Physical Media might not be dead, but Physical Media in Retail Stores are accelerating the death (1 Viewer)

[John*Wells]

This thread helped me decide My TV DVD Collection will end once the Last Season of House of Cards is released along with the remaining seasons of Perfect Strangers and Mayberry RFD. I will also collect Cobra Kai once it comes out // at which time I will Cancel all streaming and TV Services

Edit: Should Paramount ever decide to release a Fully restored Gomer Pyle USMC Set, I'll surely pick that up

 

[TJPC]

Wonder if the absence of older shows reruns on broadcast and many basic channels, will relegate past tv shows to a fate of becoming forgotten for the next generations.

Especially if later generations don't ever come across tcm or other oldies/classics type channels.

I retired 10 years ago after teaching high school media for a decade. A large part of the course was the history of movies. In the 10 years I taught the course, I found that most students had no knowledge of the subject at all.

They had no accidental exposure to classic films as I had. Growing up with TV being in black and white and almost every classic film being on TV some time or another we absorbed it all almost by osmosis. We had only 4 or 5 channels, but most continuously showed movies from 11:30 to when the station went off the air or all afternoon or all day on the weekends.

 

[BobO'Link]

From what I've observed, knowing about older movies truly depends on who you grew up with and hang around or talk with currently coupled with the years of your youth and what was available on TV during those years.

For many of us here, the 50s/60s were a treasure trove of classic movies on TV. In some areas that spilled over into the 70s. In those early years stations were scrambling to fill the non-network time slots (which were more numerous back then). They used old movies and shorts (Passing Parade, Stooges, Looney Tunes, Laurel and Hardy, Andy Clyde, Newsreels, and more) since they were inexpensive to purchase and easy to program. They filled the morning hours, late night (after the "late" local news) and almost all afternoon on Saturday and Sunday. If a movie didn't fill the time slot the empty time was filled with newsreels or other shorts. You saw everything - drama, westerns, war movies, comedy, action, adventure, mysteries, and more. Since there were typically only 3-4 channels in any area you had little choice so you watched what was available and had a choice of movies on weekend afternoons. Many of us kids watched everything we could any time we were allowed to stay inside.

Because there are so many channels today, kids, and adults too, tend to focus on newer material rather than older classics. In talking with people I find many think of older (generally anything made before they were born) movies as "quaint," "archaic," or "old fashioned." It doesn't help that our current, overly PC, society filters older movies through modern viewpoints and flags them as being offensive when what's on display simply echoes the attitudes of the time in which the movie was made. There's no attempt made to understand and apply the proper filters. Add to it that many of the classics are BW and that many people have a somewhat built-in bias against them, even some from my generation, and you have a situation where most will never been seen by the majority of people for one reason or another.

So... I make every effort to expose my grandkids and any friend, relative, or coworker who claims to like movies to the classics. One coworker in her late 20s came to enjoy BW movies due to my insistence she watch some select BW horror movies (she's a huge fan of horror movies). Prior to that she'd outright reject any BW movie. She's since expanded that to comedy, adventure, and action movies from the 30s - 60s and regularly asks for recommendations. Just this week I discovered that she's started watching and recording movies off TCM! Her parents are not generally movie watchers.

 

[jcroy]

I retired 10 years ago after teaching high school media for a decade. A large part of the course was the history of movies. In the 10 years I taught the course, I found that most students had no knowledge of the subject at all.

They had no accidental exposure to classic films as I had. Growing up with TV being in black and white and almost every classic film being on TV some time or another we absorbed it all almost by osmosis. We had only 4 or 5 channels, but most continuously showed movies from 11:30 to when the station went off the air or all afternoon or all day on the weekends.

A lot of these older series are available via streaming services such as Hulu, Netflix and Amazon. So one could argue that these shows may be more readily available than in the past via syndication. Personally, I have been watching most television programs this way now, and see little reason to buy anything except my absolute favorite old shows on disc anymore.

TJPC/Terry makes a very good point here.

A lot of the old stuff I came across when I was younger, was largely from catching it by chance when I was growing up. It was mostly me being bored and channel surfing on several channels. (We didn't have any cable/satellite specific channels like HBO, etc ....).

I don't remember the names of many of these old classic shows/movies I saw back in the day, but years later I did eventually figure out what they were. (Such as the case of Bonanza for me). Some of the stuff I do remember well, was stuff like Dracula, Gone With The Wind, Gilligan's Island, etc ...

Nowadays with older stuff being available from streaming/online sources, the question is whether a young person would even know about the existence of such older shows/movies, or even come across it by chance via Netflix or amazon's "algorithms".

One has to know that something exists and actually watch it. Just "mere existence" and easy access probably isn't good enough, if somebody is completely ignorant of a show/movie's existence.

