My Paradigm Warranty Experience (1 Viewer)

[GregClarke]

Well, I guess I’d better respond to Mr. Wiggles’ comments before this thread is locked.

You said “I am also wary of people using these forums and others as a bargaining chip against various AV companies. The "I want this and that and the other" so I will complain on the forums, and hope they move mountains for me.”

I posted this thread after I had determined the matter with Paradigm was closed. I did not threaten them or attempt extortion in any way. I merely decided to let others on this forum know about a recent purchase that had not gone perfectly. I know a lot of people drive long distances (especially to Canada) to purchase Paradigm and thought they would like to know.

You said “This all being said, I do not mean to sound overly negative in this thread”.

No comment.

You said “But I DO think it is unreasonable to expect a manufacturer rep to drive several hours just to replace a defective unit on a relatively entry-level unit.”

I expected nor requested no such thing. I not sure how you read this into anything I posted. I hope most would agree that we would all like to be treated the same regardless of how much we spend on any given product. Even “a relatively entry-level unit.”

You said “I think the original post had very little in the terms of usefulness to anybody.”

I have no idea how to respond to this. My sarcastic side wants to request clearance from you for all future posts. My analytical side wants to do a search on your posts and question everything I see little usefulness in. But my common sense side wins out and I will let it drop.

You said “Legitimate gripes about customer service should be taken up with the company, and if things are not resolved, THEN perhaps it might be informative to discuss what happened on the forums if it is not an isolated case.”

I believe it was a legitimate gripe. I took it up with the company. I didn’t feel it was resolved to my satisfaction. I then decided to post on my forum of choice to let others know of my experience. I also believe this a very isolated case. Therefore it does make it worthy of discussion here?

You said “I can't recall how many threads in the past I've seen about horrible service, only to finally get a post later on from the company or person in question that totally gives a whole other perspective to the issue.”

I never said anything about the quality of the service. I expected more from the company.

You said “Please be a little understanding when bashing companies or dealers. Things take off like wildfire on these forums, and misinformation can spread quickly, to very detrimental results.”

Sigh. Did you read my post? Did I bash anybody? Did I spread misinformation? Jump to conclusions? Speculate on anything? I talked with the head of customer support yesterday in which I was told things about Paradigm quality control that surprised me. I did not and will not post them as it was a private conversation.

To everyone else…would I buy Paradigm again? Probably. I’ve been with them for almost 20 years and loved everything about them until this one incident. Would I buy from the dealer again? Definitely, next up is probably a RX-V1400 or 2400. Am I sorry I posted this? Almost.

 

[Kevin G.]

I AM SORRY YOU FELL THIS WAY This forum is the best source for information and quality reviews that exists today.
The feedback is unmatched, sometimes I hardly feel qualified to respond to some of the things posted. I remain in the areas that I know something of,and those I would like to know more about.
I don't think anyone was admonishing you for posting your results, but you did post and as such, would expect some feedback, well you got it, in spades!!
I feel that Chris ws experssing the same sentiment that I was, about the tremendous trend to expect things from someone for some (and I don't want to minimize your plight) inconsequential problem.
If it happened to me, would I expect the things that most people do?(The YOU OWE ME syndrome) God I hope not, but quite possibly... as I see it happen every day.

 

[WayneO]

Well this is going nowhere now, but getting mileage. It's simple things like this that can cause a person reading this to develop a negative attitude towards a company without any experience themselves. Fine, you have a right to do that, but I gaurantee it's not the norm. Every company has at least one customer that wasn't dealt with properly, doesn't stop people from buying Ford or GM products. It's resolved and that's good. Maybe a stronger insistance at the dealer may have expedited things, maybe not.

 

[ChrisWiggles]

I'd only like to clarify that I did not particularly mean to singlee you out Greg, especially with regards to using the forums as a bargaining chip against a company/seller, nor as exaggerating or misleading the forums.

Those were more general gripes that I don't think pertained too much to your original post. But they have been concerns of mine for a while. You can look at the Marantz receiver power inflation issues with the 7200 from waaaay back when, and this issue STILL haunts Marantz online, and without the proper explanation of what happened, people still are under the impression that the 7200 was grossly overrated, and hence question the honesty of power rating from the brand in general.

Other small brands and smalltime sellers can live and die by the forums, and I was only attempting to point out that one should use some tact with regards to service concerns.

In my opinion, if a company grossly fails to fulfill their obligatin, a dealer rips you off, a seller scams you, etc, THESE are important and legitimate concerns that should be voiced, and that others should know about.

I think your expectations were good, but your demands were misguided, and should have been voiced to the dealer, and up the chain at the dealer, not to Paradigm, unless the dealer is giving you poor service. If THEN, Paradigm snubs you as well, and you have a legitimate complaint, then I think it is fair to voice this on the forums.

