Blu-ray Review The Muppet Christmas Carol: 20th Anniversary Blu-ray Review (1 Viewer)

[AndrewWickliffe]

Has anyone gone back to the DVD review thread and seen if the arguments are exactly the same?
http://www.hometheaterforum.com/t/224927/htf-review-the-muppet-christmas-carol-recommended-with-mixed-feelings
I kind of remember last time a lot more bile was directed (by me, primarily) at Disney for being lame and less at the other peeps.

 

[Mike_Richardson]

As for the other two deleted songs ("Room in Your Heart" and "Chairman of the Board"), they were never actually filmed, as far as I know. They're on the soundtrack album, so that's about all one could expect Disney to do with them.

In an interview in Film Score Monthly years back, Miles Goodman -- who wrote the underscore and arranged the songs -- believed Chairman of the Board was shot; Room in Your Heart wasn't. He also lamented the loss of "When Love is Gone" and mentioned Brian Henson's regret that Disney hacked it out.

 

[Malcolm R]

So you're fine going along with whatever studio executives want and don't care about the director's intentions? I remember when sites like this always advocated for the filmmaker. Guess those days are over...

With respect to home video releases, HTF has always advocated for the original theatrical presentation. That's why there has always been such spirited reaction about full-screen releases, music replacement, and filmmakers tinkering with the initial DVD releases of films (such as ET or Star Wars) without making the original theatrical versions available. Most of these have now been rectified by subsequent blu-ray releases.
The original theatrical version has been the desired version, at least as far back as I can recall on this forum. Any separate releases of extended, altered or enhanced versions have just been a bonus (welcomed by some, ignored by others).

 

[cafink]

With respect to home video releases, HTF has always advocated for the original theatrical presentation. That's why there has always been such spirited reaction about full-screen releases, music replacement, and filmmakers tinkering with the initial DVD releases of films (such as ET or Star Wars) without making the original theatrical versions available. Most of these have now been rectified by subsequent blu-ray releases.
The original theatrical version has been the desired version, at least as far back as I can recall on this forum. Any separate releases of extended, altered or enhanced versions have just been a bonus (welcomed by some, ignored by others).

The HTF mission statement doesn't say anything about original theatrical presentations. It does, however, say: "We want to advance films and TV shows to be represented as complete as possible and with their full image and soundtrack, as intended by the original creators, intact." Everything I've read about The Muppet Christmas Carol indicates that the complete version with "When Love Is Gone" is the version of the film that its director originally created and prefers. That its release was preceded by a truncated theatrical distribution is of relatively little consequence, in my opinion (though my ideal release of the film would include both versions).

 

[Stephen_J_H]

All I have to say is this:
We get it. A lot of people (myself included) are displeased with Disney's decision not to include When Love is Gone in any form on the new release, but to continue discussing it with no information or insight as to why Disney made the decision is, well, see above.

 

[cafink]

The last page of this thread alone has information that's new to me, at least, about Miles Goodman's recollections of the omitted songs.

 

[Mike_Richardson]

With respect to home video releases, HTF has always advocated for the original theatrical presentation. That's why there has always been such spirited reaction about full-screen releases, music replacement, and filmmakers tinkering with the initial DVD releases of films (such as ET or Star Wars) without making the original theatrical versions available. Most of these have now been rectified by subsequent blu-ray releases.
The original theatrical version has been the desired version, at least as far back as I can recall on this forum. Any separate releases of extended, altered or enhanced versions have just been a bonus (welcomed by some, ignored by others).

As cafink states, the HTF has, first and foremost, advocated for the filmmaker's intentions, especially when it comes to getting the most complete, and director-approved, version of a film available. For many years, that used to mean advocating for uncut versions of movies that were meddled with by studios and studio executives. Regrettably, it seems what George Lucas has done to STAR WARS has now created this prevailing internet sentiment that whatever was released theatrically is the "proper" version of any film. That's just plain baffling to me. If that were true, then what any studio does on their own to alter the intentions of a filmmaker is validated so long as it's "what originally played in theaters."
In any event, what you are describing -- an "extended, altered or enhanced version" -- doesn't apply to this film either. This song was shot, edited, completed and was a part of the film from the very beginning. It wasn't added back into the movie "on second thought" -- it wasn't a case where the director "tinkered" with the film, wanted to change it after the fact -- it was always there to begin with. So what you're saying about "spirited reaction involving music replacement, filmmakers tinkering," etc -- none of those things apply to this film and this instance. This is a case of a studio taking a completed film and hacking out part of it without any involvement of the filmmakers. It's not comparable to E.T. and STAR WARS and their "digitally enhanced, rethought" versions at all. It's more like executives cutting up THE MAGNIFICENT AMBERSONS -- and are you going to argue that the true, "genuine" version of that Welles film isn't the cut Welles himself turned in, but rather what studio executives ended up releasing? (I'm not comparing these films artistically; just saying the director had nothing to do with the edits that were made in either case).
There is no artistic validation to the theatrical version because nobody involved in the creative process, the production of the movie, had anything to do with the song being removed...and that's what the HTF mission statement is all about. That said, I understand folks who think we're beating a dead horse (and I apologize for contributing to that sentiment!). Alas, until we get the version of the film that Brian Henson himself completed and everyone who made the movie wanted to see, this discussion will only continue.

