help a newbie not get ripped on reciever. (1 Viewer)

[EricLThomp]

this is my first HT im building into a brand new house. (it's already built), and im going to wire everything post-build. looking to spend about $800-$1000 on a reciever. i like yamaha stuff. is the one below a good one? if not, what is something better in my price range?

http://www.bestbuy.com/detail.asp?e=...1&cat=3&scat=4





specs here if you dont wanna click the link:


Extremely high power and low distortion: 120W x 6 @ 8 ohms, 1kHz, 0.04% THD

Truly comprehensive surround decoding for 6.1-channel, 5.1-channel and stereo sources: Dolby Digital EX, DTS-ES Discrete, DTS-ES Matrix, Dolby Digital 5.1, DTS 5.1, Dolby Pro Logic II and DTS Neo:6 decoders, plus Silent Cinema simulated headphone surround

Yamaha Digital Sound Field Processing provides a total of 45 surround-environment variations for extraordinary sonic realism

High dynamic power/low-impedance drive capability — handles virtually any speaker configuration from 8 ohms all the way down to 2 ohms

192kHz/24-bit D/A converters and 32-bit DSP circuitry for extreme processing accuracy

Ultrawide frequency response (10Hz - 100kHz) to deliver the full fidelity of high-resolution sources like DVD-Audio and SACD (5.1-channel inputs provided)

Auto priority input selection and auto decoder selection

6 A/V inputs (1 front, 5 rear), all with S-video and 2 (rear) with component video; 2 rear A/V outputs, both with S-video and 1 with HD-compatible component video

4 audio-only inputs; 2 audio-only outputs (including Zone 2 output for custom-installation flexibility); 5 optical (1 front) and 2 coaxial digital audio inputs, plus 2 optical digital outputs

5.1-channel analog inputs to accommodate external surround decoders like DVD-Audio and SACD

Digital AM/FM tuner with 40 station presets

Learning-capable and preset remote with control codes for TV, DVD, VCR, CDR, etc., plus subwoofer-level control

 

[EricLThomp]

bump, anybody?

 

[Bob Goodrich]

Check out the Yamaha Receiver Series thread posted on 1-18. I think you'll find the RX-v1300 is virtually the same product with pre-outs. Beware that you get it from an authorized Yamaha dealer for warranty purposes. I see it on ebay from authorized dealers for under $600. If you're at spending a thousand, last years flagship RX-V1 is currently a steal at that price and some dealers are closing them out. I love to shop for major purchases in Jan & Feb; it's a buyers market. Good luck.

 

[TimForman]

I'm apprehensive about manufacturers that rate THD at 1Khz rather than through the standard 20-20Khz range. It makes me wonder if they're hiding something.

 

[altan]

I had (have) a Yamaha HTR-5250... rated 100 watts per channel. Had really good sound.

I blew one of my front speakers with it when playing StarWars Episode II (at reasonable volume, in my opinion). As other threads on this site will show, I doubt it's 100 watts per channel WITH ALL CHANNELS DRIVEN.

The above doesn't mean anything about the Receiver your are looking into, just my experience.

... Altan

 

[David MW]

Consumer Reports rated a lower level Yamaha fairly high in their latest test. I considered this receiver also. It has the inputs and features that you would want. As far as the power issue, the 1khz test is allowed under FTC rules and is how Sound and Vision magazine tests receivers. For surround mode, that test has to be all channels driven. I think that it will be have plenty of power at low distortion levels. I haven't seen any other independent tests of the receiver other than Consumer Reports test of cheaper receivers.
I think it will be a fine choice. I personally like the Yamaha interface (although I don't own one).

 

[EricLThomp]

i was thinking of pushing a 5.1 set of those nucleus micro speakers from roundsound.com i like the look and they supposedly are really good. im just going to basically listen to all styles of music, watch dvds play mp3s from my PC and play xbox on this setup. do you think the yamaha RX-V1 is good for that configuration?

 

[Bob Goodrich]

Check Yamaha's website for features and specs on the RX-V1. I think you'll find it lacks DDPLII and Neo:6 which may or may not be important to you. Their proprietary 44 bit processor can do just about anything you could want and you're getting a receiver with real power down to 2 ohms. The remote has taken some flack, i.e. cumbersome to use, etc. but you're getting a lot of bang for the buck. Lots of people shelled out $2k for this a year ago and have no regrets. These receivers don't last long on ebay. Also in the $1k range is NAD's T762 which should be available now. Something you might want to look into that has all the latest processing along with a kick-butt amp section. I don't know how much it weighs, but the Yamaha tops 61 lbs, something that is an issue for some.