I certainly am more critical of dealers, but just as good dealers have poor salesman, or salesman who are having a bad day, it isn't exactly fair to bash them because of one poor experience. As a young person who is very deep into very high-end equipment, I compare components in my system to those costing tens of thousands if not more, and I very often get some very nasty and rude people at my regular dealers because they don't know me. Poor service? Not on the whole, since those who deal with me get to know me, and that I am not taking advantage of anybody. I've been treated poorly at nearly every dealer I've ever been to, at least once. I don't like it, but I can't blame a salesman who doesn't work with me to know me, though I certainly agree that EVERY customer should be treates as though they are about to spend 100K on a HT system.

Anyway, I think I'm rambling, but I didn't mean to come off so personally attacking as I did. Just had some things brewing that ran with the issues in this thread.

This all being said, I value customer service quite highly, and I, even with my relatively meager budget, will pay extra for service and support, and I make my expectations clear, and voice my concern when they are not met.

 

[GregClarke]

Thanks for the post Chris, I totally agree.
I think this thread has been exhausted and can now "fade into Bolivia".

Greg

 

[ericLee]

Could have been much worse, I don't think it's relly that bad experience.

 

[Steve F M]

Greg, my question is why would you buy from this dealer again? I feel that you got a double whammy on this speaker from both your dealer and Paradigm, but you seem to pass no blame at all on the dealer.

My dealer would have never even let me walk out of the store without at least a demo pair of speakers until mine were fixed. Your dealer seems not even care about you at all. I hope they at least called Paradigm for you and explained the situation. Isn't this why everyone pays the big bucks at the B&M Stores. I know its one of the reasons I do. I pay the extra bucks on equipment to get the service and security that a B&M is supposed to give you. You got neither from your store. I personally would be looking for a New Store the minute I walked out that store without a replacement or demo to use.

I agree that Paradigm could have handled this a little better, but again it seems you got a double whammy on this deal.

My advice is find another B&M!!!!!!

 

[Alan Pummill]

I had a bad experience when the tweeter in my CC-350 blew last year!!

Here is a link to more details...

http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htfo...hreadid=150423

I am now the proud owner of an all Magnepan and soon to be SVS system.

I am also getting ready to sell my PW-2200.

Paradigm has BAD CUSTOMER SERVICE, IMHO!!

 

[ernie.bin]

I can't buy the argument that people shouldn't buy paradigm because they have some bad dealers.

The argument should be to research your dealer first before buying. My own dealer offers incredible service and great pricing on paradigm and denon gear.

 

[Cary P]

As a Paradigm owner, I might as well throw in my two cents.

First of all, in this case, I agree the dealer dropped the ball. They should have exchanged the speakers right away.

But I have to side with Tony and others in saying that Paradigm is a VERY customer UNfriendly company. The main problem with Paradigm is that they try to shift ALL customer service issues to the dealer.

In my case, I've purchased Paradigm Studio 40's, Active 40's, and an Active CC in the past from authorized Paradigm dealers, and I've had some QC problems with each and every one of these speakers. Both the Studio 40's and Active 40's had tweeters issues (seems to be common with Paradigm), and the Active CC was wired out of phase.

In the case of the Studio 40's, I was able to exchange them at my local dealer. But after purchasing Paradigm speakers, what if one moves to an area that has no Paradigm dealer?

That's what happened to me with the Actives, as I didn't discover the problem right away, and had since moved from the Bay Area to Las Vegas - which did not have a local Paradigm dealer until recently. Upon contacting Paradigm regarding my problems with their then top-of-the-line Active speakers, they were always very unresponsive - referring all service issues to the original dealer where the speakers were purchased. Of course, I was quite miffed that I had just spent all of this money on these speakers and the company wouldn't even acknowledge the problem.

Needless to say, it was a huge PITA getting the problems dealt with, as I had to converse regularly and ship parts with the original dealer over long distances. And even if you have a local Paradigm dealer, they are not obligated to service the speakers if they were not purchased there.

Now, I still love my Active speakers, but shudder to think what will happen if another problem arises. When the time to upgrade comes, I will look long and hard at all competitor's products before I consider Paradigm again. Whenever possible, I've decided to stop dealing with companies who blatantly disregard their customer's servicing issues, and have recently sworn off Marantz and Panasonic due to service problems I've experienced and others have reported with their products.

Now, I still believe Paradigm makes a great bang-for-the-buck product. But after my experiences, I can really only recommend Paradigm to people who have a great local dealer, and don't plan on moving anywhere for the next 5 to 10 years. Buyer beware.

 

[Levesque]

I think it all depends on the dealer.

When I first got my Servo-15, it was not working . My dealer did came directly to my house to take the faulty one, and did exchange it for a new one in less then 2 days, with free in-house delivery.

And last month he did exchange my Studio-100 and CC-570 for Signature S8 and a C5. And he did gave me 100% credit on those Studio-100 and CC-570, after 2 years of abuse on the 100 and 3 months on the 570! And again he came in-house to take the "old" one, and deliver the new one...

