Paradigm vs. Axiom vs. Rockets

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Jerry DeWitt, Mar 1, 2003.

  1. Jerry DeWitt

    Jerry DeWitt Extra

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    I have about 1K to spend on a 6.1 set-up. I have a Harmon Kardon AVR 525 with a DIY 12" Titanic MKII sub. My room size is 13' x 21' x 8' high room. This system will be used about 50% music and 50% HT. Here is what im looking at:

    1.) Axiom - M3ti fronts - VP100 center - 3 QS4's in the rear

    2.) Rockets - RS150 fronts and rears - RSC100 center front and rear

    3.) Paradigm - Titans front and rear - CC270 center front and rear

    4.) Paradigm - Mini Monitors front and rear - CC270 center front and rear

    I heard both Paradigm speakers at my local dealer and they sound nice but have not heard the Rockets or Axioms. The dealer will sell the Titans for $229 per pair or Mini Monitors for $349 per pair. The Rockets or Mini Monitors will put me a little over budget but is it worth it?

    Thanks for your thoughts.
     
  2. John Garcia

    John Garcia Executive Producer

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    The Axiom's will outperform 3 without question, and still be slightly better than 4.

    In setup #3, the Focus might be a better choice as a main, as it has the identical drivers in the 270, while the Titans have a 3/4" tweeter.

    In setup #4, the correct center for the Minis would be the CC370.

    Between the Titans and the Minis, the Minis are definitely the better choice. Since they are quoting you full MSRP price for the Paradigms, I'd go with the Axioms.

    I have not heard the Rockets.
     
  3. Luke_R

    Luke_R Agent

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    It all depends on what sounds good to your ears. Although I would say if you're going paradigm do the monitors. I would put them in this order from brightest to warmest. Axiom, monitor, rocket. I would go with axiom or rockets depending on your tastes if for no other reason, from what I've seen both companies customer service cannot be touched. All you have to do I check the axiom forum or avs forum for tales of good customer service for both products.
     
  4. Jerry DeWitt

    Jerry DeWitt Extra

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    I had Klipsch KSB1.1's for the last few years and want to try something new. If you listen to Klipsch for to long your ears will start to bleed. Although I do like the sound of Klipsch, I would like to tone it down just a little.
     
  5. Chris Quinn

    Chris Quinn Screenwriter

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    I'd look at Ascend 170s($328pr) over either Paradigm setup. In my house they've bumped the Atom/Mini-Monitors setup to the secondary system. With a package discount it would be about $925 w/shipping for 170s all the way around. Or $825 w/shipping for 170s across the front and HTM-200s across the back.

    I haven't heard the Rockets nor found much in reviews/comments outside of the 750s and the 200. Nor, have I listen to the Axioms. I have seen a number of comparisons between Ascend and Axiom.
     
  6. Tim Reed

    Tim Reed Extra

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    5 Ed Frias' DIYs (ARDIY.com -- send an email to [email protected] or see the audioreview.com site in the "learn section") would be better than all the those choices (by quite a bit)- - IMO. Total for 5 DIYs would be about $820.

    By the way - -I own the Paradigm studio 100 v2's so I have a very good idea of what the Paradigms (in fact one of the very best Paradigms)sound like. And as a point of reference, a pair of EFE DIYs (about $325 a pair to build- -and I suggest you buy the assembled crossover from Madisound) plus an Adire Rava subwoofer are significantly superior to the Paradigm 100s.

    I've also heard the Ascend system w/HSU VTF2 and it is very good but the EFE's are more open, dynamic, and more real, and also produce more detail. Frankly the EFEs sound like $1500 bookshelves.

    As a general rule, I've found the Canadian manufactures to offer the best value for speakers if you insist on buying froma brick and morter manufacture. But the interent/direct companies offer signficantly for value for the dollar in comparison. Axioms, Onix Rockets, EFE, GR Research, Ascend, and others are the best bargains today in HT/audio speakers. The worst bargains - - European manufactures (often very very good - - but very very over-priced) and the US manufacturers (and by the way - - I also own Klipsch LaScalas)- - with Bose bringing up the rear (in fact I view Bose as a ripoff outfit).
     
