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Samsung announces combo player


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266 replies to this topic

#41 of 267 OFFLINE   Dave H

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Posted April 19 2007 - 02:00 AM

I'm starting to think dual format players are the answer (or at least the best answer based on the realities of the format war). It seems each format has its own pros and cons whether it be technical, price, or support in terms of studio/manufacturer.

#42 of 267 OFFLINE   Brian D H

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Posted April 19 2007 - 02:20 AM

I agree. Assuming that the price comes down to a range where J6P owns one of these players, we may finally see a winner in this format war.

I'll explain:
I wonder...... If J6P owns this player and the movie he wants to buy comes in BOTH Blu-Ray and HD-DVD, which one will he buy? I don't want to start another debate over which format is better, I just wonder (given current marketing and advertising) which version your average person would purchase if he could play them both.

It is possible that he wouldn't even care (he'll just grab the first one he finds)- which is the only way I can see that we won't have a winner in this war.
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#43 of 267 OFFLINE   CWiz

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Posted April 19 2007 - 02:42 AM

oh god, hdmi 1.3

lets see here...
New HDTV: 2.5k
new receiver: 800
player: 800
ps3=obsolete, wasted 600
only about 4k for both formats, yippee!
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#44 of 267 OFFLINE   Chris S

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Posted April 19 2007 - 03:02 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin C Brown
No one said that any given retailer has to carry *any* HD format discs at all. Posted Image Up to each of them to decide what to carry. Maybe this is changing more now, but earlier on, most titles were not duplicated between HD DVD and Blu-ray. So a retailer would have to carry both formats anyway to offer the maximum selection of movies.

True none of them are required to carry software but most of the big box retailers, who also happen to be the ones that hold the most clout, are selling both formats. Plus the total number of titles from Warner and Paramount which are dual format releases is continuing to increase. Warner's THD should mitigate this a little bit but there is no clear indication as to how many titles already released or planned for release will be on THD.

Quote:
I wonder...... If J6P owns this player and the movie he wants to buy comes in BOTH Blu-Ray and HD-DVD, which one will he buy? I don't want to start another debate over which format is better, I just wonder (given current marketing and advertising) which version your average person would purchase if he could play them both.

And there is the confession of the average customer. Which one do I buy and why? Does it matter? Which is better? etc. Dual players will be great for those looking to watch films from exclusive studios like Fox or Universal but they don't solve the overall problems of consumer confusion and retailer shelf space.
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#45 of 267 OFFLINE   Shane Martin

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Posted April 19 2007 - 05:07 AM

Quote:
Well by then it was way too late.
Combos will only confuse.
A trend is developing that a dual format is a bad idea is being said by BR supporters. Makes you think.

#46 of 267 OFFLINE   PeterTHX

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Posted April 19 2007 - 08:29 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane Martin
A trend is developing that a dual format is a good idea is being said by HD DVD supporters. Makes you think.

Two can play that game. Posted Image

Those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it: SACD & DVD-Audio.

#47 of 267 OFFLINE   Sanjay Gupta

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Posted April 19 2007 - 08:49 AM

Personally, it seems that HD-DVD is the one that needs the 'combo DVD/HD-DVD disks', 'Total HD disks' and 'Combo players' as crutches to survive and have a fighting chance. While Blu-Ray seems confident to do fine just on it's own. The fact that it is mostly the HD-DVD supporters that keep clamouring for a 'combo player', suggests to me, that they find something lacking with just HD-DVD and are not quite confident of their choice of format. While the Blu-Ray supporters seem quite content with just Blu-Ray.

If today, all the Blu-Ray exclusive studios decided to go neutral, it would make 'combo' players redundant, but it would still not mean the end of the format war. Whereas, if today Universal goes neutral, it would not only end any perceived need for a combo player, but it would also pretty much end the format war.

