Under $1000 Subwoofer Review Thread (1 Viewer)

[Craig Chase]

Speaking of insurance: The review process has been slowed down thanks to an arm injury. I am on doctor's orders for no lifting heavy weights for 30 days after a pretty severe strain in a tendon in my left arm. It was swollen to much on Friday it looked like a half a golf ball in my arm.


I am hoping to get my son and a friend here to put the Rythmik into the system this week.


Personally, I am stuck with just doing cardio until late January.

 

[JackRI]

Sorry to hear this, Craig. Speaking as a veteran, just do what the doctors say and all will be well.

 

[Craig Chase]

Good advice, Jack. Of course, I was just getting into good shape, too. Raw weights - sets of ten with 200 pounds on the bench (no cheating) .. 200 pounds on my shoulders for squats. That kind of stuff. My favorite is 30 second farmer's carry with 225 pounds.


Here's the funny part - the injury was not from lifting. It was from bad form bowling - a bent arm in the back swing that caused my elbow to be seriously "distended", for lack of a better term.


Now I need my sons to stop in for a visit to lug the Rythmik into place. I will bribe them if needed.

 

[Mike Frezon]

I've been incapacitated on-and-off over the past few years. "On" right now in that I, too, can do no heavy lifting or strenuous exercise. In fact I just got cleared to start some light aerobics since the three month anniversary from my most recent surgery just passed.


Went to the gym last night for the first time in ages. It is amazing how quickly muscles deteriorate...


But my point here is to say I find BBQ and beer to be great incentives to get the son and son-in-law to visit for some "heavy lifting" projects!

 

[JackRI]

Good advice, Jack. Of course, I was just getting into good shape, too. Raw weights - sets of ten with 200 pounds on the bench (no cheating) .. 200 pounds on my shoulders for squats. That kind of stuff. My favorite is 30 second farmer's carry with 225 pounds.


Here's the funny part - the injury was not from lifting. It was from bad form bowling - a bent arm in the back swing that caused my elbow to be seriously "distended", for lack of a better term.


Now I need my sons to stop in for a visit to lug the Rythmik into place. I will bribe them if needed.

I know what you're going through. The docs just lowered my prednisone dosage (a good thing) but I'm weaker now (a bad thing). I've had to lower the weight on some of my exercises (a humiliating and discouraging thing). At least I'm still able to exercise though. Just do what you can and start slowly when you are able to exercise again.

 

[Mike Frezon]

I learned a long time to listen to my body...and it'll really tell you when to cut back and when to push things a little bit.


It's hard...especially for stuff like lifting my granddaughter,etc.


But we don't want to derail this thread from it's admirable purpose into the bunch of old geezers talking about their health issues!

 

[Craig Chase]

Good morning - I will be at the gym today, attempting a simulated half marathon on some new elliptical machines we have there. They are calibrated to mimic running, and at my weight, every 151 calories is one mile of "running". Basically, rounding it off, I need to hit 2000 calories for a half marathon.


This has nothing to do with subwoofers, but I didn't want anyone to think I am an invalid (well, at least physically ... mental is another topic).


My sons will be over this weekend, and I promise we will get the Rythmik into place and spend the first two weeks of January beating it to death.

 

[RedSpyder]

Be carefull with the squats. Yah, they're good for your quads/glutes but I don't think squatting heavy weights is particularly good for your knee joints.


Back onto subs...Craig, how do you feel these subs you are testing compare with some of the popular diy subs in the $500+/- like the 15-18" Ultimax sealed units per Dayton's specs? I'm of course making the assumption you've likely heard these out of the many, many subs you've auditioned.

 

[Craig Chase]

Red Spyder - I have heard both the 15 and 18 inch "HO" drivers that Dayton makes, and they sound remarkably similar to our Eminence driver from the Chase Home Theater days (Power Sound Audio uses the 18 inch driver today).


I have not heard the newer Ultimax driver, but would like to. In 2012, when the 18 was first being brought in, I considered making it our standard driver, and was talking to PE about us having exclusive rights to it, but with the lack of enthusiasm for this business from my brother, the idea was shelved.


With Dayton's new DSP based subwoofer amps, they have the ability to compete in the state of the art for subwoofers. Dual 18's, sealed, with their new DSP amp could be done by them "turn key" for under $2000.


OH .... and the half marathon time was 1 hour, 42 minutes, 19 seconds. Calories burned were 2009. The last 20 minutes were pure torture, so I will do it again tomorrow.