I love my Paradigm dealer!

At the end, it all go down to the dealer.

 

[Tony Genovese]

Yeah, we know that. But you can't "audition" a dealer. You only know how the dealer is going to deal with a problem after the problem has arisen. And if the dealer stinks, so does Paradigm, because they tell you to go back to the dealer. Why is this concept so difficult for some to understand?

 

[Levesque]

"Why is this concept so difficult for some to understand?"


The only piece of equipment I didn't buy from my Paradigm/Anthem/Bryston dealer is a Rotel RMB-1095.

This amp suffers from the ground scheme flaw, and I now call her officially the "humming refrigerator". I'm caught in the crappy dealer-Rotel-dealer loop since 1 year.

So I think I can understand pretty well!

Rotel customer services is awful, for me. The dealer tells me to call Rotel. Rotel tells me to call the dealer. Will check with Rotel, will check with your dealer... blah blah blah since over 1 year.

Everywhere people are raving about Rotel customer services. Again, it's all down to the dealer. My Rotel dealer don't care to help me. So is it Rotel fault or the dealer? We can read everywhere about the "incredible" Rotel after sale satisfaction... But not for me. Because the dealer is in the middle, and blocking the process...

 

[Tony Genovese]

Levesque:

You have proven my point, again. Rotel (like Paradigm) sucks if you have a bad dealer. NHT does not suck if you have a bad dealer. Because when my woofer proved defective, I called NHT's toll-free number, and they Fedexed me a new woofer. NHT doesn't suck, even if the dealer sucks. Get the difference. And there are many other companies like NHT (M&K is another) that don't hide behind the dealer. They work to resolve issues, irrespective of whether the dealer is good or not. Rotel and Paradigm clearly have a different paradigm (sorry, I couldn't resist).

 

[Levesque]

I completely agree with you. There is no point to prove. I think it's a gray zone. Nothing black or white.

It's (always) the customer that is loosing in those no-win situations. That's the only important point in this.

Can I say that it's Rotel fault? I don't know. I'm stuck in a loop. Is it the dealer's fault? Grey zone. Rotel sucks in my situation BECAUSE of the bad dealer that sucks... It's a loop. So who's hidding behind who?

I'm the only one loosing in this situation...

 

[Tony Genovese]

If Rotel dealt with you directly and fixed your problem, would they still suck? My point is that by not dealing with you directly and hiding behind the dealer, they suck. The one thing Rotel and any manufacturer can control is how they, the manufacturer, treats you. If they don't want to deal with you at all, then they're treating you pretty badly.

 

[Levesque]

Can't say it better then this!

 

[EddyObregon]

Hey Cary P. I recently bought a cc370 PAradigm center and the tweeter opened up after 2 days the dealer stated that it was a factory defect. I also have a question what tweeter problems were you having and how did you identify this. How does one know if there tweeter is dmaged what does on listen for to determine this.

 

[Ralph B]

I own Ver.3 Monitor 7's

if anything happened with getting a bad driver I would just be happy to get a replacement driver.

 

[Cary P]

Eddy,

With the Studio 40 v2's, the problem with the tweeter was not noticed until I aquired the AVIA setup and calibration DVD. When calibrating the speakers using the AVIA test tones, there was a distinct crackling, distorted sound emitted by one of the tweeters when I raised the level above 65dB or so.

I had a hard time hearing any crackling or distortion while playing music or movies, but it did seem like piano tones played at high levels (70dB or higher) sometimes had an edge of distortion or crackling to them. I rarely listen to music or movies above 75dB-80dB, so it was hard to isolate the problem without using the AVIA test tones.

With the Active 40's, it was more apparent that the speaker pair had a level imbalance, which I initially attributed to my particular room acoustics. After getting the AVIA DVD, I noticed the same tweeter crackling using the test tones, but it was audible at about 40dB-45dB with the Active 40's.

I no longer have the Studio 40's. But I still own and enjoy the Active 40's - one of which has a new tweeter driver shipped to me from the original dealer, which I had to carefully install myself. The Active 40's are a very dynamic, tight, and accurate speaker, among the best I've heard at any price. Their only weakness being just a slight bit of hardness in the upper midrange/lower treble - which could be related to these tweeter problems.

The funny thing is, there is still just a faint hint of tweeter crackling with the AVIA test tones above 85dB or so on the repaired speaker - but I'm not willing to push it much above that level. Maybe there is something particular about the AVIA test tones that cause the Paradigm tweeter to resonate in a certain way? Or perhaps it is a crossover issue - who knows?

I do recall reading some other reports on this kind of tweeter behavior with the Paradigm Studio Reference series. But I never really did get to the bottom of the issue, as Paradigm refused to acknowlege or work with me in any way to definitively resolve the problem.