Slightly off topic but still related:

Personally Warner's neutral stand is just a cover for it's true intentions, that of wanting to see HD-DVD survive and/or win. They do after all have a direct financial stake in the DVD format and thus by extention in HD-DVD. Not only is this fact borne out by their step motherly treatment of Blu-Ray, in their so called neutral releases but also, the forthcoming 'Total HD disks' seems like another attempt by Warner to show off HD-DVD in a better light and to reduce the 'storage space' advantage of Blu-Ray over HD-DVD.

While, Warner is the 'Trojan Horse' in this format war, Microsoft is the 'Brutus' of this drama and the true winner of a prolonged format war.
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#48 of 267 OFFLINE   ppltd

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Posted April 19 2007 - 11:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris S
And there is the confession of the average customer. Which one do I buy and why? Does it matter? Which is better? etc. Dual players will be great for those looking to watch films from exclusive studios like Fox or Universal but they don't solve the overall problems of consumer confusion and retailer shelf space.
That is assuming the average buyers gives a crap about either HD format. After watching this battle go on for the last year, my guess is that which format to buy is not even on the remote scope of any of these buyers. At this time, they just could care less, and I am not sure they ever will. Maybe when SD DVD players disappear from the market, and only HD and/or BD players are available.

Currently, the biggest interest from the general public, as shows with the massive sales, is low quality portable video devices, not High Def devices. They want their movies on their IPod. As a person that travel in excess of 4000 miles a week, I have seen the steady growth of these devices, as less and less travelers pull out their IPods or equivalent to watch movies on, not their portable DVD players or laptops.
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#49 of 267 OFFLINE   Kevin C Brown

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Posted April 19 2007 - 12:19 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterTHX
Those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it: SACD & DVD-Audio.

DVD-A and SACD didn't fail because of the format war. The format war certainly didn't help matters, but just look at the facts: It's obvious that J6P is a heckuva a lot more interested in low res MP3 iPod type audio quality than high res or multichannel audio. I think the real reason why both DVD-A and SACD failed is because just not enough people wanted to buy it, above and beyond the fact that there were never that many discs offered by the record companies in the first place.

Of course, I *could* also say that SACD at least, will survive as a niche, audiophile format too. Both Depeche Mode and Genesis have now (or will) offer much of their catalog in glorious, high res, multichannel SACD. Posted Image And that's just two examples.

High res video is going to be different, I think, simply because it's so much easier for J6P to "see" the benefits.

Let's also look at it another way. I have a universal player. I personally refused to buy into either SACD or DVD-A until universal players were available. So in my case, the fact that I could get one machine to play all formats (up to that time), helped the software companies sell more software. ... But only *after* universal players were introduced.

Same for video. I refuse to choose between HD DVD or BD. Give me a new "combo" player, and *then and only then* will I start buying discs.

So I still fail to see where any *additional* confusion could come into play with the introduction of more and more combo players.
If it's not worth waiting until the last minute to do, then it's not worth doing.

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#50 of 267 OFFLINE   Kevin C Brown

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Posted April 19 2007 - 12:24 PM

As far as HD DVD vs BD, I think I remember one comment that HD DVD discs are more impervious to scratches and such?

But in all likelyhood, when and if there are substantial releases on both formats, I'd personally probably just look for reviews that I trust in terms of whichever has better video and/or audio quality. In the end, the format just doesn't matter that much. What matters is the resulting audio and video quality, and to some, the extras on the discs.
If it's not worth waiting until the last minute to do, then it's not worth doing.

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#51 of 267 OFFLINE   ppltd

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Posted April 19 2007 - 01:41 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanjay Gupta
While Blu-Ray seems confident to do fine just on it's own. The fact that it is mostly the HD-DVD supporters that keep clamouring for a 'combo player', suggests to me, that they find something lacking with just HD-DVD and are not quite confident of their choice of format. While the Blu-Ray supporters seem quite content with just Blu-Ray.
Or is it that the Blu-Ray supporters are afraid of seeing the exclusivity of hardware support slipping away. The bashing of Combo players, primarily from the Blu-Ray supporters is not a sign of confidence.