  7. JamieS

    JamieS Stunt Coordinator

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    I have to agree with Tim that Direct offers the best Vlue in the US. Jerry who asked the origional question was from Micgigan so I would say Tim is pot on.

    On a personal note being in Canada as great as they may sound (I've nevere heard Rockets etc. but would like to). Online speakers are not nearly the kind of value in Canada. By the time you add SHipping (very costly speakers and subs a bulk and heavy) and exchange rate most if not all savings evaporate. If you are in Canada or real colse to the boarder you may get more for your $ buying Canadian speakers. I was really excited when I found this forum and saw all the great reviews about rocket and what a value they are. When I calculated the exchange and shipping a set of RS250 Bookshelves (which am sure a great) would cost more thatn my monitor 7s, CC370 and I'd still have to buy a set of stands for them.
     
  8. Jerry DeWitt

    Jerry DeWitt Extra

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    I live about 45min. from Windsor (Canada). There is a dealer in Windsor (Future House) that sells Axiom speakers which I plan on making a trip over there to check out. Also Axiom has free shipping, so shipping will not be a problem for added cost. It looks like the Axioms are the best value, but will look into what Tim said about the "Ed Frias' DIYs". My question to Tim would be what to use for the front and rear center if I went with 4 "Ed Frias' DIYs". The Rockets look great, but are they worth the extra money?
     
  9. Aaron Lock

    Aaron Lock Extra

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    Jerry,

    While you're over here, make a trip to the Paradigm dealer(LiveWire), it's not that far from Future House. I know I paid the same amount for 4 Mini Monitors, CC370 + Sub here in Windsor as a friend paid for a Cinema 90 setup in the US.

    Aaron.
     
  10. Gerry S

    Gerry S Stunt Coordinator

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    Jerry:

    I agree that you should take the time to listen to the paradigms when you visit Canada. From everything I've read they are an outstanding value when purchased in Canada vs. the US. Some have written you can also get back some of the tax that you pay at the border.

    Be sure to post the results of your trip. Thanks.

    -Gerry
     
  11. Albert Damico

    Albert Damico Stunt Coordinator

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    If you go Axiom, go with the VP-150 center. It is fantastic. The QS4's are wonderful. I have had three different sets of rear effects, and the QS4's are hard to beat. Put value aside for a moment. The Axiom's are incredible speakers that come with a free 30 day trial. I don't believe anybody ever returned them though. Nothing against the other speaker brands. I have run through 3 sets of speakers in the last 5 years. Infinity, B&W, and Axiom. Of all these brands, I like Axiom the best, to my ear.
     
  12. Russell _T

    Russell _T Supporting Actor

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    Good Morning,
    Here is the text from a short review of my Rocket 150 speakers that I posted last year. I am still enjoying them immensely.

    Has anyone else heard the new Onix Rockets? I was one of the beta testers for them, and have my RS150's, RSS300 dipoles, and RSC100 set up in a small room for Home Theater and music. These speakers are brought to us by the same guys that carried the Diva line, and they are beautiful speakers both in looks and sound. Mine are a slender reddish Rosewood veneer with the same polished black endcaps that were so distinctive on the Divas. The 150's have a hybrid suspension tweeter custom made for them that has a fabric surround and metal dome. It's paper thin and very delicate. I've never seen a tweeter made of such fine material before, and you need to be careful about fooling around with it, as I managed to ruin one myself. For such an inexpensive speaker, the full soundfield, imaging and clear highs are nothing short of astounding to me. The center channel is large weighing in at about 26 lbs, beautifully shaped similar to the Diva C3 that everyone loves, and has the same Lycos tweeter flanked by two 5 1/4 Lycos midwoofers in a MTM setup. The center is especially articulate, and when used with the 150's on either side, present a formidable front stage. I'm using the RSS 300's for surrounds and though it is my first experience with dipoles, I am liking them more than I thought.
     
