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The Green Knight (2021) (1 Viewer)

Josh Dial

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it's kind of a gray area... certain films gets a DCP to Dolby Cinema in DV commercially, but not this title. unless you ask Lowery/DP/creatives directly, we'll likely never really know.

also, if you been around long enough the whole "reproducing creative intent" is very much a huge chasm from what editors/colorists/creatives are seeing vs. consumers. just google Seven home media colors. there are at least 5 to 7 variations on the color timings... and that's from one of the most OCD directors of all time! he has little to no control as to how the home media carries out what his original creative intent is.

Not really.

I go to a movie in a theatre. Unless it's been Alan Smithee'd I must conclude that the theatrical exhibition is as close to the artistic intent of all involved. There are exceptions for directors and writers, but that beyond the scope of this comment. I'm talking about DPs and how scenes are lit and exhibited.

So I see the movie in theatre. When I watch it at home, I want to see the colours and lighting I saw in the theatre. If I see anything more or less than what I saw in the theatre--whether by HDR or Dolby Vision or machine-learning/algorithm-driven real time processing from a set-top box--I consider it to be a departure from the original intent. The creatives know the movie theatre projectors can't do 1000 nits. If I see an explosion push 1000 nits at home then, frankly, that's not what I saw in the theatre.

Similarly, if a human (be they restoration personnel or even the original creative) tinkers with the home production and gives me colours or lighting that I didn't see in theatre, I consider that to be a departure from the original intent. If a director says the home version is in-line with creative intent despite all evidence pointing to the contrary (see, most notably, Peter Jackson and the Lord of the Rings trilogy on blu-ray), then I'm entitled to disbelieve that person.

When I ultimately watch The Green Knight on 4k in my house on my projector, I expect to see as close to what I saw in the theatre as possible. If that means some scenes are dimly lit, so be it. I'll consider that a win.
 

JediFonger

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Not really.

I go to a movie in a theatre. Unless it's been Alan Smithee'd I must conclude that the theatrical exhibition is as close to the artistic intent of all involved. There are exceptions for directors and writers, but that beyond the scope of this comment. I'm talking about DPs and how scenes are lit and exhibited.

So I see the movie in theatre. When I watch it at home, I want to see the colours and lighting I saw in the theatre. If I see anything more or less than what I saw in the theatre--whether by HDR or Dolby Vision or machine-learning/algorithm-driven real time processing from a set-top box--I consider it to be a departure from the original intent. The creatives know the movie theatre projectors can't do 1000 nits. If I see an explosion push 1000 nits at home then, frankly, that's not what I saw in the theatre.

Similarly, if a human (be they restoration personnel or even the original creative) tinkers with the home production and gives me colours or lighting that I didn't see in theatre, I consider that to be a departure from the original intent. If a director says the home version is in-line with creative intent despite all evidence pointing to the contrary (see, most notably, Peter Jackson and the Lord of the Rings trilogy on blu-ray), then I'm entitled to disbelieve that person.

When I ultimately watch The Green Knight on 4k in my house on my projector, I expect to see as close to what I saw in the theatre as possible. If that means some scenes are dimly lit, so be it. I'll consider that a win.

that assumes there is a single monolithic version of a film. how do you deal with imax 1.43 movie vs home front when it is not in 1.43?
 

JediFonger

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Not really.

I go to a movie in a theatre. Unless it's been Alan Smithee'd I must conclude that the theatrical exhibition is as close to the artistic intent of all involved. There are exceptions for directors and writers, but that beyond the scope of this comment. I'm talking about DPs and how scenes are lit and exhibited.

So I see the movie in theatre. When I watch it at home, I want to see the colours and lighting I saw in the theatre. If I see anything more or less than what I saw in the theatre--whether by HDR or Dolby Vision or machine-learning/algorithm-driven real time processing from a set-top box--I consider it to be a departure from the original intent. The creatives know the movie theatre projectors can't do 1000 nits. If I see an explosion push 1000 nits at home then, frankly, that's not what I saw in the theatre.