I would like to see a quality combo player for many reasons that have nothing to do with the BD and HD competition. Rack space is one, and the fact I have maxed out my HDMI ports. Adding a switcher is not an option, as it makes the complexity of my Home Theater go up. For me, that is not an issue, but I am not the only one who uses it. For simplicity sake, having one less component would be a godsend. While I am not sure what the quality of the Samsung player will be, it is certainly something I will give serious thought to when it is released, assuming it has full HD and BD functionality. I will gladly retire my Sammy and Toshiba at that time.
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#52 of 267 OFFLINE   PeterTHX

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Posted April 19 2007 - 06:17 PM

Quote:
Or is it that the Blu-Ray supporters are afraid of seeing the exclusivity of hardware support slipping away. The bashing of Combo players, primarily from the Blu-Ray supporters is not a sign of confidence.

I believe it needlessly prolongs the war, confuses customers on exactly which disc to buy (from neutral studios) that JP6 eventually says "F-it" and sticks with DVD, leaving HD media to suffer the same fate as LaserDisc.

#53 of 267 ONLINE   Edwin-S

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Posted April 19 2007 - 08:15 PM

Combo players may not be such a bad idea. They may actually speed up the demise of HD DVD....not prolong it.
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#54 of 267 OFFLINE   Kevin C Brown

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Posted April 19 2007 - 08:25 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterTHX
I believe it needlessly prolongs the war, confuses customers on exactly which disc to buy (from neutral studios) that JP6 eventually says "F-it" and sticks with DVD, leaving HD media to suffer the same fate as LaserDisc.

The whole point to a combo player is that it won't matter what disc he/she buys. The player will play it no matter what.

I see more confusion involved with having an HD DVD *or* BD player, and the person buying the wrong format.
If it's not worth waiting until the last minute to do, then it's not worth doing.

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#55 of 267 OFFLINE   Rich Allen

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Posted April 19 2007 - 11:54 PM

As you said Kevin. Shane nailed it alright.

#56 of 267 OFFLINE   BrettB

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Posted April 20 2007 - 03:13 AM

Combos make sense and seem simple enough to people like us that frequent HTF and think about this crap every day but for the average person walking through Best Buy it's a 3rd kind of player that simply adds confusion.

#57 of 267 OFFLINE   Jason Seaver

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Posted April 20 2007 - 03:33 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterTHX
I believe it needlessly prolongs the war, confuses customers on exactly which disc to buy (from neutral studios)
I'm imagining people going into Best Buy and standing in front of the "Next Generation DVD" display paralyzed with indecision.

Hmm... Seems unlikely.
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#58 of 267 OFFLINE   Manus

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Posted April 20 2007 - 03:53 AM

" They may actually speed up the demise of HD DVD....not prolong it. "

Welcome to our planet Posted Image

I think I missed a step in your logic

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#59 of 267 OFFLINE   Shane Martin

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Posted April 20 2007 - 04:44 AM

As I said, the naysayers are Br folks. It's not a game as Peter suggests. Why should it be? I could have easily mentioned Betamax if we wanted to play games Posted Image

Quote:
leaving HD media to suffer the same fate as LaserDisc.
Laserdisc lasted what 20 years? That's not bad at all. The difference is optical disc media is priced within reason(unlike Laserdisc).

#60 of 267 OFFLINE   Rob_Walton

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Posted April 20 2007 - 08:10 AM

it would be a shame if highdef optical remained a sideshow like laserdisc. as to the importance of dual format players, they become increasingly irrelevant as time goes on and more and more single format players are bought. right now there are millions of ps3s on the market and there look likely to be many more millions before an affordable dual format player becomes available. though why anyone would want to pay for dual license costs in every player going forward is beyond me. having both avc and vc-1 seems bad enough as it is...


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