 

[Craig Chase]

Gents (and any ladies crazy enough to care), the Rythmik is FINALLY in the system, with the Omni Mic disc starting to break it in. First observation in appearance between it and the Hsu is the Hsu has a nicer overall finish. No seams are visible on the Hsu, and the semi gloss black finish is also, for lack of a better term, "more expensive".


The Hsu is also less intrusive in the room.


That being said, in a corner, it's doubtful anyone is going to notice, and the Rythmik is well put together.

 

[Craig Chase]

Time for a quick update ... After running the sine wave sweeps for 48 hours, it was time to dial the Rythmik FVX-15 into the system. Tron: Legacy it the first movie up, and the Rythmik is doing a very fine job with this disc. It does seem to have a somewhat different overall sound to it than did the Hsu and SVS subs, which will be fun to explore over the winter. It's closer to the Axiom's sound quality, which is a good thing.


Both the Rythmik and the Axiom EP-350 have a more immediate percussive feel than do the Hsu and SVS subs, while the Hsu and SVS seem to engage the floor in a bit more of the "ripple" effect.


None of these differences is huge, and all four subs are a blast to have.


There will be more on this after further listening, plus new pics and a sweep will be posted, probably this weekend.

 

[Nodscene]

I'm really happy to have found this thread as I'm in the middle of my search for a sub and have been looking at HSU and Rythmik (as well as RA Gamma 15). I'm a little surprised at some of the comments in regards to your methodology as it's exactly the type of information I look for. Including both data and subjective opinion is about good as it gets for me


I signed up to this forum specifically because of what your doing and it's amazing that someone is putting in this much time and money for the benefit of the industry and people needing help deciding where to put their hard earned money. And yes, I'm fully aware that you are having a hell of a good time doing this and it's not entirely altruistic haha.


If it's possible to subscribe to this thread consider it done! I can't wait to hear what comes next.


Cheers and thank you again for all the work you are putting into this. I also hope that you heal quickly and fully.


David

 

[Craig Chase]

David - Welcome to both Home Theater Forum and this thread. Thanks for the kind words.


Yes, this is a lot of fun, and for less money than a lot of other hobbies. There is a belief in many places that all one needs to do is post a CEA-2010 chart, and that will tell you everything you need to know about a subwoofer.


The simple truth is, subwoofers do sound different. Even when one runs Audyssey XT-32, subs sound different. The Klipsch and Hsu, for example, look remarkably similar in a response curve, but the Hsu sounds better on every track. This was a bit unexpected, but everyone has heard it.


For overall sound quality, none of these subs has, for example, matched the Axiom EP800. Of course, the EP800 has a premium price, and SHOULD sound better. The EP800 hits with articulation that eludes the less expensive subs. Getting this last bit of detail in bass is not different than with other speakers - it's hard to do, takes a lot of time in development, and is expensive.


The Rythmik is going to start getting some serious listening starting tomorrow night. My youngest returns to college tomorrow (he's 5 hours away when at school), and we have been hanging out a lot in his room while he plays guitar, so there has not been much time for listening. The sine wave sweeps have been going for the last 2 days, so it should be nicely broken in by tomorrow. Tomorrow night, the latest Avengers movie (Age of Ultron) will be in the system.


I have been wanting to try out a Rythmik sub for a long time, and cannot wait to put it through its paces.


Brian Ding as been quite a pleasure in terms of interaction. He has a new subwoofer coming out that looks to be in the league of the EP800 in terms of sound quality, but with more output and for less $$$$. Look for a possible smack down between a single EP800 and this new sub in late winter.

 

[theJman]

There is a belief in many places that all one needs to do is post a CEA-2010 chart, and that will tell you everything you need to know about a subwoofer.


The simple truth is, subwoofers do sound different. Even when one runs Audyssey XT-32, subs sound different. The Klipsch and Hsu, for example, look remarkably similar in a response curve, but the Hsu sounds better on every track.

Amen to that! I can't tell you how many times I've gotten in heated exchanges on forums trying to get that point across. Turns out the bench racers in the crowd don't want to hear it though, so I've mostly given up. That's like judging a car strictly by it's 0-60 times, skidpad numbers, braking distances, etc. There's far more to the picture than numbers can portray.

 

[Craig Chase]

Jim - Your reviews are text book examples of bringing a real life experience to thousands of people who want good sound, and need some help sifting through all the material out there. There is nothing wrong with measurements, but the actual listening and comparing subwoofers takes us far past the measurements.


As one manufacturer pointed out, he could get higher "CEA-2010 numbers" in his products, but the overall sound and feel would suffer. The CEA standard, for example, at 20 Hz is only a 0.325 second tone burst. That has little to do with real world.


