Svs 20-39 & 16-49

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Geoff McD, Feb 3, 2002.

  1. Geoff McD

    Geoff McD Extra

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    I am so new to the SVS subs you all speak of, so forgive my ignorance. I was just enlightened of their power through this forum and a friend that spends more time here than I do.

    Anyhow, going through the posts, it seems like most people have SVS 20-39 CS (or CS+) sub(s). Looking at the SVS web page, it looks like the 16-49 is only $50 more (for just one) or $100 more (for the pair).

    So, I'm curious, given that the price isn't too much more, is there a reason why the 20-39s would be more popular. Being as new as I am to the SVS, it would just seem that the ability to go to 16hz would be awesome, and worth the $50 - $100.

    This is probably an elementary question, but I was just curious! Thanks for any and all help!
     
  2. Jon D

    Jon D Stunt Coordinator

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    It seems that most buy the 20-39 because it is a nice combination of features: deep extension with a minimal of Db loss at higher bass frequencies. It goes low enough for pretty much all soundtracks (save for the 'big 5'). On the other hand, the 16-46 goes low enough to reproduce virtually all the bass in a soundtrack (it can make an audible 15 Hz signal). The tradeoff is that it looses a few Db of sound in the higher bass frequencies. Some people don't like this fact. Other's don't need or want the ultra deep extension. It's a matter of preference. I own a 16-46 PC myself, and it's in a small room with dimensions of about 10X10. I've heard a 20-39 PC in roughly the same situation, and aside from a few selected instances of ultra deep bass, it sounded pretty much identical. Go with what fits your budget, they both sound incredible.

    P.S. The 'big 5' are:

    The Haunting DTS

    U-571 DTS

    The Phantom Menace

    Titan A.E.

    Jurassic Park III (Would've said Toy Story 2, but it only has deep bass in the first five minutes, as opposed to JPIII's constant pounding)
     
  3. Tom Vodhanel

    Tom Vodhanel Cinematographer

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    Geoff,

    The best subwoofer for you will depend on a few things,

    1)the size of the room

    2)the type of source material you want the subs to produce(are you a big pipe organ fan for instance).

    3)the type of associated equipment you are using(are you using a dobly digital receiver?)

    4)how loud do you like to enjoy those action oriented DVDs?(close to reference levels?).

    In short, the deeper the extension...the more output capability you will trade off in the more common bass range(s).

    TV
     
  4. Geoff McD

    Geoff McD Extra

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    Thanks for the replies guys. I didn't realize that the 16-49 didn't play certain frequencies as high as the 20-39. Is the difference that big?

    Tom - as far the criteria that you mentioned goes...

    1) Room size - 22 x 18

    2) Source material - 99% DVD!!! (various types of movies - I love the loud ones!)

    3) System - Denon AVR-5700 (140 x 5) DD 5.1 & DTS 5.1. Klipsch Reference series speakers all around (RF-3, RC-3, RS-3).

    4) How loud? I like to watch movies at very high levels at times, medium levels at times, and also at low volumes at times as well - so I need a sub that can give the deep bass impact at all 3 levels!

    I love deep bass - the bass that is so low you actually feel it more than you hear it! I have an audio CD that actually goes down to 5 hz - currently I see the speakers moving wildly, but can't hear anything!

    Currently I have an old Klipsch subwoofer that I still love! I bought it in 1994, and still think it is one of Klipsch's better subs ever made (active 12" firing forward, passive 12" radiator in the back, and 150 watt amp). The sub was great when I bought it, but it was before DD was even really in the Home theater!!! today's subs do much more, and sound much better than the 150 watt 12 I currently have, as much as I like it. Anyhow, I have had it bottom out on me a few times while watching Titanic a while back - it has showed me that it just can't keep up at times!

    So, anyhow, I had been looking at Klipsch's new line of subs, and have also always loved the Velodyne 18" sub with the 1375 watt amp. However, word is the SVS subs can compete with both.

    If I paired up 2 16-49s CS+ with the 1000 watt amp (500x2), I should get the ultra low frequency and also the decible level that I would want. But how would such a combination compare with a single Velodyne 18?

