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Speaker Wattage to Receiver Ration


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#1 of 24 dantana2000

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Posted May 20 2013 - 03:22 PM

I am sort've new to the Home Theater world but trying to learn, so I apologize in advance if this is a dumb question. I recently bought a Pioneer 140 watt receiver. My question is this, if there were 2 sets of speakers that were completely identical except one was 200 watts and the other has 500 watts. Since the receiver is only giving out 140 watts, would there be any difference at all between the 2 speakers? Would one have better sound or be louder?

 

I would appreciate any guidance that I could get.



#2 of 24 schan1269

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Posted May 20 2013 - 04:10 PM

Speaker wattages are essentially meaningless.

Receiver wattages are also essentially meaningless.

#3 of 24 dantana2000

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Posted May 20 2013 - 04:46 PM

I appreciate the response but that honestly tells me nothing. So, are you saying that it doesen't matter if I get 10 watt speakers or 800 watt speakers for a 140 watt receiver, it's all the same? I've done some research and I understand that theres a minimal, optimal, and peak and the measurement of watts is not  a completely accurate measurement. From what I can gather though, you cannot just get any type of speakers for any type of receiver. The receiver watts does play a role and that's what I'm trying to find out here. Any assistance would be appreciated.



#4 of 24 schan1269

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Posted May 20 2013 - 04:50 PM

Wattage plays absolutely no role on the speaker end.

 

Watts is volts into Ohm. Ohm is variable. Therefor, watts is variable.

 

What you care about is...

 

Are the speakers the same efficiency?

Are the speakers "the same" over their ohm load?

 

200 vs 500 watts is irrelevant. Period.



#5 of 24 dantana2000

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Posted May 20 2013 - 04:58 PM

I'm sorry but that's not making sense to me. I kind've understand what you are saying about the ohms, I do remember reading something about having matching between the receiver and speakers. I am really lost on the wattage here, so are you saying that if there are 2 completely identical pair of speakers, same company, same model (Just humor me on this) and one is 200 watts and the other is 800 watts, there is going to be absolutely no difference whatsoever between them as far as which ones louder or clearer?



#6 of 24 schan1269

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Posted May 20 2013 - 05:16 PM

Exactly. What speaker is this anyway?

 

If they are the same efficiency...they'll be the same loudness.



#7 of 24 dantana2000

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Posted May 20 2013 - 05:41 PM

I'm saying hypothetical. I have no clue what the "Efficiency" is. I kind've know about the ohms where the lower the ohms the more strain it puts on a receiver, so you want to get the same ohms as the receiver, other than that, I'm clueless. If I was to go to my neighborhood Best Buy, you're saying that I should not even look at how many watts? Out of curiosity, why is there such an emphasis on watts if they're really not important at all? I guess back to my original question than, what am I looking for in getting compatible speakers for my receiver? What specs should I know about my receiver to make sure that I am getting a good set of speakers and I'm not going to blow them out?



#8 of 24 gene c

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Posted May 20 2013 - 05:42 PM

The reason we say wattage rating have little use is because for 90% of us will never come close to using all the power a receiver can put out or all the power a speaker can handle. A receiver rated at 75 watts per channel driving medium effecient 8 ohm speakers will do so at ear-bleeding levels without working up a sweat in normal size rooms. Speakers with a very high power rating are usually very large tower speakers that are designed to fill a very large room. Receivers with a high power rating (like 140 wpc) is really only needed in very large rooms. lwith ow effecient speakers (86 db or less),  or with 4 ohm speakers.

 

Think of two identicle cars (1970 Mustangs), one with a 120 horsepower 6 cylinder engine and the other with a 335 horsepower V8. If you only go a steady 35 miles per hour to work and back then they will both appear to have the same engine in them and ride the same. The higher horsepower of the V8 is kind of useless. Now, if you're in a real hurry (you like your music very loud) or are driving up a steep hill (low effeciency or 4 ohm speakers) then the extra power (horse or watts) is usefull, needed really.

