The Invisible Man + The Creature from the Black Lagoon Blu Ray Legacy Sets coming 8/28 (2 Viewers)

[crissrudd4554]

I am trying to understand what people are up in arms about here - I've gathered it has something to do with Revenge of the Creature. I'm reading raves about the 3-D screening, so is there or is there not a problem with that on this Blu-ray? Or is the problem solely with the 2-D and if so what exactly IS the problem and how bad is it?

In short the disc is not authored correctly. The 2D Revenge is noticeably soft for a 4K restored version and the 3D version is presented in side by side 3D and presented at about half the resolution it should be. In short they are not full 1080p BD quality. No major problems with Creature Walks Among Us that I’m aware of.

 

[haineshisway]

But there's a post here that says it IS 1080p - which is it? Some people are parroting Mr. Wells and some aren't.

 

[crissrudd4554]

From the responses and from screen grabs posted earlier in the thread, I say they are not. Both Revenge and Walks were remastered in 4K. Walks to my eyes reflects this while Revenge does not in 2D or 3D. Short end there was an authoring mistake with the disc. Bob Furmanek who was one of the men heavily involved with restoring these (he’s also a member of this site) confirmed that this is not how they should look on the new release. Between the time he and his team handed over the restored films to Universal for the release and the discs were made something went wrong. Whether Universal will rectify this remains to be seen. For more details on the controversy I suggest reviewing the last few pages of this thread. Hope this helps.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

But there's a post here that says it IS 1080p - which is it? Some people are parroting Mr. Wells and some aren't.

It's 1080p, but it's authored incorrectly so the effective resolution is far less than that.

For a Blu-ray 3D release, a disc should be authored by using what's called the "framepacking" or "framestacking" method. What this does is encode a full 1080p left eye and a full 1080p right eye view. When you watch it, your player separates the left and right eyes views, and you get a full 1080p in each eye.

What Universal did in this case was to author it using the "side-by-side" method which does not conform to the BD3D spec. In this method, rather than using a separate left eye and right eye view, instead, both the left and right eyes are squeezed into a single 1080p frame, with each eye view taking up only half the frame. So while it's technically within a 1080p container, the actual resolution is only half of that.

 

[Mark-P]

But there's a post here that says it IS 1080p - which is it? Some people are parroting Mr. Wells and some aren't.

Bruce, I’ll try to explain it in layman’s terms. Yes, all three movie files on the disc are indeed 1080p and AVC codec. All the talk of 720p is incorrect. There are two issues. The proper way to author a 3D Blu-ray is with a codec called MVC (MultiView Video Coding) which carries two streams: a primary stream, which can also be played back as 2D AVC and a secondary stream for the opposite eye. Each stream is 1080 X 1920. This disc has no such file. Instead it uses another inferior 3D format that is never used for Blu-ray. Side-by-side 3D has normally been used for broadcast and streaming. Side-by-side takes the two eye-view images, squeezes them to half-width and places them side-by-side. Therefore each eye-view is only 1080 X 960, thus half the resolution. Most 3D TVs are capable of stretching the image back out to its correct dimension and showing the images sequentially just like MVC. The result is that each eye now has only has half the resolution. The second issue is that the 2D version of Revenge of the Creature looks bad, like an upconversion. My speculation as to why the 2D version looks this way is that the people who authored the disc may have just extracted one side of the side-by-side file and rescaled it to 1080 X 1920.

 

[haineshisway]

Thanks to Josh and Mark-P - those explanations make sense to me. Sounds like Universal has some 'splainin' to do.

 

[Bob Furmanek]

Quick, call Jeff Wells!

 

[Timothy E]

This is what I wrote to Universal via e-mail:

I purchased the Creature From the Black Lagoon Blu-ray Legacy set for the purpose of seeing Revenge of the Creature in 3D. Unfortunately, the 3D version has been encoded incorrectly in a format not meeting Blu-ray specifications. The result is an image that is far below 1080p and actually will not play on many consumers' devices.

This is the description on your own website of the 3-D Blu ray spec on Universal discs: "Blu-ray 3D™ utilizes an advanced technology, "Frame sequential 3D", that offers a crisp, clear High Definition 3D picture. Blu-ray 3D™ offers you 1080P High Definition stereoscopic images for both your right and left eye utilizing the full wide array of colors available on Blu-ray™."

The 3-D version of "Revenge of the Creature" is not encoded properly in the MVC codec in "frame sequential 3D" as set forth on your website specifications, and is essentially false advertising since the packaging claims to provide a 3D version according to proper Blu-ray specs.

Please provide information about a replacement disc at your earliest convenience. If replacement discs are not offered, I intend to return the set for a refund.

 

[Matt Hough]

I find it very strange that Universal never considered that with the first Creature 3D in the same set and done properly, people not in the know would be very confused when the second 3D feature Revenge didn't work like the first one when they tried to play it. Seems like very shortsighted thinking on Universal's part if this side-by-side presentation was actually deliberate and not a mistake.

 

[Nelson Au]

This thread had me re-evaluate my Monsters collection.

