D-VHS on the way? Studios pledge Support in Thursday's Conference (1 Viewer)

[John Tillman]

I've enjoyed HD for a while now and would love to time-shift for convience, but I can't see going to tape as a solution.

Troy said:

it works with off-the-air signals - Yes, but OTA HD has to be through firewire. There are set top boxes that do firewire out, compatibility - not sure.

I own a Dish 5000 (no modulator) & a 6000 w/OTA card. I haven't looked closely at the market since 9/11 but I don't remember hearing about new STB's w/firewire (I assume no components outs?). What TV sets would a firewired/non component stb go into?

Cablevision, my local cable company, recently released a VOD (Sony) stb w/firewire outs but it dosen't do HD.

 

[Michael St. Clair]

To me you can't have a digital format on an analog device and keep the same consistency/quality. Digital is Digital and Analog is Analog it can't be both.

Maybe you mean optical versus magnetic?

Both optical and magnetic can be either analog or digital.

ps virtually all (probably all, period...maybe not Pixar material and Shrek) of your DVDs were mastered from a magnetic digital video tape.

 

[Julie K]

I am not going back to a medium that degrades with each viewing.

And that's final.

 

[Kevin Coleman]

D-VHS does not degrade with each viewing. It is Digital not analog.
Kevin C.

 

[Julie K]

But doesn't the tape still make contact with the heads? That's a lot more wear and tear than a laser shining on a disc.

 

[RobertR]

D-VHS does not degrade with each viewing. It is Digital not analog

The physical medium DOES degrade with each viewing. That is unavoidable, since it is coated plastic being scraped across very hard metal at high speed. You can't get around that. What you're assuming is that the digital signal will always be robust enough to avoid any noticeable problems from the inevitable effects of physical wear. That may or may not be the case. I'd like to see proof that this is so.

 

[Michael Taylor]

I can't stand tape, no matter what format it is. And yes, D-VHS will still suffer the wear and tear problems as normal VHS. Being digital doesn't make the format immune to being eaten by your player, or alleviate the necessity of having to rewind the dang thing...

 

[JoeDeM]

yes, it does see my last post here
http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htfo...401#post403401

 

[Jay E]

D-VHS does not degrade with each viewing. It is Digital not analog.

Could someone explain why these won't degrade. I know that with regular VHS tapes, the magnetic particles fall off over time. Also, it is very easy to crease & scratch the magnetic tape. I have VHS tapes from 15 years ago and they have noticebly deteriorated. Thanks.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

The signal itself does not degrade HOWEVER, any errors on the tape will no longer be little bursts of static, but full-on signal dropouts, macroblocking you name it.

DVHS will fail as a mass market item. People want, and like a 5" disc medium, and by the time there are enough people with HDTVs out there, there will be HD-DVD, and soon after, HD-DVD recorders

Me? I'm goign to build an HTPC with a nice 80GB hard drive and one of those new cards that will let me record HD right there. Worse comes to worse I'll break up those files and burn to DVD-R, and restore to the HD if I want to watch something in HD.

 

[Todd Hochard]

It is likely that the viewing experience will be equally good for some time after the initial purchase. The tape will wear, however. Given that it is a digital recording, you won't notice the degradation until the error correction scheme can no longer keep up.

At that point, it will look just like DSS dropping out, a scratched DVD, etc- pixelation, macro-blocking and dropouts.

If I can get a deck for $400 with HD Component out and IN, then maybe. Otherwise, no. Which, of course, means no.

To me, the idea is as dumb as a digital LP would've been in the early '80s.

Todd

 

[Jeffrey Forner]

There seems to be a lot of animosity towards magnetic tape-based formats around here. I can understand why. Since many of us have been with this hobby since the days of laserdisc, we've grown use to the concept of a movie not wearing out on us from repeated viewings. For that reason alone, I cannot see this format ever catching on with the general public.