Similarly, if a human (be they restoration personnel or even the original creative) tinkers with the home production and gives me colours or lighting that I didn't see in theatre, I consider that to be a departure from the original intent. If a director says the home version is in-line with creative intent despite all evidence pointing to the contrary (see, most notably, Peter Jackson and the Lord of the Rings trilogy on blu-ray), then I'm entitled to disbelieve that person.

When I ultimately watch The Green Knight on 4k in my house on my projector, I expect to see as close to what I saw in the theatre as possible. If that means some scenes are dimly lit, so be it. I'll consider that a win.

latest bond for example will be on imax, 3D and prolly dolby vision hdr pass as well
 

Josh Dial

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that assumes there is a single monolithic version of a film. how do you deal with imax 1.43 movie vs home front when it is not in 1.43?

There is a single monolithic version of a film--or at least as close as we can get. It's the one released in theatres. That may represent compromise by some (or many) creatives, but when you are dealing with that many artists compromise is the best you can hope for.

For changing aspect ratios: I do find them problematic. If the original aspect ratio (also a tent pole of this forum) is not (or cannot be) reproduced at home then I consider the home release to be marred.

3D is the only argument "against" a single version of a film. For movies exhibited in both 2D and 3D I would grant that there are two versions.
 

JediFonger

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There is a single monolithic version of a film--or at least as close as we can get. It's the one released in theatres. That may represent compromise by some (or many) creatives, but when you are dealing with that many artists compromise is the best you can hope for.

For changing aspect ratios: I do find them problematic. If the original aspect ratio (also a tent pole of this forum) is not (or cannot be) reproduced at home then I consider the home release to be marred.

3D is the only argument "against" a single version of a film. For movies exhibited in both 2D and 3D I would grant that there are two versions.
matrix 1 green, freikin the french connection that he himself supervised. the list goes on. i dont think there is a monolithic version from pq perspective
 

Reggie W

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Could be from Criterion. A24's got a relationship with them.

I did read a rumor that Criterion is going to do this so I guess that is possible. And yes, Uncut Gems was an A24 picture so maybe. I do think Criterion has been working with the Safdie brothers though and wanted to put out a couple of their pictures. Uncut Gems obviously and I think they are working on Daddy Longlegs too. At least I heard that. If they do this picture from Lowery that would be interesting. I'm good either way and in this case a Criterion would cost less to purchase than an A24 special edition as those are cool but pricey.
 

Jake Lipson

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Thanks for posting this. I would probably not have seen that otherwise.

I was going to buy the version coming out on October 12, but with this information I'm thinking that I might wait for the more elaborate edition to avoid a double dip.
 

JediFonger

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Thanks for posting this. I would probably not have seen that otherwise.

I was going to buy the version coming out on October 12, but with this information I'm thinking that I might wait for the more elaborate edition to avoid a double dip.

like others have speculated: A24 may put together a special edition and if they do i would make sure you subscribe to A24 newsletter for announcements. for example midsommar dc just came back into stock. so if you want to then i’d def subscribe to them.
 

Jake Lipson

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I already subscribe to them so that should be no problem.

Edit: I just went to the A24 website and looked over some of their other releases. They look like they are very nicely put together with a lot of worthwhile stuff. But they are currently $50 shipped. If that is what Lowery is talking about for this film, I think I'm out. I'm a big fan of his work and I loved this movie, but I've never paid $50 for a single movie. I would like to hear his commentary, but there is such a price difference between the standard release (which is now running $21.99 on Amazon) and the fixed prices of these fancy A24 editions that I think the former is more in my price range. So I've now talked myself back into reinstating the pre-order for the release coming later this month and I'll probably be just fine with that.
 
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Reggie W

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I already subscribe to them so that should be no problem.

