1. We suffered a brief outage this morning when our host noticed that HTF needed to be moved to a different server due to a hardware failure. That work is now complete. Please post in the feedback area if you have any issues.
    Dismiss Notice

B&W vs. Axiom vs. Paradigm vs. Rocket???

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by Eric Eash, Dec 7, 2003.

  1. Eric Eash

    Eric Eash Second Unit

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2003
    Messages:
    367
    Likes Received:
    0
    i have been told by one of my wifes closest friends that i'll be getting a fat stack of cash for christmas. normally i wouldn't want to know, but now that i do i can't stop thinking about the possibilities . i need all new speakers to go with the new yamaha rx-v2400 i just bought. i've been interested in axiom speakers for a long time, and have since been convinced on at least a pair of QS8s for the surrounds. but now the dilemma is R/C/L. what to get. my room is 16' x 16' x 8' with the front speakers being 13' from listening position. right now my surround system is mainly used for 80% movies, 20 for music, but if i had a better pair of front speakers, the music portion might become higher. here are the choices i've selected.

    -Axiom M80ti x 2
    -Axiom VP150 x 1

    or

    -Paradigm Studio 40 V.3 x 2
    -Paradigm Studio CC-570 x 1

    or

    B&W 705/1NT x 2
    B&W HTM7/CNT x 1

    or

    Rocket RS750 x 2
    Rocket RSC200 x 1

    i'm open to other suggestions also, although i really am stuck on the axiom surrounds. i'd like to keep the price for the front 3 below $1800 and i kind of want to buy new unless i find a really good deal on some mint used speakers. any help in letting me know the pros and cons of any set. also, opinions are very much appreciated.

    eric
     
  2. Alan Pummill

    Alan Pummill Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 1999
    Messages:
    1,262
    Likes Received:
    1
    Eric,

    I'm looking at the exact same speakers as upgrades to my Paradigm Monitor speakers. I'll be watching this post closely. BTW, I'm going to listen to a Rocket set-up on Thursday at a fellows place found on audioenvy.com.

    Another speaker you may want to audition is the Wharedale EVO-40. I heard these and their surround counterparts last week....sweet sounding speakers!!
     
  3. Eric Eash

    Eric Eash Second Unit

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2003
    Messages:
    367
    Likes Received:
    0
    that's my problem and the reason i need as much feedback as possible. i live on an island, a very big island, but far away from the US. i live in japan, and on top of that, i live on a US military base, and there are only around 8000 people on it, which turns into about 3000 families, which roughly equals probably no axioms, b&ws, paradigms, or rockets. i've also been scoping www.audiogon.com which has a lot of higher end speakers and gear on it. i just wish i know what was good and what wasn't. that's where this thread comes in.

    eric
     
  4. Richard_B

    Richard_B Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2003
    Messages:
    137
    Likes Received:
    0
  5. Eric Eash

    Eric Eash Second Unit

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2003
    Messages:
    367
    Likes Received:
    0
    thanks richard for those links. i can remember reading a few of them in the past, the others were new to me and much appreciated. i've read great things about all speakers, but i've never heard anything said about the B&W speakers i questioned about. money plays a good sized factor in this, not as far as how much i can spend, but i like getting the most out of what i pay. one good thing about the axiom besides everyone saying they're great, is free shipping, all the way to japan. i've been quoted shipping on the rockets at a little under $200. i haven't done too much researching on the paradigms and B&Ws. i've also been looking alot on audiogon, they have some of the new speakers for sale on there, not too many of the ones i'm interested in though. if you could choose one package, which would it be and why?

    eric
     
  6. CurtisSC

    CurtisSC Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2003
    Messages:
    1,412
    Likes Received:
    0
    Eric,

    Richard has pointed you to some reading on Rocket's own forum. You should also have a look at Axiom's board. www.axiomaudio.com/boards . Also some good people and help there as well.
     
  7. Richard_B

    Richard_B Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2003
    Messages:
    137
    Likes Received:
    0
    Good Point Curtis, I would also recommend to look at the Axiom Forum. I looked mainly on the Rocket Forum because I knew there were some comparisons there to some of the speakers Eric was looking for.

    Eric,
    No problem on suppling a couple of links. If you're set on the Axiom surrounds they might be the speaker for you especially with free shipping to Japan. Speakers are a tuff choice though becasue there are so many great brands and I think all the brands you are looking at make some great products. All 4 of the brands you asked about have some very loyal followers.
     