 

[DonJ]

Also you might want to look at the Harman Kardon 525,7200 again you'll get the latest processing along with a kick but amp section. But don't get me wrong the Yammi is nice just a bit to bright for me.

 

[Adam.Gonsman]

If you're considering the RX-V1, you may also want to look at the RX-V3300. They have been going for about the same price on ebay from authorized dealers and they do have DPLII and Neo:6. They have almost the same amp section as the RX-V1 also. The 3300 is this years model and seems like it's almost a repackage of last years flagship with a rework of features to keep the price down but also to add the new sound formats. The only thing I've noticed is it isn't the most tweakable receiver in the world, but is sufficient for all but the pickieist installations. But it really does sound awesome. Gobs of power. Will handle 2ohm loads on the mains and all 6 major channels are rated full frequency at 130watts@8ohms and 0.02%thd.

You won't go wrong with either receiver though.

As for brightnes, it's not near as bright as a lot of the older Yamahas. Their whole line has gotten much more natural as of late.

 

[DonJ]

As for brightness, it's not near as bright as a lot of the older Yamahas. Their whole line has gotten much more natural as of late.

Thanks for the info Adam because I was unaware of this, I'll have go out and do some critical listening

 

[Adam.Gonsman]

Don,
I'm not saying they're the most natural around. I've only ever demoed yammy's on one kind of kind speaker. But they're definately a lot better than they used to be. A couple years ago I demoed a Yammy vs a Denon when I was looking to replace my POS Sony (which I never actually did till now) and the yammy was definately too bright. And I have slightly dark speakers (Mirage OM series)!. But when I went in to Tweeter this past weekend and they fired up the RX-V3300 on a pair of OM-9's, my jaw just absolutely dropped. Great improvement! In fact it was so awesome the salesman couldn't pry my fingers off the demo unit until he assured me they had one in stock.

But a lot depends on speakers too. I guess this is an especially important note to Eric since his choices aren't limited by any current upgrade path. I whole heartedly believe getting the right sound is all about finding the right match of equipment rather than favoring any single brand for a particular component in the system. I see it all the time when I'm hanging around at Tweeter (I really need to find a girlfriend to occupy more of my spare time ). A new customer walks in looking for a new recevier and one of the first questions is always what kind of speakers do you have.

Eric, it's so important to demo audio equipment before you buy it. What sounds good to each one of us is so subjective. I think the new Yammy's are much less bright. Don may go have a listen to them and think to himself that this Adam guy is full of crap. I'm not saying you have to buy at your local B&M (although sometimes the personal attention really is worth the extra cost), but you should use them as a resource if nothing else. A lot of B&M's will even let you demo a receiver in your home. So I guess what I'm saying is, if you found something on the net you like, receiver or speakers, it's probably ok to go ahead and commit to one or the other without hearing them as long as the general concensus on them is good. But you probably don't want to commit to the other till you've had a chance to demo your new commitment in combination with the other purchase. Is that too confusing?

And be aware that for most of us, once you commit to some combo, you end up finding yourself locked in to an upgrade path to some degree. Once you shell out those HUGE bucks the first time for a complete HT system, it's unlikely, at least in my experience, you'll ever start over from scratch again. You'll fall into a cylce where you upgrade to the latest wizbang receiver one year, new mains or a new sub another year. And because of finding equipment that compliments each other, you'll kind of get stuck in a cycle. If you commit to a brand of speakers now, when you upgrade them and not the receiver, you'll be looking for new speakers that have a similar sound to them as the old ones. And then when you upgrade your receiver some other year, you'll be looking for another receiver with similar amps and whatnot so that it continues to compliment those speakers. It can be a viscious cycle to break out of. Especially when if you start talking multi-thousand dollar speakers and components.

Scared yet? It's really not that bad. Don't rush in to anything. Take your time, listen hard and have lots fun being awed by the latest and greatest from all the brands. The B&M sales guys love showing off their equipment. Just don't be suprised if you're so impressed you forget about the big discounts you can get online and buy it retail for the instant gratification. I'm weak willed. I have that problem all the time. :b

 

[Bob Goodrich]

Great post Adam. Yamaha has made lots of improvements to satisfy the music folk. Once you get to their 1000 series up, they're a whole different animal. As far as the RX-V1 and the RX-V3300 compare, you're correct about their amp sections being very similar and too much horsepower is never enough. However, Yamaha continues to reserve their proprietary IC's and processors used in DSP and DAC for their flagship, RX-V1 and now the RX-Z1. There is also a 13 pound weight difference which is most likely in the power supply, the most important part of the amp section. Just guessing but I'd really like to know because Ï'd rather have a receiver with ample power than go with a pre-pro setup. As for Eric's needs, I can't see how he'd go wrong with either receiver in the 5.1 setup he's contemplating.