 

[BobO'Link]

That's where current delivery methods fail classic product. Those algorithms suggest based on what you've seen or added to your queue and is easily tested at Amazon. Pick newer material and that's pretty much all you get suggested. The scroll of "people who watched xxx also watched these" selection is frequently more of the same - exactly the same, right down to actors and/or general plot lines and genres.

It's completely different than when I was a kid and you simply turned on the set to "channel 3" where they played a Tarzan movie, followed by a Shirley Temple movie, followed by something you've likely never seen before. And you usually stayed for that unknown movie because there was "nothing on the other channels" - all 2 of them. You watched it, even if it was something you'd never choose yourself, because you like watching movies and it was all that was on. You discovered lots of movies you actually liked but would have never chosen yourself.

That lack of exposure is partially responsible for killing physical media. All most people know is what's been released during their lifetime and they rarely have (make?) time for anything outside that limited time frame. Because they don't know about "catalog" titles they don't sell. Because they don't sell they get discontinued, or are never released because "no one buys catalog titles." Because they don't sell physical they also don't sell streaming.

The "old guard" is dying. I wonder how long it'll be before the newer generations, who have no established history with old Hollywood, decide maintaining or converting, much less releasing, those old titles isn't worth the effort?

 

[Vic Pardo]

Wow, this thread has turned from depressing into despairing. (Or is it the other way around?)

 

[Scott Merryfield]

Nowadays with older stuff being available from streaming/online sources, the question is whether a young person would even know about the existence of such older shows/movies, or even come across it by chance via Netflix or amazon's "algorithms".

One has to know that something exists and actually watch it. Just "mere existence" and easy access probably isn't good enough, if somebody is completely ignorant of a show/movie's existence.

But even with syndication today, with the hundreds of channels out there would younger people have a better chance of finding a classic show on cable/satellite versus finding it on a streaming service? I am finding a lot of shows that are going in my watch list on Hulu that I never would have found by channel surfing (and we don't have a DVR, so I would have to watch according to someone else's schedule).

 

[TravisR]

The "old guard" is dying. I wonder how long it'll be before the newer generations, who have no established history with old Hollywood, decide maintaining or converting, much less releasing, those old titles isn't worth the effort?

I bet plenty of silent movie fans said the same thing in the 1940's and 50's. As time moves on, other than the biggest titles, nearly all movies will be forgotten. In 100 years, how many movies from the 20th century do you think will still be watched? It's the same with books or art- a few survive the really long haul but most fall to the side.

But even with syndication today, with the hundreds of channels out there would younger people have a better chance of finding a classic show on cable/satellite versus finding it on a streaming service?

Yes but with so many choices, they have the ability to say "Ugh, that's so old" and watch something else. Now, I will say that if someone has the desire to watch older stuff, they certainly have more options to do that than ever before but they need the desire.

 

[jcroy]

But even with syndication today, with the hundreds of channels out there would younger people have a better chance of finding a classic show on cable/satellite versus finding it on a streaming service?

I suspect this would also be highly dependent on semi-random chance, if a young person is not looking specifically for older type stuff. Just like what I went through when I was a kid or teenager.


In the case of search algorithms whether by happenstance or by deliberate design, it would have to be presenting older stuff as options in such searches. Otherwise if such search algorithms are not presenting older stuff much at all (whether by neglect or deliberate exclusion), then such older shows/movies are largely "nonexistent".

(I'm not familiar enough with the behavior of Hulu's search algorithm to make any sensible correlations).

 

[jcroy]

Yes but with so many choices, they have the ability to say "Ugh, that's so old" and watch something else.

I felt this way for the longest time about black and white films/shows, until I saw Metroplis. (Ironically AFTER seeing some footage in the "radio gaga" video by Queen).

At the time when I first saw "radio gaga", I though the old film footage looked neat.

 

[Blimpoy06]

I'm sure I watched more television shows from the 60's than I did of what was then new in the 70's because of my age and inability to stay up and watch prime time shows. I could watch The Rat Patrol, I Love Lucy, The Wild, Wild West or Star Trek in the afternoon. I was never going to catch Harry-O or The Rookies. So collecting classic TV on DVD is something of a 10 year shift prior to when I was born because of syndication practices. Same for movies. I saw and came to love the 60's movies about WWII. The Battle Of The Bulge, Patton, Kelly's Heroes and many, many more were on most afternoons or weekends.

I started collecting TV shows on VHS and latter DVD to have shows in complete and unedited form for the first time after watching syndication cuts. I knew there were cuts because local stations would make their own edit sometimes. A local channel might cut the first 2 minutes of The Andy Griffith Show, and TBS would cut the tag scene. DVD allowed me to see the show complete for the first time. ABC would edit the James Bond films. VHS allowed me to see the whole films, in stereo! And then laser disc gave us the correct aspec ratio for home viewing.