 

[Stephen_J_H]

The more important question to ask is, how "precious" is Brian Henson about The Muppet Christmas Carol? He's clearly moved on to other things that are far afield of what The Muppets are (read: more adult). I wonder if he actually cares about this release, because without hearing from him on the matter, the strongest possible advocate for a full version is not even in the room.

 

[Konstantinos]

This is released again on December 15th. Strange.

http://www.amazon.com/The-Muppet-Christmas-Carol-Blu-ray/dp/B017Z3I9VG

 

[Mike Frezon]

I just realized tonight that I do NOT have a Blu-ray version of The Muppet's Christmas Carol in my collection.

How strange (although I realize no Blu version has included the complete, unedited version).

I have the old DVD version with both Widescreen and MAR 4:3 versions. The 4:3 version (only) included the deleted When Love Is Gone.

So I went to Amazon...and neither the 2012 nor '15 versions are in stock--outside of a 3rd Party Seller who is charging $44.88!

Did this go out of print? Maybe it's available in those B&M stores that still carry media...but it sure seems odd that Amazon doesn't have any. Maybe the Disney/Amazon feud is to blame.

 

[Mike Frezon]

Out of stock at B&N.com too.

 

[Mike Frezon]

Backordered at Import CDs.

 

[Mike Frezon]

Backordered at DeepDiscount.com.

 

[Mike Frezon]

And Out of Stock at BestBuy.com. Sold out.

 

[Rodney]

There's always the digital streaming route, if you want to watch it this year.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

It's on HBO Go right now as well.

If you have Disney Movie Rewards points, the Blu-ray is available as a redemption there right now (that's how I got my copy).

I suspect that it's not actually out of print, just a surge of orders around this time of year depleted available stock.

 

[Mike Frezon]

I've got my DVD. IIRC it doesn't look so bad. But if the OAR version doesn't have the complete version, I might as well have the incomplete version in HD!

I'll get one someday.

I just found it odd that "EVERYONE'S" out of them.

 

[David Norman]

Disney (DMC and DMR) it appears though I'd never be surprised to see the lone copy on a BBY or Target shelf that doesn;t register in the systme

Your BN link (with 20% off code D4M8K3B) it's not a bad price though shipping would be extra if you aren;t a member and Disney;s aren't part of the 40% off sale -- I can't find any in store unless you want to drive to NYC, Both BN and DD free shipping is $25.

Seems to be instock now for order as well as Deep Discount

http://www.deepdiscount.com/the-muppet-christmas-carol-special-edition/786936848748

 

[Mike Frezon]

Thanks, David!

It is really weird how when I checked all those sites the disc was NOT available at any of them.

But I AM a B&N member so I ordered there using the 20% code.

 

[David Norman]

Excellent. I'm guessing Christmas movies are coming/going pretty quickly right now.

I was surprised when it pulled in stock for the 2015 release at BN since DD and ImportCD's operate from the same distribution warehouse as BN -- plus most of Walmart, Blowitoutahere, FYE and tons of others these days. If it OOS at one, it's usuall OOS/Backordered at all of them,. I;m not sure if the ALLIANCE group Media is bigger than Amazon right now, but if it's not it's certainly close.

BBY was with ALLIANCE exclusively as well as Target, but Target seems to be using someone else right now and BBY is using multiple places including Alliance, BBY seems to be getting lot of stuff that nobody else is - the Nolan 4K group is just the latest version of itmes almost acting like BBY exclusives, It;s like that have dibs of 1st deliveries esp from Warner and everybody else including Amazon is left picking up scraps and leftovers