 

As for sound quality, if all else is equal (and in reality, it can't be) then the 200 and 800 watt speakers would sound the same at normal listening levels.

 

As Sam said earlier, ohms and spl (effeciency) are much more important.

 

Effeciency is measured by giving a speaker one watt of power and measuring the sound pressure (loudness) at one meter.

 

With a 140 watt Pioneer receiver you can pretty much buy any speaker you want. Low efficiency or 4 ohm.

 

Here's some reading material to help out a little.

 

http://www.crutchfie.../receivers.html

 

http://www.crutchfie...t_speakers.html


Edited by gene c, May 20 2013 - 05:44 PM.

"Everyday room": Panasonic 58" Plasma, Dish HD DVR, Pioneer Elite vsx-23, BDP-23 BR, dv58avi universal dvd player, Paradigm Studio 20 V1, CC-450, Dayton HSU-10 subwoofer.

"Movie/Music room": Toshiba 65" DLP, Dish HD receiver, Marantz 7005, CC-4003, BD-7006, Polk LSI25's-LSi7's-LSiC, 2 original Dayton 10" "Mighty-Mites" subwoofers. (subject to change without notice).
 
Also have  MB Quart Vera VS05 +.....too much to list. Help me.
 
 

 


#9 of 24 gene c

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Posted May 20 2013 - 05:55 PM

This is probably closer to the info you're looking for.

 

http://www.psbspeake...-Specifications


"Everyday room": Panasonic 58" Plasma, Dish HD DVR, Pioneer Elite vsx-23, BDP-23 BR, dv58avi universal dvd player, Paradigm Studio 20 V1, CC-450, Dayton HSU-10 subwoofer.

"Movie/Music room": Toshiba 65" DLP, Dish HD receiver, Marantz 7005, CC-4003, BD-7006, Polk LSI25's-LSi7's-LSiC, 2 original Dayton 10" "Mighty-Mites" subwoofers. (subject to change without notice).
 
Also have  MB Quart Vera VS05 +.....too much to list. Help me.
 
 

 


#10 of 24 dantana2000

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Posted May 21 2013 - 04:29 AM

Thank you all for the responses. One more question to bug you with if you don't mind. Right now, I have RCA HTIB speakers hooked up to the Pioneer receiver (The RCA Receiver or whatever you want to call it broke...Cheaply made..Get what you pay for I guess). The speakers work fine with it but I cannot use the subwoofer because it's passive and the pioneer only has a connection for a powered, which is fine. I have been doing a fair amount of research on the subwoofers and I'm pretty much sold on the BICs either an F12, 1020, or 1220. I think I can't go wrong with any of them. For the most part they got very, very good reviews. My question is this, If I get the BIC subwoofer then should I be limiting myself to getting BIC speakers (Same model line) or can I get other brands? I heard that you should try to get the same brand/model of speakers. I'm not sure if that includes the subwoofer or matching for the front and center and the rear, etc.



#11 of 24 schan1269

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Posted May 21 2013 - 05:37 AM

Your 5.0(7.0) portion does not have to match the sub..but yes, they should be the same brand/series.



#12 of 24 dantana2000

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Posted May 21 2013 - 05:49 AM

Are you saying that if I get a BIC subwoofer then I should also get BIC speakers all around?



#13 of 24 schan1269

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Posted May 21 2013 - 06:04 AM

Your 5.0 does not have to match the sub.

In more plain to understand English...

Your 5.0 should match each other.

So, again...match your 5.0...Cause the 5.0 needs to match, cause for proper sound, your 5.0 needs to match.

#14 of 24 dantana2000

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Posted May 21 2013 - 06:21 AM

Sorry, I'm really not familiar with the acronyms and technical terms, could you keep it simple, please? When you say "5.0" are you talking about my speakers? and not the sub? I know that when they say 5.1, they're referring to 5 speakers and 1 subwoofer, so you're saying that if I get the BIC subwoofer, I could get for example Polk speakers just as long as I get 5 of them e.g. front, center, and rear and they are the same model?



