"Star Trek" Universe in "Decay"? (1 Viewer)

[Jeff Kleist]

Voyager just went from abysmally dull to barely watchable. It was never "good"

What needs to be done is that they need to figure out what makes something good, and ripping off Yamato is not going to do it.

 

[Marvin Richardson]

Voyager just went from abysmally dull to barely watchable. It was never "good"

Eh, I thought it went from decent in the premiere to complete crap with the second episode "Parralax" with the first of many MANY uses of the words "spatial" and "distortion". Add in "temporal" and "instability" and I think you've covered all the Voyager episodes. I thought it was funny when they brought in Jeri Ryan to play the sex-obj...I mean sympathetic supporting character on a journey of self re-discovery. Oh well, at least Jeri Ryan was nice to look at.:rolleyes

 

[Nelson Au]

"Who do Berman and Braga have naked pictures of?" LOL, that was a good one!

I posted that post from Trekweb to just bring another point of view here. I thought it had a few good points, I see some truth there.

Am I a defender of Trek, the Franchise or good television? I just want to see Trek at it's best. I want to see Trek become as great as it was from the time of the beginning. If B & B's new plans for the 3rd year work, then great, if not, then this thread and ones like it could just keep happening.

I'm hoping for the best. And as Jack has often mentioned, I've got TOS and TNG and DS9 on DVD to enjoy.

Oh, regarding the earlier post about the mainstream press going after Trek, I suspect they could hear the rumblings, smell blood and knock Trek while it's down just to sell magazines. The latest TV Guide cover with Stargate on it is a good example.

Nelson

 

[Darren Haycock]

In regards to those episodes of Voyager, don't forget about the many many holodeck episodes...

"Well, it looks like we're stuck in 18th century Ireland and a bloodthirsty mob is trying to burn us for witchcraft. Oh yeah, and the safety protocols are offline...AGAIN!"

:rolleyes

 

[Glenn Overholt]

Ok, so TNG never used the holodeck as an episode?

This is where/how to star a war. What is a good episode? What is a good series? Can anyone here plan 7 years of plots - that haven't been done before?

If you could put all of the plots from every episode of every show into a database, I'm sure that you'd find several of them just like an episode from another series.

That was a gross understatement, and you know what I mean.

One of my favorites from TOS was The Trouble with Tribbles, and even it was redone. I liked the remake too, but you have to keep on remembering what happened in the first one while you are watching it, and that is what this whole mess is about.

We do the same thing with movies - especially the teen/boy & girl. There have been so many lately that are almost the same it isn't even funny.

I do think that some of you got caught up in Patrick Stewart's acting in TNG. He did have a commanding presence, but you end up going into the - did the actor make the movie, or did the movie make the actor - circle.

And no one will admit that having a female captain on Voyager ruined it. Nope, that isn't PC. She was a great captain, and got better as the series went on and on, but the point is - we are going to find something to bitch about, no matter what they do.

Now we have Enterprise, and I wonder if the current bitching is as bad as the bitching was for Voyager. The problem now is that we have seen EVEN more plots, and that ho-hum, this has been done before, shows up more and more.

Enterprise is sort of stuck. They cannot - ok, they should not, introduce anything that showed up in TNG or later, because it hasn't been invented/thought up of yet. What is left? Get a sheet of paper out and write plots for the next 5 years, and see how far you get.

No, I'm not saying that B&B is doing this right. I have no idea what they have up their sleeves. Maybe it is really good, but they knew going in that they were limited to ideas, and I am sure that they knew they could get it through all 7 years with plots. As to some of them being like plots of other shows, well that happens.

Look at other TV shows. How many times has anyone watched a show and thought, Oh, they did this same thing on that other series?

This is a great discussion, and something to think about. I'll leave you with this final thought. Let's say they came up to you and said, "You're in charge of the next Star Trek series, and you can do anything that you want to.

Could you do it?
Glenn

 

[Jason Seaver]

Let's say they came up to you and said, "You're in charge of the next Star Trek series, and you can do anything that you want to.

Could you do it?

Hell, yes. The first thing I'm doing is driving a Brinks truck up to Ira Behr's, Ron Moore's, and Jane Espenson's homes. When/if they turn me down, I create a basic outline for a "Birth Of The Federation" arc, and take the contents of that Brinks truck and send it to Vernor Vinge, David Brin, Timothy Zahn, Grant Morrison, Larry Niven/Jerry Pournelle/Steven Barnes, Ben Bova, Gregory Bendord, that absolute loon who writes the Manfred Mancx stories for "Asimov's", and anyone else I can find saying we want to blow people's minds.

And then I take the results of this brainstorming and split it evenly between Enterprise and my Jake Sisko, Reporter series (whose thread sadly no longer appears to be on the server). I have given this situation some thought.