I’ve always been a Frankenstein fan, so along with the original Classics monsters blu ray set from 2012, I added the Frankenstein legacy set. After the positive vibe from Josh on the Mummy set, I picked that Legacy set up. I know the sequels are of varying quality, but I’ve never seen them. The thing about the Frankenstein legacy set is that the Frankenstein sequels served also as some sequels for The Wolfman. Which you guys know. Having not seen all the Frankenstein sequels until I picked up the blu ray Legacy set, and earlier the DVD Legacy set, it’s been cool to finally see several of them. I still have to see House of Frankenstein and House of Dracula.

So I’m torn about adding the Wolfman Legacy set as you know, the sequels are in the Frankenstein set with the exception of She-Wolf of London and Werewolf of London. So buying the set would be for two films which I’ve never seen. I was surprised to learn June Lockhart is in She-Wolf.

While we wait for the Creature From the Black Lagoon Legacy set clear-up on the 3-D problem, I picked up the Invisible Man Legacy set as I’ve never seen the sequels. I did see the Abbott and Costello film, but that was ages ago. Hopefully Universal clears up what the Creature 3-D issue is. It looks like a big mistake and not anything done on purpose.

I also picked up the Kino release of the earlier Phantom of the Opera which I’ve not seen either the early or later versions.

That leaves Dracula. I’m not a huge Dracula fan of late, but I want to revisit the original film. I know it’s a really good film and made Bela Lugosi. As a kid I read the book and saw the film several times. I have yet to watch the Blu-ray in the Classics set. Like Frankenstein and Bride of Frankenstein, I’m sure it looks fantastic! I know it’s very atmospheric.

The completist part of me wants to collect the Dracula Legacy set and the Wolfman Legacy set while I still can. But I’m thinking I’d be re-buying some titles I already have in other sets and I’d be gaining a few new titles which I may or may not like. So I’m torn.

And I hope that The Black Lagoon Legacy set is sort out soon. Maybe the Dracula set would be the next set to pick-up, though only two titles would be new to me, Dracula’s Daughter and Son of Dracula. It’s not too expensive. I’d be interesting in any input from you guys, thanks!

Writing all this down kind of makes me want to watch a few episodes of The Munsters!

 

[CarlosMeat]

I've watched it several times but I never really thought that The Creature From The Black Lagoon was a very good movie except for this...

 

[BobO'Link]

This thread had me re-evaluate my Monsters collection.

I’ve always been a Frankenstein fan, so along with the original Classics monsters blu ray set from 2012, I added the Frankenstein legacy set. After the positive vibe from Josh on the Mummy set, I picked that Legacy set up. I know the sequels are of varying quality, but I’ve never seen them. The thing about the Frankenstein legacy set is that the Frankenstein sequels served also as some sequels for The Wolfman. Which you guys know. Having not seen all the Frankenstein sequels until I picked up the blu ray Legacy set, and earlier the DVD Legacy set, it’s been cool to finally see several of them. I still have to see House of Frankenstein and House of Dracula.

So I’m torn about adding the Wolfman Legacy set as you know, the sequels are in the Frankenstein set with the exception of She-Wolf of London and Werewolf of London. So buying the set would be for two films which I’ve never seen. I was surprised to learn June Lockhart is in She-Wolf.

While we wait for the Creature From the Black Lagoon Legacy set clear-up on the 3-D problem, I picked up the Invisible Man Legacy set as I’ve never seen the sequels. I did see the Abbott and Costello film, but that was ages ago. Hopefully Universal clears up what the Creature 3-D issue is. It looks like a big mistake and not anything done on purpose.

I also picked up the Kino release of the earlier Phantom of the Opera which I’ve not seen either the early or later versions.

That leaves Dracula. I’m not a huge Dracula fan of late, but I want to revisit the original film. I know it’s a really good film and made Bela Lugosi. As a kid I read the book and saw the film several times. I have yet to watch the Blu-ray in the Classics set. Like Frankenstein and Bride of Frankenstein, I’m sure it looks fantastic! I know it’s very atmospheric.

The completist part of me wants to collect the Dracula Legacy set and the Wolfman Legacy set while I still can. But I’m thinking I’d be re-buying some titles I already have in other sets and I’d be gaining a few new titles which I may or may not like. So I’m torn.

And I hope that The Black Lagoon Legacy set is sort out soon. Maybe the Dracula set would be the next set to pick-up, though only two titles would be new to me, Dracula’s Daughter and Son of Dracula. It’s not too expensive. I’d be interesting in any input from you guys, thanks!

Writing all this down kind of makes me want to watch a few episodes of The Munsters!

I own them all - several times (both the original, DS, Legacy sets, the DVD re-issues, and now BR). I love the classic Universal Horror films. Here's my opinion.

She-Wolf of London and Werewolf of London are interesting, mostly for the cast members, and I'm glad I have copies. She-Wolf is the weaker of the two and is more of a murder mystery than a horror film. They don't receive the level of attention from me as does the original, The Wolf Man, and I only recommend them to completists or people who love the werewolf genre of films. Still... if you can get the set cheaply enough, something in the $10-$15 range, I'd say go for it.

