What DIY sub to match with Maggies for music??? (1 Viewer)

[Stephen White]

HaHa, yea Jack thats what I was thinking when I typed my last post....sure is alot of posts and discussion for me to end up with a Tempest in a Q .5 enclosure using the amp Adire suggested.

Oh well, it wasnt all for nothing. I learned A TON!!!!! If I would have just called Adire and ordered that stuff I wouldnt have learned so much.

Since no one has mentioned any other driver I'm going to go out on a limb and assume the Tempest is the most musical sub I can get without spending a ton of money....Is that right?

Thanks,
STEPHEN

 

[Pete Mazz]

Wow, a sealed .5 Q Tempest enclosure is about 15 cu ft! You sure???

Pete

 

[Jack Gilvey]

Since no one has mentioned any other driver I'm going to go out on a limb and assume the Tempest is the most musical sub I can get without spending a ton of money....Is that right?

I don't know if there's a more "musical" sub for any money...more output is available, though. The new XBL2 driver may be more "musical", in that distortion will be lower across the board.

Like Pete said, .5 is a really big box...is that the one you're planning?

 

[Stephen White]

Whops, no your right, I'm not doing the .577 it was too big, its 24x24x31 + 4"feet so its too tall. The next size is the .707 which is 21x21x21 + 4"feet which is just right for a endtable.

What i plan on doing if you guys think its ok (which Jack I think you said it would be fine), is to blen the two designs and get somewhere in the middle. I was thinking about 24x24x21 + 4"feet. Is there a way to tell what the Q would be with a cabinet that size???

 

[Jack Gilvey]

It'll be somewhere in the middle, and it'll be fine.
You should download LspCAD from Adire, or Unibox, or WinISD Pro at this point and learn to use the design software. You'll learn a lot more.

 

[Jack Gilvey]

Here's a really nice one:
Link Removed

 

[Stephen White]

Jack, thanks for the link. I love the finish on that sub!!!

Well, here is the latest....after getting home from work and breaking out the tape measure I'm afraid 24x24x25 is going to be too big. It didnt seem that big in my head but when I measured it out it seems to big, I dont think it will look right in the space.

Here is what I'm thinking, there is a cabinet for the Shiva with Q=.6(which will be lower than the tempest cabinet) and it is 18x18x22, the design doesn have feet but I dont think it will hurt anything to throw some 3-4" feet on it to get the hieght I need which is 25-26" tall.

Like I said before I'm not really looking for spl and they are both supposed to be very musical. I'm sure the Shiva will provide enough spl for my needs.

The only thing is the design for this Shiva cabinet show the driver mounted on the front of the cabinet....is there a reason it needs to face the front or can I turn it around so that the driver is facing the rear??? Would that affect anything?

The only alternative to this Shiva sub is going with the Tempest bax that has a Q = .707, it would still be a little big for the area but my wife could live with it.

What do you guys think? Tempest with Q= .707 OR Shiva with Q= .6 ????? I'm formost looking for clarity and music.

Thanks,
STEPHEN

 

[Peter Jessee]

The only thing is the design for this Shiva cabinet show the driver mounted on the front of the cabinet....is there a reason it needs to face the front or can I turn it around so that the driver is facing the rear??? Would that affect anything?

You can kill two birds with one stone by putting the driver on the bottom. Those 3-4" tall legs will allow the bass to propagate nicely into the room. BTW, the RAVA is 2.2 cu ft, and has Q=0.67 per Adire's literature, so your design should give slightly tighter and lower bass than the RAVA.

The AVA250 is almost identical to the Parts Express 300-794 amp, which is on sale right now for $119. The AVA250 has been modified to give a slight boost near 20 hz and roll-off below that. You can modify the 300-794 to give the same performance, if you're handy with a soldering iron.

How big is your room? A Shiva with 250 watts driving it will probably play louder than your Maggies can hope to go, so a Tempest's greater output would probably go to waste.