  8. CurtisSC

    CurtisSC Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2003
    Messages:
    1,412
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  9. Vladimir

    Vladimir Agent

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2003
    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    0
    I think both Rocket and Axiom forums are very biased. It seems that members on both forums have their minds set already and they just like to bash other products often incorrectly (IMO) to justify their decisions. It would be better (again IMO) to look at independent professional reviews of all these speakers. I personally think that Paradigms are excellent speakers and their new v3s should be even better than v2s. I myself have studio 100 v2 and cc570 v3 and I am extremely satisfied with them. CC570 is absolutely amazing. So IMO Paradigms would be an excellent choice.
    I think all of these speakers are very good but they do sound quite different (especially Rockets and Paradigms) so it would be hard to evaluate them by simply reading comments by the owners. It seems that people who really like Paradigm Studio line do not like Rockets and vice versa. Rocket fans say that Paradigms sound harsh and bright in the tremble which of course is wrong. Paradigms sound extremely revealing and bad recordings could often sound bad with them. But some people don’t like that. So it simply comes down to personal preferences. I am also not sure that you could ship Paradigms so you might have no choice but to consider only between Rockets and Axioms. Both Rockets and Axioms have excellent return policy so it may be worthwhile trying them first anyway.
     
  10. Seth_L

    Seth_L Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2002
    Messages:
    1,553
    Likes Received:
    1
    Whereas Vladimir has a bias and personal preference for Paradigms. He already has his mind set and is justifying his decision. [​IMG]
     
  11. Alex Prosak

    Alex Prosak Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2001
    Messages:
    773
    Likes Received:
    1
    Paradigms and B&W's can only be sold by local dealers, unless you buy on eBay or Audiogon you're not going to be able to get them unless there is a local dealer near you. Sounds like that isn't too likely...

    Rockets and Axioms will also have very different sonic traits with the Axioms being brighter; Rockets, slightly rolled off on the top end. I don't know what characteristics you like but one thing to consider is your component synergy. Yamahas are typically on the brighter side as receivers go and may not match as well with the Axioms. That's really all personal preference though. If you are dead set on getting the Axiom surrounds, I recommend going Axiom all the way around. The Rocket RS300 surrounds will give a similar sound dispersion as the Axiom QS8's (without up and down of course) and in a Package (#2 @ $2149) will get you into the 750's and 200 center for under $1800. Either way you're getting a good speaker and a better value.



    I can't speak to the Axiom forum being very biased as I haven't spent any time there since I was researching speakers for myself. Any manufacturer specific forum will certainly have bias but I do think the Rocket forum is very open minded and rarely do I ever see any bashing going on there.
     
  12. Vladimir

    Vladimir Agent

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2003
    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    0
    "Whereas Vladimir has a bias and personal preference for Paradigms. He already has his mind set and is justifying his decision."

    Yes I do have a preference for Paradigms[​IMG]
    ...and that is why my advice was to try Rockets and Axioms first[​IMG]

    If you don't like them you can always get the Paradigms[​IMG]
     
  13. BobAlbano

    BobAlbano Second Unit

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2001
    Messages:
    293
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  14. Richard_B

    Richard_B Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2003
    Messages:
    137
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  15. Ian_J

    Ian_J Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    101
    Likes Received:
    1
    Axioms are GREAT!

    Yeah, I’m biased, so WHAT?

    Seriously, I own the Axiom M60ti, VP150 & QS8 surrounds. I’m very happy with this system. If you’re going to go the route of DVD-A and SACD I recommend purchasing all of your speakers from one manufacturer. Voice matching truly does make a world of difference.
    Another thing to consider when purchasing Axiom is the size of your listening area. My M60’s are placed 11 feet apart and 11 feet from the listening position (slightly toed in). This “triangle” placement is wonderful in the sweet spot but when I sit outside of this area (about 12 square feet) a measurable decrease in clarity and imaging is apparent. I don’t believe a casual listener could tell the difference but you’re not buying speakers for casual listening are you? If you’re going to go with the M80ti, you’ll need to sit at least 11 feet away from the speakers and possibly as far as 15 feet.
    Finally, the M60ti put out significant bass. You may want to consider adding a SVS, HSU or B&W sub instead of upgrading to the M80ti. Personally, I prefer most SACD in 2.1 channel format anyway.

