Denon DVD-2800 MKII

Discussion in 'Playback Devices' started by Luis S, Apr 2, 2003.

  1. Luis S

    Luis S Supporting Actor

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    Hey gang, anybody have any experience with this player? Looking for a solid DVD Player within this price range ($600-$700)and I don't need DVD Audio or SACD otherwise I would wait for the 2900. Are there any issues with this player? I know the 3800 had lock up problems and other glitches, but I haven't heard anything regarding this player. Any input would be greatly appreciated as I'm looking to buy soon.

    Thanks in advance!

    Luis S.
     
  2. Charles M Berry

    Charles M Berry Stunt Coordinator

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    I think alot of people will tell you that this player has MAJOR chroma bug issues. I have personally experienced this player in a family friend's setup, and it was very noticable and distracting on his big screen. On the other hand, the face plate and design of this player is one of the best I've seen. Very good build quality, very clean and elegant looking looks. Still, a sexy case is not going to make up for all the jitter from the chroma bug, that is, if you even believe in such things [​IMG].
     
  3. Luis S

    Luis S Supporting Actor

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    Hey thanks for the quick reply. So your saying that other than the chroma bug (that I've never really noticed in the players I've had that suffer from it) It performs flawlessly? No lockups, stutters or other major problems playing discs? I assum the layer change is Denon quick correct? Is the chroma bug worse than say any of the Toshiba's or Sony's? Such as TOS6200, 3109, 4800, or SONY715? Please let me know. I'm eager to get this player if there is no major quality issues concerned other than chroma bug. It's never really botherd me before on my Toshiba 40H80.

    Thanks again.

    Luis S.
     
  4. Edward J M

    Edward J M Cinematographer

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    I have the 2800 MKII as a bridge to the 2900.

    The dealer is letting me keep the 2800 MKII until the 2900 comes in and I will pay the upgrade difference at that time and return the 2800 MKII.

    The 2800 MKII unequivocably has the worst chroma bug I have ever seen - do not buy this model for this reason alone.

    It also has lock-up and drop-out problems on certain DVDs and will not play others at all.

    Here's to hoping the 2900 will live up to it's promise - I'll be glad to see the 2800 MKII leave my rack.

    Regards,

    Ed
     
  5. Luis S

    Luis S Supporting Actor

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    So there are lock-up issues? [​IMG] Damn,I was looking forward to this.Ah well thanks for the warning.I dont suppose the problems were corrected in later build dates? Anyone know? Also whats the ETA on the 2900?

    Thanks again!

    Luis S
     
  6. Tom Moran

    Tom Moran Agent

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    Why not just save the cash and get a Denon 1600, no chroma bug, excellent picture and audio and they can be had for under $500. If you don't need SACD the 2900 seems like you are wasting a lot of cash on a feature you will never use.

    Tom
     
  7. Edward J M

    Edward J M Cinematographer

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    Actually, to its credit, the PQ from the Silicon Image decoding engine is absolutely amazing. IMHO, it is noticeably better than the Faroudja decoding engine used in the 900 and 1600.

    To be honest, the SiI504 decoder and the Chroma Bug free Mitsubishi MPEG decoder is THE primary reason I am staying with the 2900, as DVD-A and SACD are very nice but secondary to HT for me.

    If Denon made a 2900-based DVD player with just the Silicon Image decoder and no DVD-A, no SACD, and no Chroma Bug, for $600 or less, it would sell like crazy.

    Regards,

    Ed
     
  8. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Luis, I agree that you should look at the Denon '1600 and '2900. The '2900 is supposed to be available in May according to DenonJeff over on AVS Forum. The '2900 has a lot of potential.

    Regarding the '3800, Denon fixed the chroma bug and laser assembly problems on later units. If you have a unit built after September 2002, you are fine. I just got a unit built in December 2002, and it is great. It's a wonderful component.
     