None of that excitement of collecting physical media exists now. Complete shows and movies in 5.1 sound are available 24 hours a day on multiple online platforms.

 

[TJPC]

We had one perfect chair that had the best view for the TV and remote controls didn’t exist. If you happened to get that perfect chair you never wanted to give it up to change the channel because your seat would be gone when you got up. Consequently you ended up watching crap that someone else wanted to see because you dared not move! This certainly exposed you to alternatives!

 

[tlc38tlc38]

Physical media may be on the fence in retail stores but I'm SO thankful to Warner Archive for currently bringing us Perfect Strangers, Alice, & Step by Step.

Hoping they finish Hangin' with Mr. Cooper in the near future.

 

[BobO'Link]

I'm sure I watched more television shows from the 60's than I did of what was then new in the 70's because of my age and inability to stay up and watch prime time shows. I could watch The Rat Patrol, I Love Lucy, The Wild, Wild West or Star Trek in the afternoon. I was never going to catch Harry-O or The Rookies. So collecting classic TV on DVD is something of a 10 year shift prior to when I was born because of syndication practices. Same for movies. I saw and came to love the 60's movies about WWII. The Battle Of The Bulge, Patton, Kelly's Heroes and many, many more were on most afternoons or weekends.

I started collecting TV shows on VHS and latter DVD to have shows in complete and unedited form for the first time after watching syndication cuts. I knew there were cuts because local stations would make their own edit sometimes. A local channel might cut the first 2 minutes of The Andy Griffith Show, and TBS would cut the tag scene. DVD allowed me to see the show complete for the first time. ABC would edit the James Bond films. VHS allowed me to see the whole films, in stereo! And then laser disc gave us the correct aspec ratio for home viewing.

None of that excitement of collecting physical media exists now. Complete shows and movies in 5.1 sound are available 24 hours a day on multiple online platforms.

It may no longer exist for you but it still does for me!

I'm excited and thrilled every time I see something I never thought would be released get a release.

I'm excited every time a stalled show continues, even if it's not one I collect.

I'm excited because online streaming will not likely fully replace a good physical library in my lifetime. Streaming is too iffy. The day I say "I'll just get a subscription to xxx to watch that show" it'll go away and not reappear on streaming for years, if ever again. That's happened every time I've counted on a cable channel or, for that matter, a radio station for specific music or a public library for access to specific books. I learned early on that if I wanted access I had to provide it for myself. Any time I can add something to my library, any of them, I get excited.

 

[Blimpoy06]

It may no longer exist for you but it still does for me!

Once again I have failed to make my meaning clear. None of the conditions exist now for current shows in production. No one watching Modern Family will have to wait 20 years to see the episodes in complete network length. I'm still purchasing shows from the 60's, 70's and 80's.

 

[Tony Bensley]

Once again I have failed to make my meaning clear. None of the conditions exist now for current shows in production. No one watching Modern Family will have to wait 20 years to see the episodes in complete network length. I'm still purchasing shows from the 60's, 70's and 80's.

Well, considering standard network length for 30 minute time slots are now in the 20 - 21 minute range, but true enough.

CHEERS!

 

[bmasters9]

I'm excited every time a stalled show continues, even if it's not one I collect.

Me too! Certain shows might not be exactly my cup of tea, but I always want them to be fully accessible for those people for which such shows are their cup of tea.

 

[Jasper70]

I don’t but IF I had the money I’d love to start a company like Shout. Physical media is still a viable method of making money. I’m sure the big companies like Universal, WB, etc will not release certain shows or movies because they’re not in this to make a little money. They want to make big money. I believe a lot of shows are profitable but just not to the level of their liking.

 

[jcroy]

At the time when I first saw "radio gaga", I though the old film footage looked neat.

(For clarification).

My then-interest and fascination with Metropolis had very little to do with the "black and white"-ness of the original footage.

I was fascinated with the visual/special effects and imagery, in how it portrayed the big city. Sorta like watching a scifi film.

More generally, I did like watching the lousy forgettable scifi movies which played on weekend afternoons or after midnight when I was a kid/teenager. I don't remember the names of most of them.

 

[Vic Pardo]

(For clarification).

My then-interest and fascination with Metropolis had very little to do with the "black and white"-ness of the original footage.

I was fascinated with the visual/special effects and imagery, in how it portrayed the big city. Sorta like watching a scifi film.

More generally, I did like watching the lousy forgettable scifi movies which played on weekend afternoons or after midnight when I was a kid/teenager. I don't remember the names of most of them.

Have you ever seen THINGS TO COME (1936)? It's a pioneering sci-fi film with a screenplay by H.G. Wells! Criterion has released a beautiful Blu-ray edition of it.