    Ian
     
  16. MikeLi

    MikeLi Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    May 6, 2003
    Messages:
    945
    Likes Received:
    0
    I visit the axiom and rocket boards and usually find all folks generally very kind. Of course your going to be somewhat biased with what you have. If you did your homework correctly and tried say three different brands at least in your own setting then you would know which sound you like best. I personally found rockets to be best for me but have a friend that likes his axioms better. What ever works for you is what you should get even if it means eating a few dollars in shipping back and forth for something you dont like. Remember your going to be with these things for awhile unless your rich!
     
  17. Vladimir

    Vladimir Agent

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2003
    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    0
    "Vladimir, you get my nomination for Quote of the year...I'm still trying to get my arms around this one. Thanks for giving me something to laugh at today!"
    ---------------------------------------------------------
    I am glad I could help!

    BTW I also like to listen to my Paradigms for hours and I never get fatigued.

    So it still comes to personal preferences in sound.

    I guess when I talked about “biased” forums, I wanted to say that you almost never see a diversity of opinions in these forums. That is the impression I got from reading both Rockets and Axiom forums. If you read Rockets forum you almost never see anybody saying that they liked anything other than the Rockets and people at Axiom forum always say that Axioms are the best. So if you are trying to learn about different speakers, it is hard to do so by reading these forums. I am sure these are all very good speakers but I don’t think they are necessarily better than many other speakers as it would depend on personal preferences. But you would not learn much about other speaker brands reading Rockets and Axiom forums. Again, this is the impression I got from reading these forums, that is all. In the end, only you can decide what you like so listen before you buy.[​IMG]
     
  18. Eric Eash

    Eric Eash Second Unit

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2003
    Messages:
    367
    Likes Received:
    0
    thanks guys for the forum debate, j/k. i frequently visit both forums as well as others, and i have found a lot of helpful people on them. i am currently unable to post on the axiom forum, something about my computer not letting, axiom is working it. and i have found a lot of people who are biased to one brand of speakers, which is to be expected on a forum dedicated to a certain brand of speaker and the people who own them. hopefully, i'll be making a trip back to the states in the next couple of months, but i don't want to wait that long.
    as far as what speaker is good for my setup, i.e., what ian said about the M80ti needing a big space. well right now i currently live a 4-plex military house, with someone across the hall from me, someone under me and someone next to them. playing loud is not allowed so for the time being, any speakers i get will never be cranked. but, i'm trying to convince my wife that we need to move off base. the military would provide us with enough money to get a real nice 3-bdr, 2 bath house, with a bigger living room, or maybe turn one of the spare rooms into the theater room which would be sweet. various reasons prevent the wife from granting my wish, but regardless, in 2 years, when we move back to the states, i want to build my own house to my specs and i plan on keeping the speakers i get for a while. plus, i've always liked headroom which is mainly the reason i've built, actually waiting on a port, my own subwoofer. dual AV15s from stryke, a QSC 1450, and 20 cubic feet of terror tuned to 17Hz. the sub is partly the reason i'm looking at some bookshelves, plus those are the only speakers from those manufacturers i can afford. but at the same time, between me and the wife, we have about 700 cds which would just sound so good on full range towers, and then during movies, i could always set the front speakers to small. anyways, enough rambling. thanks everyone for the comments and keep them coming. i plan to keep everyone informed.

    eric
     
  19. Ian_J

    Ian_J Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    101
    Likes Received:
    1
    Eric,

    I'm sure you know this but the M60s are full range. Oh yeah, the M80s are 4 ohm so make sure your amp can push em.

    Ian
     
  20. Eric Eash

    Eric Eash Second Unit

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2003
    Messages:
    367
    Likes Received:
    0
    yeah, i know the M60's are full range, but they don't appeal to me as much visually as the M80s. in re-reading one of the rocket posts, it sounds like the signature version has gotten a little more top end and doesn't have the same treble issues they once had. i've talked to steve over at av123 and he said USPS can't ship anything over 70lbs to me, so if i do pick up some rockets, the drivers have to be taken out and shipped seperately. this is now an issue with any other big floorstanders i've looked at except the axioms. there are some real nice 805s on audiogon that i just wish i had the money for. the quest continues.

    eric
     

Share This Page