Dave's Video LA going out of business?? (1 Viewer)

[Mehdy]

:frowning: Can someone in the LA area go down there and confirm
this thing once and for all-check and see if they have BTTF 1-3 etc. Its not about the store, its about the people,the attitude,and the feeling that others's shareed you interest
with the same excitment as you.

 

[Jeff Krispow]

Ted,
Have you been to Dave's Video?

I'm not sure about Ted, but I live just down the street, and I've definitely been a customer of Dave's since he first started business many "stores" ago. I also know many other friends and acquaintance who are big home theater nuts who were long-time customers as well.
While Dave's Video was THE place to go for laserdisc media if you lived in Los Angeles (as was The Laser's Edge in Woodland Hills), they really dropped the ball when it came to DVDs. Initially they seemingly didn't want anything to do with these little "baby LDs" and believed laserdiscs would live forever, then when they finally realized which way the wind had turned, they dumped their entire laserdisc inventory (rental and sales) and switched format overs, possibly a little too late. While their stock excelled when they dealed exclusively with LDs, they never stocked DVDs with the same fervour.
While they carried the "A-list" titles, far too often they would have only 5-10 copies for sale on release date. Sometimes they didn't even order enough copies to handle all the pre-orders. Then it was a usually a long two-week or more wait before they restocked (even though most of the distribution warehouses are very local — some of them even allow certain local small stores to drive over to pick up extra stock if needed right away). Yet down the street at Tower Video, you would find 50+ copies of the same title, and usually less expensive.
Worse, for some of the smaller releases, they might only carry 1-2 copies on release date... if they bothered to stock them at all. And what little they did get it, after it had sold out on release date, they would not bother to restock (because they insisted that nobody would ever want that title again... as I was told on many occasions). There titles were almost always "special orders." Yet, again, you could go down the street and always find quite a few copies at Tower... and almost always in stock (or if sold out, usually restocked within a few days).
And if you are an anime fans? Well, just forget it — aside from some fluff like "Pokemon" they flat out refused (yes, refused) to stock 99% of anime-related releases. They rarely ordered any copies for sale on release date, and I was told it that was the "official store policy" — if I wanted any of "these things", I was told to pre-order them ahead of time and maybe I'd get it. All "real" anime was special order titles. The official word I received from Dave and his employees time and time again was that "Anime doesn't sell, no one cares, so why should I bother stocking crap like that?" R-i-g-h-t... thanks for insulted a customer who obviously likes that "crap!" After several failed attempts at pre-ordering product (it was always "It didn't come out," "It was delayed," "It was probably cancelled," "Uh, I don't know" and so forth), I just gave up — another quick trip down the street easily proved that the anime title was available as scheduled.
So again, while Dave excelled with LDs, before long, for many L.A.-based home theater enthusiasts, Dave's Video became known as the place NOT to go if you wanted to find a new release or, heaven forbid, most catalog titles. And it got worse as time went on... the past couple of years have been especially disappointing — their new-releases dwindled, and their in-stock supply was exceeding poor and becoming less all the time. Nearly everything over the past year has been a "special order," and that's just ludicrous — for the average DVD customer, there was really no point in wasting our time shopping there, because it was generally guaranteed that you'd never find what you were looking for. There was absolutely no point in pre-ordering titles, or special ordering "not in stock" titles, because you could always find it elsewhere locally quicker and cheaper (even mail ordering from back East was faster and more reliable...)
And what I'm talking about is the AVERAGE shopping day at Dave's — Studio Day is another matter entirely. You cannot judge the average, everyday business environment of the store if you've only attended Studio Day. For Studio Day, the store knows they are going to draw a fevered crowd of hundreds, so they stock up a bit for the occasion. There are industry people present, actors, directors, movies, and excitement galour (hopefully, anyway) — and sometimes a two-hour line just to get in. But once that is over, the store undergoes a "Cinderella"-like change and... *poof* ...the "magic" is gone and it's back to dreary business as usual. (And Studio Day is not without its own set of unique circumstances — which I won't get into here in detail, suffice it to say that there are many reasons why certain studios and/or reps do not make an appearance year after year. Although it was rather neat being an invited industry guest several times myself in the LD days, back when Studio Day was much better organized and the real reps attended.)
While I do wish that Dave's excelled in the DVD marketplace as well as they did in their LD days, it's really no surprise they lost much Valley business to Tower, Best Buy, Fry's, Lazer Blazer (West L.A.) or even Ken Cranes (which is about an hour's drive south) — every one of these other stores had a far superior DVD stock, and at much better prices. (On any given day, Frys in Woodland Hills has at least 50x the stock that Dave's would, at always at least 20% off if not more. Even the local Border's locations always had far more in-stock titles, and often at better prices as well...) While I enjoyed Dave's in the LD days, I'm far more loyal to a good selection at good prices than to any one store — and if Dave's still had any of that, I'd be shopping there. But I'm certainly not going to pay a higher price — sometimes a significantly higher price — at Dave's "just because it's Dave's." I'd rather take that extra $20, $50, $100 and be able to get a few more titles (or save it).
Also, please note that while I may be the one typing this out here, there are not simply my thoughts alone. Quite a few friends in my own personal group (including several industry personnel and reps) had discussions along this very same line over the past week when we heard of Dave's Video's impending doom. There were a lot of things we discussed, remembered, and suggested, and what I'm writing sums up quite a few of those feelings and discussions. And most of it in line with Ted's earlier posting — he hit it exactly.