If one is going to look at measurements, and wants to know about sound quality, blind tests have shown again and again that a linear response curve without eq above 40 Hz (preferably rising in output above 40 Hz), a predictable response curve below 40 Hz (think a sealed sub's 12 dB per octave roll off, or a vented sub being relatively flat to 28 Hz, then rolling off gently to a tuning point of 19 Hz), and the long term output from 16 or 20 Hz out to past 80 Hz will predict a "good sounding subwoofer" and its overall performance with fairly decent accuracy.


A great example of this is the Funk Audio 18.0C ... the response curve is completely predictable, it has a long term output at the deepest frequencies that best its short term burst ability, and it's almost impossible to bottom.


Even though it does not hit the SPL level of some of the more popular - and forum hyped - 18 inch DIY drivers, it would sound better to a discerning listener because of its virtues.

 

[Nodscene]

Haha, yes....don't even start with the CEA-2010 topic I've been hit over the head with that myself a couple times during my search. All I can say though is if that's what makes those people happy then more power to them. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure that number is useful and is something to take into consideration but it can't tell the whole story. At least in my opinion.


Thanks again and I can't wait to hear what the rest of the subs will sound like.

David - Welcome to both Home Theater Forum and this thread. Thanks for the kind words.


Yes, this is a lot of fun, and for less money than a lot of other hobbies. There is a belief in many places that all one needs to do is post a CEA-2010 chart, and that will tell you everything you need to know about a subwoofer.


The simple truth is, subwoofers do sound different. Even when one runs Audyssey XT-32, subs sound different. The Klipsch and Hsu, for example, look remarkably similar in a response curve, but the Hsu sounds better on every track. This was a bit unexpected, but everyone has heard it.


For overall sound quality, none of these subs has, for example, matched the Axiom EP800. Of course, the EP800 has a premium price, and SHOULD sound better. The EP800 hits with articulation that eludes the less expensive subs. Getting this last bit of detail in bass is not different than with other speakers - it's hard to do, takes a lot of time in development, and is expensive.


The Rythmik is going to start getting some serious listening starting tomorrow night. My youngest returns to college tomorrow (he's 5 hours away when at school), and we have been hanging out a lot in his room while he plays guitar, so there has not been much time for listening. The sine wave sweeps have been going for the last 2 days, so it should be nicely broken in by tomorrow. Tomorrow night, the latest Avengers movie (Age of Ultron) will be in the system.


I have been wanting to try out a Rythmik sub for a long time, and cannot wait to put it through its paces.


Brian Ding as been quite a pleasure in terms of interaction. He has a new subwoofer coming out that looks to be in the league of the EP800 in terms of sound quality, but with more output and for less $$$$. Look for a possible smack down between a single EP800 and this new sub in late winter.

 

[Craig Chase]

The Rythmik FVX15 Breaks in and meets The Avengers: Age of Ultron


We gave the Rythmik another 72 hours of break in, and for last night's entertainment, watched the new Avenger's movie.


This is a SERIOUS subwoofer.


Even though it "only" has a 400 watt amp, and is a "budget version" of the FP15HP, Every step The Hulk takes is felt in one's chest.


Late in the movie, in the "city is being elevated into the stratosphere so he can drop it" scene, Ultron lands in a building where he is fighting "Superhero Jarvis/Vision". There is a ripple in the floor. It's one of those "I can't believe I just felt that" moments. This is with the two ports open setting, and the bass definitely extends into the "feel" portion of the low bass spectrum.


Gun shots are percussive and quick. When Ironman does a flyby, the sustained bass is impressive, and when the carriers show up next to the floating city to get the civilians out, the entire room was shaking.


It's one of those subs that never gets sloppy - and it is now reminding one more of the Hsu than it did the Axiom.


The next two weeks with the Rythmik in the system are shaping up as a lot of fun.

 

[Brendostunes]

To cool,
Rythmik has a pretty detailed site. and competitive price.

Have you seen the MINIDSP yet from the UMIK 1 web site to quote audioholics "its a must have".
up to 8 channel DSP calibration.

 

[Craig Chase]

Hi guys - Before my daughter returns to college, she asked that we watch some classic Star Wars (we have seen the new one twice in theaters), Tonight is "Phantom Menace". She was 6 the first time she saw it, and happens to have a soft spot for Jar Jar ...


Look for a report on the Pod Racer Scene later ... for now, here is the promised in room response curve ... -3 dB down point, even in the twin ports open mode, is 16 Hz ...

 

[Nodscene]

Nice curves haha.


Looking forward to hearing more. These little teasers are driving me crazy