Denon 3802 vs. 4802 (1 Viewer)

[Timothy J. Trace]

Greetings:

Denon 3802 vs. 4802: so far, I've got...
[*]THX Surround EX (this is probably the biggie, correct?)[*]110wpc vs. 125wpc[*]Three sub crossover points vs. five[*]Two sets component video inputs vs. three[*]Five sets composite/S-video inputs vs. eight[*]Four assignable digital inputs vs. eight[*]Nine analog inputs vs. twelve[*]The remote[*]$895 vs. $1899 street price

What did I miss?

Best regards,

Tim ==

 

[Brandon B]

Single vs. dual Sharc processors
RS232 port (for?)
A&B side surround outputs (or does 3802 have those)
I think you got everything else.
BB

 

[Jeremy Hegna]

Nope.
You forgot the slick little door on the front
Can the 3802 pass high bandwidth signals through the component inputs without degradation?
Jeremy

 

[RyanDinan]

Jeremy,
The 3802 has component inputs/outputs rated at 27MHz, which will NOT pass a HD signal transparently. The 4802 and 5800 both have 50MHz component switching, which is more than enough. HD requires about 36-37MHz for 1902x1080i.
I have the 3802 - But since my 53HS10 can only resolve a max of 1100-1200 "pixels" of the full 1920 (video amp rolls off around 17MHz), it didn't matter much to me anyway
-Ryan Dinan
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[Timothy J. Trace]

Correct me if I'm off in left field, here.
First, my relatively new monitor is a Sony KV-27FV17, which isn't HD. I anticipate having it in use for at least the next three years.
So at first glance, the 27mhz vs. 50mhz component video switching doesn't seem to be worth much in my application, unless...when compared to the picture quality of my Panasonic DVD-A120U connected directly to the KV-27FV17's component input...which is true?
A> I'll somehow magically realize a visual improvement
when routing component video through the AVR-4802.
B> I'll lose visual quality when routing component
video through the AVR-3802.
Second, is THX Surround EX here to stay?
Third, can someone explain "Single vs. dual Sharc processors" to this newbie?
TIA,
Tim ==

 

[GregoriusM]

One very important difference - the much bigger power supply on the 4802.
They had a 4802 with the cover off at CEDIA. One great big round transformer sitting in the middle of the case, and the heat fins running down the right and left sides. Very impressive looking.
... Greg

 

[Kia]

Is the 3802 THX Select certified and/or is the 4802 Ultra/Select certified? Wasnt the 3801 THX Select certified, and if so why would Denon decide to scrap the certification for a higher end model? I'm under the impression that the previous 3801 was THX Select and that the newer 3802 has no certification at all. I know the 4800 is Ultra certified and I believe the same for the 4802. Is there something I got wrong here or is this all accurate?

 

[Doug Broccone]

The 3801 wasn't THX select or otherwise.

 

[Elbert Lee]

The 4802 has a superior preamp stage in build,parts and materials. Of course, you pay for it. Same as when comparing the 3802 with any other more expensive receiver regardless of the number of features. The 4802's power alone should be a step up in sound and should be considered when viewing the differences in price. The 4802 also has DTS 24/96 from what I understand.
There is, however, a valid debate about whether a 3802 w/ external 2-3 channel amp will sound better than a 4802 by itself. Question is: are you more into features or sound? Kenwood makes similarly featured receivers at nearly 1/2 the price of the 3802.
Elbert

 

[Jim_C]

Unless I'm mistaken the bass management settings are as follows:
3802 - 80hz, 100hz, 120hz
4802 - 40hz, 60hz, 80hz, 100hz, 120hz
Maybe it's just me but 100hz and 120hz seem a bit useless to me WRT current bass management thinking. I mean, the higher the crossover point, the easier it is to localize the sub. IMO the 4802 wins big in this category.
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You want to upgrade again?!!
[Edited last by Jim_C on September 11, 2001 at 12:56 PM]

 

[Michael Lee]

I have them both in my house right now--and so far, I think the 4802 sounds significantly better than the 3802 (which is no slouch in any way). The biggest negative so far is that it is not dual-banana-plug friendly. It sounds great-built solid as a rock...unfortunately I cannot hook up my 5800 to compare that to right now.
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[Laurent Balloy]

Hi

Third, can someone explain "Single vs. dual Sharc processors" to this newbie?

In my opinion, the second processor is use for THX. The AVR-5800 (AVC-A1SE) uses 2 the same architecture... and the second Sharc processor is for THX

Laurent

 

[JohnnyN]

$895 vs. $1899 street price

Where do you find these low prices? Is this from a denon authorized dealer? What about shipping? Is this B stock? Refurbs?

 

[Brian]

One minor correction to your list. I believe both receivers will decode THX Surround EX. The 3802 is not THX certified, so they can't use that actual notation. They refer to it as "Matrix 6.1 decoding" instead.
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
-Brian C.