It's easy to blame the chain stores for the "death of the mom and pop stores," especially when you have a certain loyalty to a specific store or type of store. But ultimately, the only people responsible for the store's problems are the owners (Dave and Linda). Several years of poor management, poor judgment calls, and other "things" have taken their toll. (Some of this I know personally via studio reps, others through two long-time friends who worked there for "fun" — and no, it's not something that I will discuss or divulge in a public forum. Sorry...)
Dave's could have easily competed against the chain stores by offering a wide selection of titles at good prices, they never showed any really initiative in backing this product the way they pushed LDs. In fact, their attitude towards DVDs always seemed lackadaisical and often dismissive — this is a complaint I've heard way too much from local resident friends/customers. For a supposed "DVD specialty store," customers don't like to repeatedly hear "We don't carry that" for every title query, especially on Tuesday release days. The people and attitudes are nowhere near as pleasant as they were in the "LD days," and the general feeling is disappointment and depression, not excitement. They had the perfect opportunity to grab ahold of the Valley's DVD business (just like they did with LDs), but they just pissed it completely away. Instead, they sat around on the DVD market while all the other chain stores saw the amazing opportunity in front of them and went with it. And not just the chain stores, but local "Mom & Pop" stores too — the aforementioned J&R and Kim's, but also about like Laser Exchange, Deep Discount DVD, HK Flix or any such "small" operations.
It's wasn't initially a monetary issue (well, not at first, anyway), especially for a store that thrived in the days of the $124.95 laserdisc box set — besides DVDs having a lower retail price, they also have a far better wholesale price point for retailers. (I know what the wholesale price points are for various studios, and they are an absolute bargain compared to what even the barest LD used to be.) Again, just as with LDs, they could have easily had the best selection around had they chose that path — stock "A" titles along with catalog, anime, cult classics, asian cinema, and more — but instead most items had to be specially ordered. Another MAJOR problem that ties into this is that they have almost zero "impulse buy" sales — they never really carried enough in-store stock for customers to browse through. Back in the LD days, they always made an effort to carry Japanese imports that you couldn't easily find elsewhere — but you should forget about finding any import DVDs. Lastly, they could have also easily discount their discs 20%-25% to compete with the chains — by dropping their prices, they'd might have made less profit per disc, but in the end they'd have sold far more product. Instead, nearly other local store's everyday price is cheaper (I'm not counting Best Buy's or anyone else's "price loss" Tuesday sales).
This is just standard business practices and has nothing to do with DVD's specifically (even though you really need to know and understand your market and customers). LDs, DVDs, clothes, books, toys, stereo equipment, cars, whatever — the product is inconsequential, it's what you do with it that makes or breaks your business. There were many different things they could have done — routes they could have taken, decisions they could have made — to entice the DVD consumer into their store. This is something they did so well in the LD days. But they offer none of that... going into the store for the past two years has been like stopping off at that street-corner garage sale held weekly by the same person — they always have the same old crap, nothing really new, and nobody is interested. (Or maybe this is just me — with 6,000+ LDs and 3,000+ DVDs in my collection, I have more films thatn most stores, so maybe that why I can't find anything there... No, I don't believe that excuse either...)
I know it probably sounds like I hate Dave's Video and am purposely bashing and trashing them — that is most definitely NOT the case. I've spent far more time in that store over the years, in all it's various locations and incarnations, and have spent more money on discs than I'd care to know. I really used to love to go in and hang out there — we were one big happy LD family, smug and content with our big shiny platters! And I've found it very sad indeed to see the state they are currently in (and have been for a while). I truly hope that they don't disappear forever and that they somehow manage to find a way to turn their problems around, but I don't know how likely that is at this stage. It's unfortunately, but businesses go through problems like these ALL the time, and fail for a variety of reasons — still, it's rather disheartening to see this happen to a place you've spent so much time at.
The only real chance I think they have left would to completely rethink their business and the way they handle it all. They need to drop any egos they have about running the store (and/or keeping full control over everthing themselves) and get some expert help. They likely need to find an investor/business partner with some good capital to back them up, likely someone who can act as a COO, who knows what needs to be done to properly run a business so it can properly compete in the marketplace. And it wouldn't hurt to get a really good manager to work, who knows the DVD product (and business) inside and out, what the marketplace is, the trends, etc., to work with them to get things back on track. I'm sure there are some HTF members here who could help them out of this mess, or know someone who could — it would be wonderful to see Dave's rise out of the ashes and grab ahold of the L.A. DVD business!
Well, that's about all of our thoughts on this, and my friends and I had this final thing to say: Whatever happens in the future, we'd like to salute Dave's Video for everything they've been and done over the years. For fully supporting the laserdisc format when few other retailers would. For having a place where us home theater geeks could hang out and "talk shop." For enticing us with wondrous LD product that we'd happily turn over our paychecks for (week after week after week...). For creating Studio Day to bring consumers and studio personnel together (er, notwithstanding the promotional possibilities it offered...). And for all the years of various, interesting/funny moments (often arising out of situations when certain *ahem* other customers would be present). Thank you for all those memories and movies — we wish you the best!