The reason I say this has to do with the fact that the home theater enthusiast typically the early adopter when a new audio/video format is released. If D-VHS follows the launch patterns of every other video format, a player will likely cost a lot more money than your typical VCR (or DVD player for that matter). At these prices, I doubt the Joe Six-packs out there will be busting down the doors at Best Buy to have one. No, the studios need the early adopters to get the format moving, because we're the only ones who will be willing to buy it at first.

The problem is, no one here wants the degredation inherent with a tape format. No one wants to deal with the problem of rewinding tapes. No one here appreciates the lack of extra audio tracks (so useful for commentaries and such). No one here like the elimination of menus and the non-linear design of DVDs, which allow you to jump to anything you want in a matter of seconds. The picture quality of D-VHS may well exceed that of the best anamorphic DVD transfers, but at what cost? And are we willing to make these sacrifices to have that better picture quality? If we don't buy into the format, it will go nowhere.

Of course I realize that as I say all of this, I probably sound exactly like many of the LD enthusiasts when DVD was first announced. Perhaps of the video and audio is that good, we might forget about our gripes now and gladly buy into the format. We'll see. One thing is for certain, the launch of this new format will certainly make things a whole lot more interesting around here.

 

[Mark-W]

When was the last time you heard of a DVD stuck

and ruined because it was "eaten" by the player?

When was the last time you had to take

your DVD player in to be cleaned because

you got a "mucked up" DVD from the rental

store which dirtied the heads?

When was the last time a DVD player

had "dirty heads" from contact?

How much storage space is requred for VHS tapes

as opposed to DVD?

How many consumers think CD is better than

audio tape, and make the same assumption regarding

DVD and VHS tape?

How well have DVD players sold in spite

of the fact that DVD-recording was not available

to most consumers until now?

The answers already tell the tale:

D-VHS will not be a product that consumers

embrace.

As a medium of permanent storage of

consumer entertainment media,

mag tape not a step forward, and

most consumers already think this:

Disc = no contact + durability = excellent choice

Tape = contact + cleaning + fragility = poor choice

Mark

 

[John Berggren]

I'm waiting for HD-DVD. I just don't want to go back to magnetic media. HD-DVD also will be backwards compatible to my current collection (even if I'll likely replace much of it).

 

[Paul W]

I love this quote from the Link Removed

In general, owners of high-end home theater systems have been the same type of consumer that enjoys action adventure movies with a lot of special effects.

Yeah right! Owning an HDTV set makes me a sucka for special fx movies like Independence Day. Sheesh!

 

[Norm]

I'm glad, its time to move to the next level. Now I have a reason to care about getting a HDTV. Now we need FMD-HDDVD, but you know they will box out FMD.

 

[Norm]

People say they will never go back to Tape, but I'm more frustrated with the way these DVDs lock you out, and make you watch FBI warnings, Motion Menus etc. Plus the Bookmark on my Sony player is a joke. Everytime you open your tray to put another Disc in, you lose your spot, and have to dig deep into the Sony remote to find your Bookmarks, my Bookmark buttons are my next most used buttons, second to play & stop!

 

[Brennan Hill]

Ignoring the tape-wear issue for the moment, will this initially give us a preview of the video quality that HD-DVD will eventually present? That is to say, will we finally know the answer to the question of whether we are going to want to someday replace our entire DVD library with HD-DVD based on the video quality alone?

 

[Bill J]

I am starting to feel that the J6Ps have the greatest influence on the home video market. Look at the current pan&scan and widescreen issue, they are slowly getting what they want. All they want to do is watch their Gladiator DVD on their 27 inch TV and have it "fill" the screen. I know you guys can tell the difference of quality between DVD and HD-TV, but I don't think that a J6P will care.

I am pleased with DVD quality right now. I will never go back to a tape and have to rewind it and fast forward it.

 

[Norm]

Jeffrey,

, we've grown use to the concept of a movie not wearing out on us from repeated viewings. For that reason alone, I cannot see this format ever catching on with the general public.

The general public still loves VHS, its easy to use for them, not DVD. J6Ps I know rent, they don't buy alot of tapes. As for them wearing out, that never hurt video rental stores. The only time they replace tapes is when they break.