 

[Rex Bachmann]

Glenn Overholt wrote (post #45):

We all knew---or should have known---going in that they would be limited in what they could portray, one of the reasons many of us opposed the idea of "retro-Trek", in the first place. You should always---always!---leave your backstory . . . . well, "back". Leave it alone and merely refer to it, in my opinion.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

Hell, yes. The first thing I'm doing is driving a Brinks truck up to Ira Behr's, Ron Moore's, and Jane Espenson's homes

Can I back it up over Ron's legs a few times? He doesn't need those to live or write

Ira and Jane though, wow what a series they could do.

I'll put in a vote for a Jake Sisko miniseries, but not a series. The "Jake" eps of DS9 always looked horrible in the "next week" preview, and always turned out to be the gems

 

[Yee-Ming]

Hell, yes. The first thing I'm doing is driving a Brinks truck up to Ira Behr's, Ron Moore's, and Jane Espenson's homes

Don't forget Dorothy Fontana. Some great stories in TOS. And this has been mentioned before in other threads, but how about Peter David, creator/writer of the Excalibur series of books? He certainly had a different take on the Trek universe.

 

[Mikel_Cooperman]

Voyager did have allot of potential but they ruined it 2-3 episodes in.
They took all the tension away by making the Macquis and Starfleet good buddies and hitting the reset button at the end of every episode.Did we ever really believe that Voyager was in danger out in the middle of nowhwere?
Did we ever really get to know the crew like say, the crew of TNG? Was there any kind of crew camraderie?

Thats where the problems started with Trek. Lazy writing and poor character development and the damage continues with Enterprise.

It's no wonder Robert Beltran was B______G about the scripts all the time.
He Was Right!

Nobody more than me, a diehard Trekker, wants to see a great show thats exciting with characters that I invest time in like on Farscape and B5 but we arent getting it.

I hardly think the press is jumping on the bandwagon. They probably have seen a few episodes. Case closed!


I like your choice of writers Jason but you forgot Peter David in the mix.

 

[Rob Gardiner]

Rex wrote:

You should always---always!---leave your backstory . . . . well, "back".

If only George Lucas had heeded this advice!

 

[Jack Briggs]

Now, Rob, no mentioning the other religion.

 

[Glenn Overholt]

Yes, a truly horrible thought! With hindsight, maybe someone should have made 1 prequel and then worked on 7-9!

Glenn

 

[Mikel_Cooperman]

If only George Lucas had heeded this advice!

I couldnt agree more.

 

[Robert_M_Clark]

I've been reading the production reports on startrek.com and the three episodes they have previewed so far for season 3 look good. I'll give the show the benefit of the doubt for one more season, but that's it.

 

[Mikel_Cooperman]

...and for one more season after that and so on and so on.

Thats what B&B are hoping for.

It worked for Voyager.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

The real answer here is for every single Trek fan to buy as many shares of Viacom/Paramount as possible. We achieve majority, call a stockholder's meeting and fire B&B

 

[Jason Seaver]

I'll put in a vote for a Jake Sisko miniseries, but not a series.

Actually, this is the idea where I think I could run two 26-episode seasons before really leaning on other writers. I'd have Jake & co. on the police beat the first year, doing all sorts of neat 24th Century CSI/Law & Order stuff - how do you even determine a crime has been committed if the body's disintegrated by a phaser, what forensic evidence does it leave behind, how do you establish a solid alibi in a world with transporters, how do the mechanics of a trial change when you may have Betazoids or other telepaths on the jury (and what if they disagree?)...

Then, I'd have the second year be an election year. Hopefully we could sign Leonard Nimoy for occasional appearances, because Spock running for Federation President would get the best Trek ratings since TNG's heyday.

 

[Glenn Overholt]

Just as I had figured. The show would end up with a dozen writers.

They'd all be begging to do the next show, by themselves. But you want them to get together. They do and decide that with all of the ideas that they have now, they'd be better off making a movie! Bye Bye!

As you cry out, "But I can pay you more!" they crack up as they all leave, plotting a sting of mega-blockbusters that will keep them filthy rich for years.

I had hoped too that one person could come up with a seven-year plan. As with authors for a book, they create a beginning, a middle and an end - usually before they start it.

I don't think that as a producer, that I would accept anybody that didn't have this already down. Not for every episode, but at least a detailed outline that they could follow and fall back onto for the next show. If the current plots are that bad, I think that B&B would be out looking for work.

If there is a plan, I don't want to know it.

GLenn

 

[Jason Seaver]

If the current plots are that bad, I think that B&B would be out looking for work.

And the fact that they aren't is one of the most puzzling things in Hollywood. Studios generally don't tolerate that kind of slide in popularity without taking some action. I tell you, they've got pictures of Sherry Lansing doing something terrible.