I'd recommend the Dracula Legacy set just for Dracula's Daughter. It picks up where Dracula ends and is surprisingly good and atmospheric. Son of Dracula is also fairly good, worth a couple of viewings, and sports some good visuals of Dracula transforming into a bat and a mist. It features Lon Chaney, Jr. as Dracula. While he's not as effective as he is in The Wolf Man, he does a good job. The Blu-ray of Dracula presents the film better than it's ever looked and sounded. All of the problems with the various DVD releases have been cleared up. Of course you'd be purchasing the set just for those 2 films so, again, look for a "bargain" price, although I'd go higher for this one than the Wolf Man set as I feel the films you don't have are stronger in this case. The problem is it tends to sell for ~$20 on the low side. That could easily change come October with Halloween sales so I'd definitely keep my eyes open for both around that time.

When it comes down to it, the prices on these sets are quite reasonable for the number of films included, even with all the duplication of titles.

The one thing I've never understood is why Universal ignores the silent Phantom of the Opera with Lon Chaney in favor of the much weaker musical version with Claude Rains. It, too, deserves the "Legacy" treatment with all available versions of the silent and the musical in a single package. Oh well... I, too, have the Kino BR and the musical in the Classic Monsters BR set.

 

[crissrudd4554]

The one thing I've never understood is why Universal ignores the silent Phantom of the Opera with Lon Chaney in favor of the much weaker musical version with Claude Rains. It, too, deserves the "Legacy" treatment with all available versions of the silent and the musical in a single package. Oh well... I, too, have the Kino BR and the musical in the Classic Monsters BR set.

The Chaney film is in public domain so likely Universal probably feels they would be losing out on money including a film that basically anyone can use. Since they still own the ‘43 film (which I don’t mind that much tbh in spite of its flaws) and because it was made during the time the other classics were made they probably feel it’s better than nothing. Not really what the fans want but at least an attempt was made to represent the character.

 

[Nelson Au]

Thanks for the feedback Howie! That’s really helpful. I had purchased the earlier first issues of the monsters on DVD way back in the day. When the Frankenstein Legacy on DVD came out, I got that as well. So i’ve enjoyed the monsters going back, but never delved in to the sequels. The new blu rays just make those DVD’s look ancient.

I think i’ll go for the Dracula Legacy set for sure and looks like I might as well go all in with the Wolfman Legacy set.

 

[Tony Bensley]

Thanks for the feedback Howie! That’s really helpful. I had purchased the earlier first issues of the monsters on DVD way back in the day. When the Frankenstein Legacy on DVD came out, I got that as well. So i’ve enjoyed the monsters going back, but never delved in to the sequels. The new blu rays just make those DVD’s look ancient.

I think i’ll go for the Dracula Legacy set for sure and looks like I might as well go all in with the Wolfman Legacy set.

Hi Nelson!

Just a word of caution that for WEREWOLF OF LONDON (1935), there is a significant volume drop that occurs just past the 56 minute mark, and remains lower for the remaining 18 or so minutes of the film. Some viewers are bothered by it (Including myself, but I live with it!), and some aren't. Your mileage might vary regarding this.

CHEERS!

 

[Nelson Au]

Thanks Tony for the warning. Good to know!

 

[BobO'Link]

Hi Nelson!

Just a word of caution that for WEREWOLF OF LONDON (1935), there is a significant volume drop that occurs just past the 56 minute mark, and remains lower for the remaining 18 or so minutes of the film. Some viewers are bothered by it (Including myself, but I live with it!), and some aren't. Your mileage might vary regarding this.

CHEERS!

You know... I was either not bothered by this or just turned the volume up. It's hard to recall as I've only seen that particular film 3 times. Once for each version of the Legacy releases I've purchased.

 

[Tony Bensley]

You know... I was either not bothered by this or just turned the volume up. It's hard to recall as I've only seen that particular film 3 times. Once for each version of the Legacy releases I've purchased.

The previous WEREWOLF OF LONDON (1935) DVD releases, and Elephant Films Blu-ray didn't have this issue, only the current Universal Legacy Blu-ray. I suspect it was probably some kind of weird audio encoding issue. I did notice a popping sound on the 2004 DVD right where the volume dip occurs on the Legacy Blu-ray. Perhaps it didn't agree with Universal's encoding method that was used on that Blu-ray?

CHEERS!

 

[Malcolm R]

I hope we hear something from Universal soon. Jurassic World: Fallen Kingdom is out in a couple weeks and I need to know if I have to cancel my 3D pre-order.

 

[Todd Erwin]

I noticed that the BFI logo appears on THE INVISIBLE MAN packaging .Anyone know what they had to do with it? I assume they provided some elements (?). Beautiful transfers!

I believe they did. Back in 2012, at the HTF Hollywood Meet, the folks at Universal Home Video showed us examples of some of the exhaustive restoration work they had to complete to restore The Invisible Man using several different prints, the best one, I think they said, came from the BFI. They also had to recreate a few frames digitally to replace missing frames by using the frame before and after that was missing. It was quite an extraordinary demonstration.