Peter

 

[AndersP]

The 0.6 Shiva will do very nicely Steven and as a matter of fact, all of Peters suggestion would be perfect for you I think.
If you want to play ( THIS IS A VERY GOOD ADVICE!! ), oversize the box to a volume translating into Qtc = 0.5 for the Shiva and then you can utilize the box for Qtc 0.5 to oblivion just by gluing wooden blocks inside of it.
I just thought it was such a terrible waste with all those drivers lying around.
Jack: Congratulations!! Myself, I´m actually swedish.:b I just went here to work, but been here 8 years now the country may have grown on me.
\Anders

 

[AndersP]

Steven: While I´m still at it; Remember that when we´re talking box volume we mean the volume of the inside of the cabinet and everything that protracts in to the cabinet, bracing, reflex tubes, the driver basket and so on must be subtracted from this to give you Vb ( box volume ).
The shape of the cabinet is not important nor is the placement of the driver for subs as long as you dont shoot them directly in to a thin wall or something.
\Anders

 

[Brian Bunge]

There's also the Dayton DVC 15" driver, which will need a slightly smaller enclosure than the Tempest for any given alignment.

Brian

 

[Mark_E_Smith]

I have been looking at some drivers and concluded that the peerless xls looks real good in a sealed box if you count a 6 dB room rise. http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshow...number=297-608
I am thinking of building 2 for my music/HT system. I like tight bass with good transits, also have you looked at Adire's Malestrom its more expensive BUT it apears to need a lower box volume acording to Bass Box Pro.

 

[Stephen White]

Thanks a ton guys, I guess I'll go with the Shiva. Like Peter said with it being paired up with maggies I'm not going to push either one to its limit so in terms of volume its not going to matter. I'll be able to get the cleanest sound out of the Shiva since i can go with the smaller box.

AndersP - can you give me some more info or a link about glueing the wood blocks inside. Do they need to be a certain size or placed a certain way? What about using fill, what would be better the blocks, fill or both??? I probably dont want to over do it haha

 

[AndersP]

OK
On woodblocks: This a mean to change the internal volume of the cabinet. No special size ( if you know how big they are you know how much smaller the volume became ) or placement. You just smacke´m up/in there with a gluegun.
Its not more complicated then Mc Donalds. There´s space in your tummie for a certain amount of QP´s, then it becomes full.
You have decided to use the Shiva right?
Ok, then you will decide what Qtc to use for the system. The internal volume of the box then dictates the Qtc for the system. There are simple on line services for this.
On stuffing: This almost works the other way around. ( more stuffing tighter bass ).
And of course you use both blocks and stuffing to finetune your sub to get what you want. It´s so easy and you can do it without permanently change anything, even while listening. But get the cat out of the room before you start. They love crampy cavities and can very well be caught up in the box when daddy doesn´t see.
When you´re happy you simply stop and kick back!!
If you read through all of this thread you will find that people have already posted you all the links you need. Both on cabinet volume vs. Q and on stuffing.
Didn´t you read them?
Anders

 

[Stephen White]

Ok, I misunderstood your fist post about the blocks. Your saying build the cabinet to make a Q=.5 then add blocks to raise the Q if I want too.

I thought you were saying i could lower the Q with blocks similar to how the fill works. Thats why I asked for some more info cause i didnt think it made any sence.

From what I've been told and read I was to keep it as close to .5 as possible since I'm looking for tight musical bass.

And, yea I've pretty much read every link thats been posted on here.....weather I remember it all or understood it is a different story BUT I did read it haha

Thanks,
STEPHEN

 

[AndersP]

You seem to be on the right track now. I´m sorry if I was unclear in my language about the blocks, but there are reasons and I was excused once earlier on this thread.
Reading my last post, it comes to me that you can of course try your box out without blocks or stuffing and it can even be the perfect choice!
you´re welcome
Anders

 

[Dennis XYZ]

Hey Jack,

How are those DPL12's sounding? Are they still clean up in the 2-300 Hz region? That 16 Hz Fs makes them mucho appealing to use in a full-range tower system if they still sound good up into the midbass.

 

[Jack Gilvey]

That 16 Hz Fs makes them mucho appealing to use in a full-range tower system if they still sound good up into the midbass.

They do model very well in moderate sealed boxes and larger vented, going flat to below 16Hz. Of course, a dipole full-range would be a killer app, and what I'm really considering.Here's a thread on just that.

 

[Dennis XYZ]

Cool, Jack. Keep us posted.

 

[Jack Gilvey]

After more listening, the impression I get from this dipole sub is the same you might get from well-done bass in a car...you get the direct impact from the woofers almost without the room, no modes to speak of. Room gain, though, seems to be all there and then some...does this make any sense acoustically? Certainly the "quickest" I've heard.