#15 of 24 dantana2000

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Posted May 21 2013 - 08:35 AM

Nevermind, got the answer. The subwoofer does not have to match, that's just with the speakers. Thanks for the feedback.



#16 of 24 gene c

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Posted May 21 2013 - 02:15 PM

My brother has the V-1220. Very good performer but kind of dark grey in color and just looks like a big 'ol box sitting in his livingroom. I'd opt for the F-12 if at all possible over the 1020 too. You can't buy too much subwoofer.

 

And those RCA speakers might even be 3 ohm. 3 ohm speakers might even make a 140 wpc nervous nervous.

 

In future posts pertaining to your receiver it might help if you give the model number as well so we can look at the owners manual if needed. Proper setup and calibration of the speakers and subwoofer is essential in getting the most out of your equipment. Thanks


"Everyday room": Panasonic 58" Plasma, Dish HD DVR, Pioneer Elite vsx-23, BDP-23 BR, dv58avi universal dvd player, Paradigm Studio 20 V1, CC-450, Dayton HSU-10 subwoofer.

"Movie/Music room": Toshiba 65" DLP, Dish HD receiver, Marantz 7005, CC-4003, BD-7006, Polk LSI25's-LSi7's-LSiC, 2 original Dayton 10" "Mighty-Mites" subwoofers. (subject to change without notice).
 
Also have  MB Quart Vera VS05 +.....too much to list. Help me.
 
 

 


#17 of 24 dantana2000

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Posted May 22 2013 - 05:31 AM

Hi Gene,

 

The F12s are actually the ones that I'm leaning towards. The subwoofer is like 10 to 15 years old from what I can tell but still gets outstanding reviews. Not that the others were bad on the BICs but seems everyone prefers the F12. I know my RCA speakers are cheap.

 

Let's say for the sake of argument that my Pioneer receiver is 4 ohms then I should be getting a speaker that is 4 ohms are higher, correct? I hate to go back to the wattage thing but I've been doing some more research and totally get what you're saying about the wattage not meaning much but then by the same toiken I'm finding numerous threads of people saying not to get speakers that have less wattage then your receiver, which is 140. First off, I've looked and it's not very easy to find speakers that are 140 watts or more unless you're wanting to fork out major bucks. Even the Polks that I was looking at, which went for around $200.00 a pair were only 100 watts. So, really hate to ask this but for my own peace of mind, just want to make sure that I have this correct because I am going out today to buy everything. If I buy speakers that are say 100 watts front, 50 center and 50 rear and they are 5 ohms, that would work fine with my 4 ohm 140 watt receiver with no danger of blowing them out, correct?



#18 of 24 Dave Upton

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Posted May 22 2013 - 06:59 AM

That's correct. What you want to be careful about is matching a lower impedance speaker than the receiver is rated for. IE a 4Ohm speaker with an 8Ohm receiver. You can get away with a 3Ohm load on a 4Ohm receiver if there's a LOT of extra power (most normal listening is sub 30Watts at most) - but you wouldn't want to crank it way up or you risk damage to the system and speakers.



#19 of 24 schan1269

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Posted May 22 2013 - 07:01 AM

Again, ignore the wattage rating on speakers, for the love of God...ignore it.

Your AVR only has 140 watts when one channel is running...not when all 5 are. When all 5 are, you are probably getting 65x5.

#20 of 24 dantana2000

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Posted May 22 2013 - 07:32 AM

Thanks again for the help. I think I'm getting it.

 

Sam, I understand about the ohms and the spl, etc. but I'm still not understanding why the wattage rating does not have pretty much any meaning according to what you're saying. I get that it's not one of the top things to be looking for but still is it not something that I should be looking at? From what I'm reading, if I'm understanding correctly, If I find a set of speakers that have the spl and ohms and everything else that will work ideally with my receiver but they have an RMS of 300 watts, though they would work, it would not provide the best sound because I would be severely underpowering them. I'm sure Watts have to play some role ,do they not?






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