Is the “Middle Class” disappearing in America? (1 Viewer)

[Chu Gai]

I'd read that in Canada, there were groups that felt poverty levels were underestimated because households that didn't have computers should also be considered poor because that placed them at a disadvantage. That seemed a bit much to me.

When my kids were growing up (2 boys) among other things I constantly stressed two things: get an education whether it's college or some kind of trade that pays well and don't make me a grandfather to illegitimate children like your cousins. Now I'm stressing that they need to plan actively for their retirement and that's with them being in their 20's.

 

[Garrett Lundy]

Theres also a very dramatic difference between American-style "poor", and what the rest of the world considers poor (which usually ends in death by starvation).

Our "poor" still get free flu shots and have enough cheap food that obesity, not malnutrition, has been the #1 cause of impending doom for 15+ years now.

 

[Glenn Overholt]

Eric, I don't argue with your charts/graphs but how "real" are those? I used to rent and I swear that every time I got a raise my landlord would let me know that the rents were going up. If you can find some 'cheap' rental units in your area, get their prices now and again after the minimum wage goes up.

It's outright cruel and inhuman.

Glenn

 

[drobbins]

Check out this story @ CNN http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/10/10/Dobbs.Oct11/index.html

 

[Chu Gai]

I share Dobb's thoughts that the political parties tend to think more about themselves and not the country. How to remedy this...I don't know. Maybe vote 'em out of office regardless of your personal affiliation for a few terms, pass laws that prevent them from having the ability to have dealings with government for X number of years after they've left...something like that. Go Kinky Friedman!

 

[MarkHastings]

I was reading about the "American Middle Class" meaning and there were some interesting points. They mention Upper-Middle Class & Lower-Middle Class. This is probably why it seems like the middle class is dissapearing. If you're upper class, there's no mistaken it....if your lower class or poor, there's no mistaken it either, but the middle class is a big grey area....I think the main reason why people think the middle class is dissapearing is because of the differences in middle class individuals.

I like the definition on Wiki: One may define the middle class as consisting of all those who are neither "poor" nor "rich" - Since most people like to consider themselves (or people they know) to be either rich or poor, no one is going to think of themselves in the middle, thus it seems like there is no middle class.

I would say that most of the people in our towns are middle class citizens, but if someone makes less money than we do, we consider them 'poor' (rather than lower-middle class) and if they mnake more than we do, they are 'rich' (instead of upper-middle class). It's the old George Carlin perspective on driving...those who drive slower than you are sunday drivers and those who drive faster are assholes.

Middle class is in the middle, and as Wikipedia mentions, it's often an ignored class because it's neither rich nor poor. It's the middle child of class systems.

 

[RobertR]

I disagree that most people want to be considered either poor or rich. Most people want to be rich, of course, but there’s no “stigma” attached to being middle class (except among the silly pseudo-intellectual quasi-Marxists who think they’re clever by denouncing the “bourgeois” class). And only those who denounce “materialistic” values (often a euphemism for denouncing capitalism) want to be poor.

 

[Jeff Gatie]

 

[george kaplan]

Eric,

Those graphs are from the Heritage foundation. I'd take anything put out by that very, very, very political group with a huge grain of salt. That might be accurate data, but I'd triple check if they said 1+1=2. Certainly lots of information from them is blatantly incorrect political spin, not truth.

 

[Chu Gai]

Didn't Churchill say something about 'equal misery for all'?

 

[Eric_L]

I believe the charts reference their source, US Dept of Labor. Triple check all you wish. I've never seen Heritage use fradulent information.

 

[Eric_L]

Minimum wage by definition is inflationary. As far as your raises/rent go - well, you did mention that you used to rent... Seems as though it wasn't an insurmountable problem afterall. Congrats on owning your own home!

 

[Chris Lockwood]

Maybe I missed it, but why is nobody talking about the Dow being at record highs? Or does that not fit in with the doom & gloom scenario?

 

[mylan]

Because most people who fit into the middle class are not playing the markets, except for 401K maybe. Even if the Dow is at a high doesn't mean ALL stocks are high, I should have sold some shares of my company at 40.63 a share but I got greedy, and with a bout of bad news (not my company, just in general) I sold last week at 32 (had to, needed funds for HT!)

 

[JoeyR]

Chris, I'm not saying this to be rude but what does it matter? I dont have extra to buy individual stocks and all the 401K choices we have are losing money pretty much, so the Dow is up, how does that really affect anyone? It helps stock brokers pocket some extra doe but Ford is going to hire back everyone their laying off, no I knows pay is going up, etc....? Not being smart just asking what benefit that has to everyday people.......

 

[Buzz Foster]

Hmmm...well...

My beef with heritage stems from their social policy stances, such as gays in the military and gay marriage. Such debates are subjective, though heritage likes to pretend that there are real world data to support their ideals. Gays have been in many militaries, including the Israeli, for years, and none of those fighting forces have been undone. Nothing gets more religeous and political than gay marriage, so I doubt we should debate it here. However, "data" around the subject is hard to come by. That they have a definite political slant is absolutely certain. I would not question the numbers they use, but I question the numbers being left out. I have a friend who worked his way up in Verizon. He's doing fine. He has a modest house and car, and does not spend extravagantly. However, Verizon dumped its pension plan, which affects his long-term future. Economically, we are selling out our future to pay for the present.

 

[Ken Chan]

There is plenty of room under even a half-million for significant increases. Maybe if you have too many levels, that's the first problem.

At the management level, the real compensation should be direct reflection of how the company is doing, excluding cheats like laying a bunch of people off, and with tough laws to prevent gaming the company's stock. If the guy is guaranteed to make millions of dollars in straight salary even if the company goes in the tank, what's the incentive to do well at all? (Of course, part of the problem there is boards that offer up those kinds of contracts.)

 

[Buzz Foster]

Good point, Ken. Also symptomatic is the dwindling R & D expendatures by American companies. The focus is placed on turning a quick profit and keeping the stock up, not on innovation that could really make a change and lead to long-term profitability.

A small company in Texas is close to coming to market with a capacitor that can hold enough electric charge to power an electric vehicle for 500 miles. That's the magic bullet to revolutionize the auto industry. It is something we truly need, and could propel US automakers not only to profitability, but to a leading role in the world auto market. I have no doubt that had Ford, Chrysler, or GM (or all three together) put the resources behind it, they could have done the same thing. But when short-term profit is the only motive, you end up with a situation in which innovation cannot flourish. The leaders of those companies have golden parachutes. The ones who stand to lose are the workers who build the products.

 

[RobertR]

Small companies are typically the source of innovation. The key is not putting up artificial barriers to market entry. This is the mistake many people make when they advocate "protection" of established companies, whether from "predatory" domestic competition or "unfair" foreign competition. If the Texas company produces a successful product, and the domestic automakers are too stupid/incompetent to make use of it, let Toyota/Honda/Nissan do the job.

 

[Chu Gai]

That's going to be one hell of a capacitor! Can I get the audiophile version?