 

[JohnnyN]

Matrix 6.1 is not the same as THX EX.
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Somebody has to pay for retail businesses to let us walk in and audition high quality equipment side by side with our own dvd's and movies. I don't mind paying a premium to support this kind of service and convenience, I wish others would consider this when buying discounted b-stock merchandise from shady internet dealers.
JKB

 

[Timothy J. Trace]

JohnnyN:
The pricing I quoted, before I knew better, is indeed "shady internet dealer pricing".
Well, actually, shady...maybe not. Since I've never seen their operation, whom am I to say?
But I'll tell you this: now that I know better, I'll not forgo a two-year warranty by making a purchase from an unathorized dealer. It appears that Denon is taking the hard line on this one.
Best regards,
Tim ==

 

[Oliver]

And you forgot that the overall quality (build and sound) in in another league with the AVR 4802. If you only look to what more features you get for the price, then this is a mistake. You pay for more quality mainly/also.
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[Timothy J. Trace]

Okay. I've got a local, B&M-only Denon Authorized Retailer dealer offering a first-visit, we-haven't-started-haggling price of $2375 on an ARV-4802. Not bad: $125 off list price, and in my estimation I can probably get him to come off another $50-100 pretty easily. Not bad, or so I thought.
Then, last night, I discovered that Etronics has the 4802 *in stock* for $1749.00 . That's $630 difference, or 25% off list. Ouch! Wow!
Yesterday, I thought I'd fallen off the "Denon Authorized Retailer" fence and was ready to buy from a "good guy." To me, a couple hundred bucks sure looks like cheap insurance on a $2k purchase. But a difference of substantially more than half a grand shoots me right back up on the fence.
All conjecture aside, how can Etronics offer such a low price? They've earned a decent reputation both here and in the Usegroups, so they must not be shipping stuff that fell of the back of a truck on the way to a Denon Authorized Retailer in outer Slobovia.
And what of Yale Audio World? They make big noise on their website about being a Denon Authorized Retailer, but the Denon Dealer Locater refutes that claim.
Which brings me to my final question: whatif I purchase a Denon piece from someone who is no longer a Denon Authorized Retailer when warranty service is required?
Thanks in advance, gang...
Tim ==

 

[Brian Corr]

I think you could get the 4802 from a local B&M for 20% off.
Of course, it helps if you have bought from them before.
I have been told that the denon dealer locator on their site isn't reliable (this from an authorized dealer)
I would be most hesitant (compared to buying from a B&M)purchasing from an online store that has no physical retail location.
I have purchased from B&M's in other states who I have found becuase they also have websites. YOu usually have to call them to purchase things like Denon. They usually claim to be authorized, although a couple have not come up on denon's site as such. However, I feel much more confident buying from a store like this becuase you usually can talk to the owner/manager and customer service is a big part of their business.
I have gotten local B&M's to come down 20% but it takes haggling and a couple visits usually. Calling a B&M out of state simply saves me time becuase they usually come in at 20% right away (on denon stuff).
If etronix pisses you off, oh well, they can make it up selling camera's or something else. It seems much more difficult to speak to someone with a stake in the company, some who has authority to make decisions and who cares.
Also, I'm no lawyer but I would think the burden is on denon to provide a warranty when a valid receipt and warranty card are presented regardless of whether the dealer is authorized. It's Denon's responsibility to distribute their product. I am sure Denon knows where places like etronix are getting their supply and if they wanted to stop them, they could. But why would they limit their sales like that? hummmm.......
Just some things to consider.

 

[JohnnyN]

I could have bought the 3802 for $999 from the Home Theater Store in Houston, but I bought the Denon AVR 4802 for $2300, I figure I could've gotten the salesman down to $2200, but he was sooo extremely patient and helpful in the few days where I made multiple trips back and forth, asked him to try every possible configuration of speakers and receivers, that in the end I figured he deserved to make a good commission on a hard sale. Plus I really like the way the rooms inside the Home Theater Store are setup.
If your question is 3802 vs 4802 I would really suggest you drive your local salesman nuts in helping you decide which one is best for you... Hey, anytime you spend more than $1000 bux on this kind of equipment, get your sales dollar worth.
but as for my 2 cents. it's hard to justify buying 1 4802 when you can get 2 3802 for the same price... but you will spend a good amount of time listening to and enjoying this system, if you can afford it, I think the 4802 will prevent you from feeling the need to upgrade for a really long time..
it has the THX ultra cert, the 3802 doesn't (even though I'm sure it could pass with flying colors, still to some people having the logo matters, myself included)
4802 with the top down looks exactly like the 5800
4802 has significantly more inputs
4802 has dual sharc for better sound processing
I don't know if these improvements in sound quality and design are worth twice as much as the 3802, but they were for me.
Best of Luck.
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Somebody has to pay for retail businesses to let us walk in and audition high quality equipment side by side with our own dvd's and movies. I don't mind paying a premium to support this kind of service and convenience, I wish others would consider this when buying discounted b-stock merchandise from shady internet dealers.
JKB