the bars. There is no way to NOT have bars, in fact, since buying the P&S version means you will have a square of picture in the middle and big grey bars on the sides.

    The bars go away once the movie starts, just don't look at them!
     
  4. JoshB

    JoshB Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2001
    Messages:
    901
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Real Name:
    Joshua Bal
    DTS does not make the movie. I can see where this debate will be going.....................
     
  5. Meaux

    Meaux Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    May 27, 2001
    Messages:
    168
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    It' no joke Joey, I am that ignorant.

    I forgot to mention that I'm also using a Toshiba SD4800, If I have the right DVD, I guess it dosen't matter.

    Thanks
     
  6. NickSo

    NickSo Producer

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2000
    Messages:
    4,260
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Real Name:
    Nick So
    You got the right DVD.. the bars are supposed to be there... The movie is wider than your TV, so its gotta letterbox it... its normal..

    DTS is a sound format, like dolby digital. DTS is featured on some DVD's not all.
     
  7. clayton b

    clayton b Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2003
    Messages:
    156
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Yeah, on many titles there's nothing you can do to avoid the black bars. It's probably something we'll always be plagued with, considering all the different aspect ratios that film makers use.

    If they bother you that much try one of the different theatre wide modes on your toshiba, you should be able to stretch it to fill the screen. However, you risk losing stuff at the top and bottom then, plus it won't look right because it's... stretched.

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Meaux

    Meaux Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    May 27, 2001
    Messages:
    168
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    OK. I thought DTS was the latest surround sound format and all the new stuff would have it.
    I don't have DTS yet, I only have a McIntosh Mac-3 dolby digital 5:1 proscessor which works pretty dang good for me. I'm lookin for a Mac MSD4, but I'm not in a hurry.

    Thanks
     
  9. Seth Paxton

    Seth Paxton Lead Actor

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 1998
    Messages:
    7,585
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Meaux,

    Take a spin through the "Basics" area of HTF (under the Home Theater section). I think you should find some pretty helpful threads on both widescreen issues and sound formats.

    If you have a 16x9 ratio TV then you want ANAMORPHIC or ENHANCED FOR WIDESCREEN DVDs, though any film lover will tell you to always get the widescreen version even if it's not enhanced/anamorphic.

    And remember that thousands of films were (and sometimes still are) NOT made in a wide aspect ratio. This means that when you get Casablanca or Gone with the Wind and find them not widescreen, that's actually correct. Those will have bars on the sides of your screen.


    The only correct approach generally is to get the ORIGINAL ASPECT RATIO of the film (ie, no P&S or Formatted to fit your screen crap). This is true no matter what hardware you have.

    There are a few rare examples in which there exist 2 different releases of a film where the first was widescreen but non-enhanced, while the 2nd is enhanced (making the 2nd the better choice for 16x9 set owners).

    Finally, 16x9 sets do not mean your days of black bars are over. These sets are just a compromise between the thinner films (1.33:1 ratio), the middle ratio (1.85:1) and the wider ratio (2.35:1) - and I'll leave out some other aspects that you will come across. The idea being that you MINIMIZE the worst cases of black bars on either the top/bottom or sides.

    Well, that was more than I meant to say. :b Again, take the time to swing by Basics. Lots of good FAQs over there.
     
  10. Malcolm R

    Malcolm R Executive Producer

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2002
    Messages:
    13,527
    Likes Received:
    1,103
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Real Name:
    Malcolm

    Then don't watch the bars, watch the movie.

    Bars are your friends. Embrace them. [​IMG]
     
  11. greg_t

    greg_t Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2001
    Messages:
    1,650
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    110
     
  12. KlausWinkler

    KlausWinkler Agent

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2001
    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
     
  13. John Berggren

    John Berggren Producer

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 1999
    Messages:
    3,238
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I recommend watching this film, and others like it, in a dark room. The shape of your TV should dissapear, and the shape of the film should be all that remains. Of course, I like to watch all films in my pitch black theater room, so I wouldn't limit it to 2.35 films.
     
  14. Vince Maskeeper

    Vince Maskeeper Producer

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 1999
    Messages:
    6,499
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    The question of "Does a 16x9 set get rid of black bars forever" is also covered in the FAQ AND PRIMER for this forum, the link is in my signature.

    -Vince
     
  15. Bruce Hedtke

    Bruce Hedtke Cinematographer

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 1999
    Messages:
    2,249
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
     
  16. Aaron Reynolds

    Aaron Reynolds Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2001
    Messages:
    1,715
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
    Real Name:
    Aaron Reynolds
     
  17. Steve Schaffer

    Steve Schaffer Producer

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 1999
    Messages:
    3,756
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    The director's commentary mentions that Red Dragon was shot anamorphic. I take this to mean that a "full screen" version must be pan&scan rather than "open matte."

    I am a bit confused, but I thought some widescreen films were shot 4/3 (is this what's meant by Super 35?) but have the top and bottom matted off for theatrical presentation, so the "fullscreen" version just puts the top and bottom not intended to be seen in theaters back on the screen, ruining the presentation but at least not pan&scan, whereas filming anamorphically means the picture must be panned and scanned to get a 4/3 version?
     
  18. John Berggren

    John Berggren Producer

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 1999
    Messages:
    3,238
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Steve:

    A whole explanation of the different filming methods and ratios can be found in the faqs mentioned earlier in this thread. You can also find different explanations of different means of forcing an image to fit the shape of a TV.

    No option of changing the original ratio simply to fit a different shape is reasonable. The only option that retains the composition is to letterbox. Enhancing it anamorphically allows for a much nicer image on a 16x9 television, or any Hidef television for that matter.

    Keep in mind that in the commentary, they may have mean anamorphic filming, which is on way of saying that they shot for the 2.35 ratio without using super35. You would find that if they used super35 the image would have a lot more grain and be more washed out.
     
  19. Steve Schaffer

    Steve Schaffer Producer

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 1999
    Messages:
    3,756
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    "Keep in mind that in the commentary, they may have mean anamorphic filming, which is on way of saying that they shot for the 2.35 ratio without using super35. You would find that if they used super35 the image would have a lot more grain and be more washed out."
    =====================================

    John,

    Thanks for the information. I'm a longtime convert to OAR, regardless of how it's accomplished, and was in no way advocating open-matte super35.

    In the commentary on Red Dragon, they must have been referring to how the film was photographed rather than the dvd being anamorphic, as they were discussing the difficulty of maintaining focus when filming anamorphically vs super35, something about depth of field which my untrained brain took to mean that objects in the foreground and background could not be in focus at the same time as they are in other films not filmed anamorphically.

    I noted that when focus shifted from the foreground to objects further away, the unfocussed objects seemed to stretch or shrink vertically a bit as the transition occurred.

    I hope I was correct in assuming that a movie filmed anamorphically could not be butchered into a 4/3 shape without constant pan and scan?

    It's sorta funny, I first got into this hobby mainly out of fascination with the electronic gadgetry involved and have since become more and more fascinated with the movies themselves and how they're made. I'm one of the few people I know who will go see a movie because of who directed it rather than who's acting in it.
     

Share This Page