 

[RobertR]

Thanks for the comments and insights, Jeff. I had been wondering about Dave's ever since I saw no indication of a Studio Day this year. It's unfortunate that they weren't able to adjust to the changes brought about by DVD.

 

[Carlo_M]

Excellent post, Jeff.

Dave's could have easily competed against the chain stores by offering a wide selection of titles at good prices, they never showed any really initiative in backing this product the way they pushed LDs.

I think that is very true. That's how Ken Cranes stayed competitive. Sure they didn't do the loss-leader, but they stocked nearly every imaginable title and had a flat 30% (now 25% because of the complaints from the mass chains) discount off of everything. Sure you can get Ep2 at Best Buy for $15.99 on release, but that older title that is about 3 months old? That's $22.99! Ken Cranes (and I'm not even talking about their online presence, just the original store) was the place to go for great deals on catalog and low-profile titles, and that's where they got most of my business. Oh, and KC was always very responsive to MSRP drops. Even if the sticker price was still the old price, whenever I brought it up for a price check at their counter the new MSRP (and appropriate discount) was already reflected.

Sorry to hear about the hardships over at dave's. Ken Cranes I think has shown that there is a business model that can compete with the big boys - they are thriving even whilst a Best Buy opened up just a 1/2 mile from them! And I routinely drive the 25 miles to shop there (okay, like once a month or so, not every day!).

 

[MattHR]

Sorry to hear about the hardships over at dave's. Ken Cranes I think has shown that there is a business model that can compete with the big boys - they are thriving even whilst a Best Buy opened up just a 1/2 mile from them! And I routinely drive the 25 miles to shop there (okay, like once a month or so, not every day!).

Ken Cranes/DVD Planet IS a "big boy". They are owned by Image Entertainment, a major industry DVD supplier.


On a related note, I recently read that Image Entertainment, as a distributor, will no longer be offering product from the major studios (Warner, Fox, etc.) to their
wholesale clients. They cited non-existent profit margins on studio product and high cost of handling as the reason. Their own retail operation, DVD Planet, will continue to sell studio product to its retail customers.

 

[Carlo_M]

Yes they are owned by Image, but how many stores do they have? Their online presence is a relatively new thing, and isn't very competitive with other online retailers who will do loss-leader prices.

When I'm talking Big Boys, I'm talking Best Buy, Wal Mart, etc. The numbers aren't even close when it comes to how much they order in comparison (think stocking entire chains of Best Buys and Wal Marts vs. stocking Ken Cranes). That's all.