Edit: I just went to the A24 website and looked over some of their other releases. They look like they are very nicely put together with a lot of worthwhile stuff. But they are currently $50 shipped. If that is what Lowery is talking about for this film, I think I'm out. I'm a big fan of his work and I loved this movie, but I've never paid $50 for a single movie. I would like to hear his commentary, but there is such a price difference between the standard release (which is now running $21.99 on Amazon) and the fixed prices of these fancy A24 editions that I think the former is more in my price range. So I've now talked myself back into reinstating the pre-order for the release coming later this month and I'll probably be just fine with that.

Yes, the A24 editions are nice but you will pay a premium for them. I like this picture enough that I would purchase an A24 special edition if one appears. They do only print so many on each run so they do sell out but then they bring them back in stock.

With the Midsommar special edition obviously the big draw was the director's longer cut of the film came with the package. I guess there was a longer and different cut of The Green Knight as well. When Covid delayed the release of the film Lowery took another look at it and decided to completely recut it, giving us the version we've all seen in theaters. Not sure if the pre-Covid cut still exists in any form but if it did, that would be a very worthwhile addition to an A24 pricey special release. However, Lowery does not mention this so does not seem like we will see that.
 

Jeff Adkins

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With the Midsommar special edition obviously the big draw was the director's longer cut of the film came with the package.
That was one where I had to draw the line. The longer cut in 4K was a bonus on the iTunes edition which I bought for $10. I prefer physical media, but the price difference was just too much considering there really weren't any other extras on the $50 disc.

I'll get the upcoming version of The Green Knight because I don't want to wait another year, but I might be willing to double dip next year if the extras are thorough enough.
 

Jake Lipson

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I guess there was a longer and different cut of The Green Knight as well. When Covid delayed the release of the film Lowery took another look at it and decided to completely recut it, giving us the version we've all seen in theaters. Not sure if the pre-Covid cut still exists in any form but if it did, that would be a very worthwhile addition to an A24 pricey special release. However, Lowery does not mention this so does not seem like we will see that.
I can't speak for Lowery but I don't think the early cut currently exists in the sense of a releasable version of the film. Every movie has an early cut and then the director refines it to get to what they want. It seems to me that the theatrical release is the version that Lowery wants the film to be, I think Midsommar was longer because the theatrical cut was shorter for running time reasons. That's not the same reason Lowery continued to work on Green Knight. So I would be surprised if there was a longer cut. But we'll see.

I don't know if there is any film which I would pay $50 for for a single title. Even Criterions and limited run steelbooks I can get for less than that. So I think the upcoming Lionsgate version of The Green Knight will probably do for me, although I reserve the right to change my mind once I see specific details and pricing for the double dip.
 

Reggie W

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I can't speak for Lowery but I don't think the early cut currently exists in the sense of a releasable version of the film. Every movie has an early cut and then the director refines it to get to what they want. It seems to me that the theatrical release is the version that Lowery wants the film to be, I think Midsommar was longer because the theatrical cut was shorter for running time reasons. That's not the same reason Lowery continued to work on Green Knight. So I would be surprised if there was a longer cut. But we'll see.

I don't know if there is any film which I would pay $50 for for a single title. Even Criterions and limited run steelbooks I can get for less than that. So I think the upcoming Lionsgate version of The Green Knight will probably do for me, although I reserve the right to change my mind once I see specific details and pricing for the double dip.

Well, in this case the other cut was a finished cut. The film was done and ready to release. Then they delayed it and he decided to look at it again. When he did he felt it was too slow and did not like the pacing. This is why I thought it may be possible that version may exist. It was not an assembly or just some sort of preview, the film was done and set for release.

I agree that this version is the one he prefers but as I understand it he considerably changed the film when he returned to it so I just thought it would be interesting to see why and what he changed. Had there not been a delay in releasing it we would have seen that version.
 

Jake Lipson

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This is a random surprise.

Two theaters around me -- a Cinemark and an AMC -- are opening The Green Knight again on Friday despite the fact that it already played in those theaters back in July and August. It appears that A24 must be pushing a nationwide re-release for some reason.

I loved the movie and was happy to see it in a theater over the summer, but I've already got the disc. So I personally see no reason to go back to it this weekend instead of seeing West Side Story or another new release.
 

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