  13. Chris Quinn

    Chris Quinn Screenwriter

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  14. Ron Boster

    Ron Boster Screenwriter

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    If you go Axiom's go with the VP 150 and QS8's instead of your original choices....It will be more cash, but overall you'll be much happier (especially with the 150 vs 100). Check for their b-stock store and audiogon for used Axiom's.

    I love mine!

    Ron
     
  15. JamieS

    JamieS Stunt Coordinator

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    If you want axiom buy from a canadian dealer. M60Ti 2nds $1100 Canadian PLUS shipping.

    I was offered brand new no blemish M60Ti for $990 Canadian locally.
     
  16. Tim Reed

    Tim Reed Extra

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    Regarding how to setup the DIYs - - best advice is to email Ed Frias ([email protected] - Ed is great guy and will help you out - - its a very rare person who puts such a great design out there on the internet for everyone to use free).

    But I will offer a couple of observations - - first, the DIYs are NOT shielded. So if you want to use a DIY as a center channel and you have a direct view TV, you will probably need to keep it about 8 inches away from the TV (use phoine books or something to lift it away from the TV).

    Ed also does "crossover fixes" for BIC America speakers (in fact as I understand it he has tried to give BIC America the crossover fixes and they have refused it - -unbelievable!)- which I am told make a huge improvement in the speakers - -and and he does one for the BIC center channel that results in a very good center channel (and its shielded).

    For the rear speakers - - I would just use DIYs everywhere - - they are far more than is needed for rear channels.

    If you start sneaking up into the $1000/pair price range, then definitely get in touch with Ed - - his T-22s (about a 1000/pair) compare directly to the JM Lab Mini Utopias (a recognized great speaker - - goes for around 5000), and have been compared by several people (to be better than) the B&W nautilus line (I think the 804's).

    Wow - - didn't realize you poor people in Canada were getting shafted so-bad on exchange rates etc.

    Hope it all works out for you - - looks like all the speakers you are considering are real good (I gave those Axioms some serious consideration also).
     
  17. Dan_Whip

    Dan_Whip Agent

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    I don't know how far you are away from Ottawa, but you might want to e-mail Marc at www.audioshop.on.ca. His prices are much less than the Axiom site, even with shipping. He also carries Dahlquist speakers, which according to most people that have heard the 2, sound much better for a lower price. Keep in mind I haven't heard either brand, but if you are looking at that price range, Marc will be able to help you save a mint.
     
  18. Jose T

    Jose T Stunt Coordinator

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    Seriously consider the Axiom's. Check out the store for 2nds which come with hard to detect if any defects and still has their full warranty. Great customer service and delivery. If your budget was higher consider the M 60 and the Q- 8 surrounds. good luck
     
  19. Jerry DeWitt

    Jerry DeWitt Extra

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    I plan on visiting "Future House" in Windsor (Canada) this week. They are a dealer for Axiom, so I will put them to the test. I would really like to look at the QS8's and VP150, but they are both 6 Ohm speakers. The Harmon Kardon AVR 525 is only 8 Ohm's. Will they still work? "Future House" said I would get a better deal to buy from a dealer than to order online due to the exchange rate. They told me up to 20% cheaper, but we'll see. I will post my trip this week sometime.
     
  20. Bryan_Tams

    Bryan_Tams Agent

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    Jerry, I am currently auditioning the M60, QS8 and 150 from Axiom and powering them with a HK 525, which seems not to be a problem for the 525. The speakers seem like they can take on alot more power, but the 525 puts out enough for my HT room. Second, I ordered all mine from the Axiom outlet which is 10% off the normal price and ended up about $70 short of the deal from audioshop and they could not provide the free 30-day policy. As far as the speakers, very clean, accurate...and a bit bright. I was noticing ear fatigue during the first week or so, but recently not so much. Not sure if the speakers or my ears are breaking in. I think they make a big difference in music more than HT. Hope this helps.
     

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