    Sorry for the length of this - just love talking Home Theater! thanks for all help!
     
  5. Jon D

    Jon D Stunt Coordinator

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    Geoff,
    For a room that size, 2 16-46's would probably be the way to go, should you choose that option. One 16-46 may bottom out in a room that size with some of the bigger *boom* soundtracks, especially at reference levels. IMHO, the loss the 16-46 suffers in the higher frequencies is miniscule. It is measureable (SVS's webpage has response graphs), but not audible, once again, IMHO. The 16-46 (and especially 2 of them) will pound the living crap out of you. Like I said, I ran a 15 Hz test tone and could actually hear it (but more importantly, feel it. A lot). However, the 16-46 drops off very rapidly below 15 Hz, and doesn't reproduce a noticeable 10 Hz tone (cone moves, but nothing else). Remember though that this is my setup, and your mileage may vary. I would gather that 2 16-46's would go deeper, as there is more air being moved, but I don't know for sure. As far as the Velo goes, the SVS probably won't equal it, but it should come very close (for a lot less, money wise). Oh, as far as bass you can only feel: Titan AE's ice field sequence has some rumbles that are not audible, because the only way I can tell they're present is the fact that my butt is vibrating [​IMG] .
     
  6. Greg Br

    Greg Br Second Unit

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    Good questions Geoff,
    I know in the recent Secrets of Home theater article the SVS Ultra and Velodyne subs were compared, they are basically the same price I believe around $2300, although the Velo MSRP is 2999, I have seen it less. Here is the article if you have not seen it yet
    http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...s-12-2001.html
    It sound like the two are very comparable.
     
  7. Geoff McD

    Geoff McD Extra

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    Hey, thanks for the article - thats great reading. It had all three subs I had been thinking of - SVS (although, I was thinking about the CS+, not the Ultra), the Velodyne, and the new Klipsch reference series 15" sub.

    Looks like the SVS did pretty well in competition with the Velodyne!

    So, word is the CS+ is really close to the level of the Ultra, but less cost! Uses the same amp. The review didn't say which SVS Ultra model they were using.

    So, my room at 22x18 - its pretty large especially for an apartment, and the ceilings are vaulted (peak at about 15 feet I think). So, I need a setup that can just crank in that space. Now, I need it to be able to play pretty well at low volume levels too (considering I live in apts - midnight viewing really requires that!). I'm pretty considerate of my neighbors. However, I won't buy a sub that fits the apt. If I'm going to spend money to buy a great sub, I'm not just going to get one that fits the apt, I am going to want something that will work in whatever up-coming house is in my future! I need a sub that will last a while!

    Anyhow, great article regarding the SVS & Velodyne - thanks! Anyone know what Ultra they were using? Anyone heard both an Ultra and a CS+ - I'm curious if they are truly very similar.
     
  8. Greg Br

    Greg Br Second Unit

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    carbon copy for my situation(except I am in a house), I am waiting as well for the reviews.
     
  9. SVS-Ron

    SVS-Ron Screenwriter

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    Geoff,
    The CS-Ultra is a single sub line. There is only one type/size. Check this page out and drill down for more info http://www.svsubwoofers.com/subwoofers.htm
    The CS-Plus captures MOST of the Ultra performance for much less money (and is avail in three tune/sizes). I'd put a pair of 20-39CS-Plus subs and a Samson into that same competition any day of the week. It'd be VERY close to what you read in that "Secrets" review, but at a total cost of $1,499 plus shipping? Except for some very, VERY subjective comments about the Velo on music I think the SVS pair in that test pretty much dominated.
    The fact you could save around a $1,000 (assuming a hefty discount on the Velo) and be very much in the same ball park with a Plus package should warrant some serious consideration along with any 18" Velodyne pruchase. I can't imagine anyone being unhappy with either system, I know I'd be happier with $1,000 back in my HT budget if I was trying to stetch things.
    Tom might be able to add some objective info on what he's seen test-wise on the Plus subs but given we do all our SPL testing outdoors (and excellent way to get repeatable high level distortion limited results with subs) it's been a bit rough to do over the last few weeks.
    Ron
     

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