 

[Adam.Gonsman]

Good call Bob. I didn't mean to imply the 3300 was an exact repackaging. I should have been more specific about the lack of Yamaha's proprietary DSP when I said a rework of features. Also it may be worth noting that is probably in large part why the V3300 isn't quite as tweakable as the V1.

 

[JimC_A]

Also, those bright Yamaha's have a dimming feature built in.

 

[Al Shing]

Here is my data point for this discussion.

I bought a Yamaha RX-V1300 from Etronics for $547 plus shipping. It arrived in mint condition. However, 9 days after I installed it, it suddenly shut itself off and wouldn't come back on. I suspect a windstorm and a brief power surge two days previous to this may have been related. I called Etronics who gave me an RMA for an exchange. It cost $45 for parcel post ground and insurance to ship it back. After nearly a month turnaround, the replacement arrived, but it appears to be a refurbished model, as the batteries for the remote were loose and the remote itself has scratches on the faceplate. The preamp-out output is DOA, but otherwise, everything else appears to be working. It is not worth sending it back for this, but I will just have this repaired locally when I go on a long vacation. Of course, Etronics is not an authorized dealer, so this will be out of pocket.

I figure even with the repair and the shipping costs for the exchange, I still come out ahead on purchasing it locally at a high end AV salon. If I had to do it over again, I would have kept the first one I had and had that repaired locally, because it was better than the replacement unit I got. I also would have gotten it back in working order in about a week, instead of having to wait a month for shipping an exchange.

I don't know what this says about the reliability of the Yamaha, but the manual does say to unplug it during an electrical storm. It was plugged into a surge protector, and nothing else died because of the storm. I also don't know what this says about Etronics. I'm pretty sure they don't intentionally sell inferior or damaged goods, because this would increase their costs. I've received defective goods from buying from brick and mortar, and high-end AV salons, too. You get the warranty, but you pay a couple of hundred bucks more for it.

 

[Adam.Gonsman]

Al,
As a happy new Yamaha customer I'm gonna kind of fall in and defend them a bit. But not too much

I think you'll find that pretty much all electronic equipment recommends you unplug it during an electrical storm.It's like that Caution Hot label on the McDonalds coffee. If they don't tell people outright, some idiot who plugs the thing right into the wall no surge protector or anything is gonna try and make it Yamaha's fault if his recevier burns his house down when it gets hit by lightning. As for your unit, you may have just had a bumb unit to start with.

Also, if it was the storm, keep in mind all surge protectors aren't created equal. If it was one of those $10 ones from Walmart, it's barely more than a powerstrip. In fact it may be a powerstrip. There is a difference between a powerstrip and a real surge protector. Also, even if it was an $80 Monster Power Center, if it doesn't clamp down in time or if there's too much juice to contain, some thing, and usually only one thing takes the brunt of the surge. Your recevier may have been the unlucky sacrifice in this case. Personally, I won't use any surge protector or power conditioner that won't take at least 1600 joules and the more the better.

As for the refurb unit, I'd blaim Etronics rather than Yamaha in this case. Sounds like they trying to fix their returns and pass them off as replacements. Someone else will probably get your first unit after it's halfways repaired.

I can't really testify to the reliability of Yamaha sound equipment. This is the first one I've owned and I've only had it for one week tomorrow. But I have a couple of their CD burners and those things won't die. I have a 4x4x16 that's outlasted 3 computers it was in and now sits in a box cause it's too painfully slow for anything. But I could put it in a machine it will will fire right up.

 

[Dave Moritz]

I would not worry about the power output of the yamaha personally. I own a Yamaha RX-V995 and has 100 watts x 5. I currently am pushing 4-15's and a two horn on the main l&r channel. A polk center channel and 2 pair of small satalite speakers for the rear channel. On Star Wars Attack Of The Clones this reciever still can move the 15's good. I have owed the reciever for aprox. 4 years and have had no problems with it. I have never had a bad exsperience with Yamaha and would recomend them to anyone who is interested in them. There are alot of good brands out there so buy what you like and enjoy!

 

[Jay W.]

Gee I was thinking about purchasing a yamaha from etronics but know i dont know. I know they are not any authorized dealer but they offer a 2 year phillips priority service plan for $30. Even if i take that I would still be saving approx. $150.

 

[JimC_A]

I bought mine from Reliable Audio Video when they first came out. I haven't had any trouble from this receiver at all. Call them and see what you can get it for these days.