  9. Luis S

    Luis S Supporting Actor

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    Hey everybody thanks for all the help. Its so hard (for me anyways...) to find a dvd player Im truly happy with. I did try the 1600 though. It was nice but it kinda bothers me to pay that much ($500) for it.Especially since I can get an xp-50 or xp-30 for -$200 and they're all essentially the same.

    Basically what Im looking for is a nice dvd player in the $700 dollar range with an awesome picture and sound quality and quick layer changes too. From what you guys are telling me the 2900 may be it. A little more pricey but Ill probably save a little more and get it when it hits.Im just concerned because every Denon engineered player has had issues in some form or another. Hopefully that wont be the case with the 2900 [​IMG]

    Ive thought about waiting and picking up a 3800 on the cheap since its replacement according to DenonJeff, the 3900? is on the way. But Ive heard some with the corrected laser are still having some problems. If the price gets low enough though Ill definitely consider it.

    Anybody got any opinions on some older players like the Sony9000ES or dvp-ns900v? Ive been looking for these as well. They're a bit old I know but do they hold up well to todays standards? Will they provide what Im looking for? And more importantly where can I find them?

    Thanks in Advance!
    Luis S
     
  10. Edward J M

    Edward J M Cinematographer

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  11. Luis S

    Luis S Supporting Actor

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    So I guess its gonna be the 2900 then. Sounds promising,hopefully there are no quality issues this time. Any input on the older players I mentioned? Thanks for all the help guys, without it I may have blown this purchase.:b

    Thanks again,
    Luis S
     
  12. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Luis said:

     
  13. NicholasL

    NicholasL Second Unit

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    You know for $200 more you could just get the 3800 (since the 2900 will be $999) which doesn't have SACD, but is arguably one of the slickest players on the market.
     
  14. Luis S

    Luis S Supporting Actor

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    Hmm, whats AL24? Im not exactly familiar with it. I thought the same thing about locating a late build 3800 when the 2900 hits.As I understand the shortages have already started. I believe the 3800 is already discontinued or about to be anyway. The thing with the 2900 is that it gives me a little more time to come up with the extra cash for it otherwise I probably would get the 3800.

    KeithH, You havent had any problems at all with your 3800?No lock ups of any kind? Do you use it for mostly movies or DVD-Audio?

    I guess Im down to a late model 3800 or 2900 when it comes out.Keep the input coming,especially those of you with solid functioning 3800's.Id like to hear your experiences.

    Thanks again,
    Luis S
     
  15. NicholasL

    NicholasL Second Unit

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    I also happen to have the 2800 mkII and now that i've read all these postings, I called Crutchfield. Although I bought my unit 3 months ago, they're letting me return it for it's full value to go towards at 3800. I also called Denon, the 2900 ain't coming out till late April (they estimate).

    Just out of curiosity, since everyone is ranting and talking this and that about the chroma bug, is it really THAT big a deal?
     
  16. Edward J M

    Edward J M Cinematographer

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  17. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Luis,

    Frankly, I am a bit new with Denon's AL24 processing, and I don't have my manual handy to quote it. It is a 24-bit processing algorithm that Denon has been using for awhile in its better audio components.

    Admittedly, I've only had my '3800 for a few days and have had no problems with it. I've used it and will continue to use it primarily for DVD-Audio. However, the December 2002 batch, from which my player came from, is not known to exhibit freezing and skipping on DVDs.

    The '3800 is disappearing fast. Tweeter, 6th Avenue Electronics, and Crutchfield all told me over the phone that their computer systems were showing it as being discontinued. Tweeter stores do not have new units in inventory now. They just have demo units.


    Luis and Nicholas,

    The bad laser assembly was used in '3800s made through September 2002. So, you need to get a unit made after September 2002. In case you are not aware, look for the following information to identify a late-build '3800 (with chroma-bug and laser assembly upgrades):

    * Serial number on outside of box should start with 210, 211, 212, or 3xx. The first number indicates the year of production, so a '2' indicates a player made in 2002, while a '3' indicates 2003. The next two digits indicate the month. So, '10', '11', and '12' indicate October, November, and December, respectively.