 

[Mehdy]

Can somebody near DAVES run this story by them-find out when they are leaving-I live in San Diego and would like to shop there one LAST time before they close.

 

[Julian Lalor]

Their online presence is a relatively new thing, and isn't very competitive with other online retailers who will do loss-leader prices.

Ken Cranes/DVD Planet has been on-line since the mid-1990s, when they were a Laserdisc e-tailer. Also, 25-30% discounts of all their DVDs seems pretty competitive to me.

 

[Jeff Adkins]

It's official. Dave's is gone. Yesterday 12/26 was their last day.

Jeff

 

[Matt Butler]

Even though Im in Sacramento I did travel south to go to a few of their signings and Studio Day with the HTF meet.
I spent a few dollars and met a few of my film idols there. They will be missed. :frowning:

 

[Craig S]

AICN's Moriarty (a former employee of Dave's) has just posted a heartfelt eulogy to this great store. It's well worth reading.
I was lucky enough to be at Dave's final Studio Day, last year during the HTF meet. Like most of the members present, I spent some money, won a giveaway, buttonholed studio reps, gawked at a celebrity (Quentin Tarantino), and generally had a great time. If I lived in L.A. I know I would have been a regular at Dave's. It's sad to see this landmark go.

 

[DaViD Boulet]

There is a local B&M DVD store in Wilmington DE near where I used to live. According to them, their whole-sale cost for the DVDs they order is often *more* than the consumer-cost on the shelf of the walmart or best buy down the street. The distributors discount their prices heavily to the chains that are able to buy in enormous bulk and charge prices that make it impossible for a small B&M to compete price-wise.

Perhaps Ken Cranes is able to compete better price-wise in their B&M locations because they are able to purchase from the distrubutors in bulk due to their much larger on-line retail business.

In any case, Digitainment (the B&M in Wilmington DE) has made it's business profitable by *renting* DVDs. Their sell-through shelf is a small rack of a few overstocked titles or some previewed discs that they can let go. It is *the* place to go to rent DVDs of almost every genre and title imaginable. Perhaps Daves could have taken this route considering the large rental market they had for laserdisc.

 

[Norm]

I was always envious that there was no Dave's like DVD store near me. Sorry to hear it closed.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

There is a local B&M DVD store in Wilmington DE near where I used to live. According to them, their whole-sale cost for the DVDs they order is often *more* than the consumer-cost on the shelf of the walmart or best buy down the street.

Well, it's close, The bottom line is that an independant store cannot survive on a 40cents a disc profit margin that BB and CC pull on average first week sales.

 

[DaViD Boulet]

But they *could* survive quite easily *renting* those titles...

 

[Daniel L]

David,

Have you ever been in the rental business?

How about when the whole paradigm is changing, destroying the rental business?

Digitainment is living on borrowed time (and money) just like any other independent rental store.

In an ironic twist of fate Digitainment used to be owned by US Laser, (One of the bigger disctributor of LD's before all of the studios lined up exlusive contracts with Pioneer & Image) who was eventually bought by Image.

Daniel L

 

[Jeff Adkins]

But they *could* survive quite easily *renting* those titles...

Well, you've obviously never been to Dave's. I've never seen a bigger selection of DVDs for rental anywhere. I rented all kinds of stuff there. They had just about every Criterion, tons of silent films, tons of foreign films, and of course all the mainstream stuff. These guys rented just about everything. It's been awhile since I've been to Laserland in Long Island, NY so I'm not sure what their rental library was like but that's probably the only store I know of that would have that much stuff for rental. QED in Chicago didn't have anywhere close to the amount of title's that Dave's had for rent.
I don't know any of any other store where you can walk in and rent Belle De Jour, That Obscure Object Of Desire and Intolerance like I did a few months ago at Dave's.
Jeff

 

[Jeff Adkins]

In an ironic twist of fate Digitainment used to be owned by US Laser, (One of the bigger disctributor of LD's before all of the studios lined up exlusive contracts with Pioneer & Image) who was eventually bought by Image.

Are we talking about the same company?? The Digitainment owned by US Laser was in Northern New Jersey, not Delaware. It closed down several years ago (1998, I believe).

Jeff

 

[Daniel L]

Oh sorry, my bad... I didn't realize there we're two Digitainments.

Daniel L

 

[Mehdy]

see the story at aintitcool.com for daves-good luck dave.