    * The build-date sticker on the back panel of the player should indicate that the player was after September 2002.

    When I placed an order for a new '3800 through Crutchfield two weeks ago, I got a September 2002 unit (209 serial number). This was despite the fact that a member here said that he got a December 2002 unit through Crutchfield two weeks earlier. I called Crutchfield about this a few days after getting the player, and they had just 4 units left in stock. I asked them to check the serial numbers on the outside of each box and to be on the lookout for a serial starting with 210, 211, 212, or 3xx. They found a 212 unit, and I got it a few days ago. They let me return the older unit for a full refund.

    If Crutchfield still has the '3800 in stock, have them check the serial numbers. It is obvious that they have been picking from new and old units at random in processing orders.
     
  18. Phil Nichols

    Phil Nichols Second Unit

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    Luis,

    "KeithH, You havent had any problems at all with your 3800?No lock ups of any kind? Do you use it for mostly movies or DVD-Audio?"

    I also have had no problems with my 3800 since I bought it last August. Mine is a February 2002 build and is only the 194th production 3800 built by Denon! So far it plays everything I throw at with no skips/pauses/jumps and also with no layer changes at all that I can notice. I play scratched up DVD's and CD's and it plows right on through as if no scratches were present. It plays DVD-A superbly too. (I do need to CLEAN rental DVD's, however, even though scratches are no problem.) [​IMG]
     
  19. Luis S

    Luis S Supporting Actor

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    Phil, so basically then buying a 3800 is luck of the draw? [​IMG] Man what a dilemma, Id love to go out and buy the 3800 now but then the worry of it being a faulty unit really bugs me.

    I gotta ask though, what's a good price on a 3800,and where? Online of course, the local b&m is a pain to deal with (brandsmart USA) unless any other south Floridians know where else locally I can get a good deal on Denon gear?

    Im really on the fence here, a good price could probably sway me [​IMG] Then again maybe the 2900 would be worth waiting for...

    Keep the 3800 experiences coming though!

    Thanks again!
    Luis S
     
  20. Phil Nichols

    Phil Nichols Second Unit

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    Luis,

    I think it's easy to think that the 3800's issues are serious numerically. However, 3800 production serial numbers I believe are well over 3000, so Denon would have pulled the 3800 off the market with a statistically serious quality problem. I think the actual # of 3800 owners with the pause/skip/jump problem is probably "small" - even though a big deal for those who wound up with a bad unit.

    My company wants PPM quality in units shipped to be so good as to have, maybe, 10 bad units maximum shipped out of 1 million. So for the sake of discussion, say bad 3800's number 100 out of 3000 shipped - this would mean that "only" 3.3% of the 3800's were bad so you might be taking "only" a ~3% chance on getting a bad one. This would be terrible quality for my company, however!

    Two irritating things I did not like in my 3800 were the fact of having to use firmware to eliminate it's chroma upsampling error and it's inherent Y/C Delay that I had to eliminate myself. Newer units have no chroma upsampling error as shipped, but as far as I know may still have the Y/C Delay problem.

    I waited 3 years to get a "good" DVD player, so for me to need a player now but wait a little more for the 2900 over the 3800 would be no big deal - unless you want 3800 build quality, which the 2900 will fall short of.

    The "perfect" player for me would be 3800 build and audio quality with SACD and DVD-A, no Chroma Upsampling Error, no Interlaced Chroma Problem, no Y/C Delay, built-in scaling for both non-anamorphic AND anamorphic, full bass management, Faroudja FLI23XX or Si504 deinterlacing, no layer change, all kinds of adjustments, and ultra-reliability. So ........ my preference would be to wait for the 3800 replacement next fall and "hope" it provided all of this - but it probably won't.

    I recommend waiting for early owner reports on the 2900 or waiting for the 3800 replacement. If you can't wait, get the latest build 3800 you can at the lowest price.
     

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