A Few Words About A few words about...™ Bram Stoker's Dracula -- in BD (1 Viewer)

[Dave Mack]

Cees, I just wanted to just clear up that my perceptions were not based on my PJ or any calibration which is what MANY suggested if you reread the thread. And actually I am comparing the BD a bit to the theatrical presentation because I also thought that the release prints were reported to be off as well and that they actually more resembled the DVD than the new BD. But there are shots like the above Harker journal one that just seem too dark now. I saw this in the theaters several times and even more recently at a revival after the VHS had come out and the above shot certainly had the words from the journal visible in the theatrical prints that I saw. My filmschool geek buddies and I always pointed that out as a neat, "retro" shot.
Now if the shot is suppossed to be so dark that the words are pretty much invisible than that is indeed a revision. (Hey, filmmakers do it ALL the time) but why shoot and print the words if they are "suppossed" to be invisible? Makes no sense whatsoever.

 

[Cees Alons]

Dave,

I see.
Unfortunately, I cannot help you either, although I saw it originally in the theater. But I don't remember that writing at all.
(So, who knows, maybe it was really invisible. )


Cees

 

[Douglas Monce]

Again Dave I have to say that these captures look nothing like the Blu-ray that I'm looking at on my system. They don't accurately represent what I'm seeing at all.

Doug

 

[Dave Mack]

Then with all due respect, maybe your system needs tweaking, Douglas, and not mine. These are captured DIRECTLY off the Blu ray RAW. This is EXACTLY how they look on the disc. This is not even in dispute. The method he is using is pretty much the definitive way to do it. You are now looking at your computer screen reading this thread, yes? Does that match up with your display? Pretty much everyone in that thread agrees with his shots and how they look. The fact that on your system the firelight scene still looks "warm, amber and saturated" where on nobody else's display and not even on the disc itself should make you wonder. I would honestly love to watch the new BD on your settup as it seems you have the only one where it looks like the old SB dvd. Seriously! I'll bring the beer! I would LOVE to see a higher res. version with the colors similar to the earlier releases and theatrical prints.




He is pretty much considered the authority there for screengrabs and he explains his procedure and nobody at that entire site disputes him or his grabs. Believe me, he does not have an agenda with this one title and is not altering anything to make a point. Why don't you take some grabs, I have and he has. So far, ours pretty much match up, even with my primitive "taking a photo of my screen" grab.

 

[Scott Calvert]

Those screencaps look exactly like what I am seeing on my system. I don't know how anyone who has seen the bluray and those screencaps can say they look nothing alike, unless they are running their system in torch mode with their colors way out of whack.

 

[RickER]

Dont forget Dave, our computer monitors may not be set up the same. Just because the image is sent right online, doesnt mean Doug or i see it how you do. Having said that, the one scene with the writing superimposed, that you can't see now, is the only one that bugs me. I can live with green fire. Its magic fire...right?

 

[Douglas Monce]

Dave,

My computer monitor is calibrated using a Gretag-Macbeth colorimeter, so I know that it is accurately reproducing neutral grey, the black levels and the white levels are all set accurately.

My HD DVD has been calibrated using the Digital Video Essentials test signals. I also used a colorimeter on the HDTV so I know that it is accurately reproducing 6,500 degrees kelvin.

My equipment has to be correctly calibrated because I make my living with it.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that the shot with the writing in it isn't much darker, it is. But on my screen I can still see the letters. They are very subtle, but they are there.

Doug

 

[Voranand]

I just watched the first 1/3 of this BD disc. All in all I think the quality is amazing. Very film-like. Has all the wonder and all the flaws of film. Film is never a perfect medium even though the one who shot it is the most talented cinematographer in the world. But I think to transfer it as closely as possible to the answer print is the only way to go.


This screencap represented what I saw on my screen. Viewing it paused for a frame anyone who don't have the disc yet will think this is too dark. But viewing it moving it looked quite right (I always told my clients in the telecine room the film is meant to be seen moving, DO NOT check it paused.). Count Dracula's castle in the middle of the night in the dark age of Europe should be dark. But my darkness and your darkness, and FFC's darkness will never be the same so yes someone will be disappointed. Yes, you can barely see the writing which raise the question then why bother put it there in the first place. But again, the mood is quite right.
And I personally think the mood of blue night and orange-color-filled fireplace room is like a cheap cinematography to me. It will look alright on B-movies but never look good on this stylish film.

Again, when you want to capture the film experience you should capture both the plus and minus of film medium. Modern telecine machine can correct everything but some Haskel Wexler's shots aren't meant to be soft?

 

[Robert Harris]

To Dave Mack...

The filmmaker's name is Coppola.

 

[Dave Mack]

corrected the typos.
And I am quite a big fan, made a special trip up to his winery to see his collection...

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[url=https://static.hometheaterforum.com/imgrepo/f/fc/htf_imgcache_17196.jpeg] [/url]

 

[RobertR]

Those statements seem rather contradictory.

 

[Dave Mack]

once again, like them or not, the BD captures are accurate to what's on the disc.
If anyone else would like to take their own captures of the BD, please do. Douglas, I honsetly would like to see what you see on the disc because Xylon's captures pretty accurately show what I and many others are indded seeing.

 

[Garrett Lundy]

Can somebody please rob Frank's house and get his personal 35mm print so we can do a quick comparison and get on with our lives?

 

[Douglas Monce]

Not contradictory at all. The Blu-ray is defiantly darker than the SuperBit DVD, but its not as dark on my display as what I'm seeing in these screen captures. I can actually see the words of the diary on my system where you can't see them at all in the screen capture.

Doug

 

[Douglas Monce]

Dave,

I don't have the ability to do screen captures from BD and honestly I think screen captures have very little value.

All I'm saying is that the words are visible, very dark, but visible on my system. I'm not seeing the words at all in these screen captures. Now it maybe because when I'm watching the blu-ray the image is moving. This illustrates a major problem with screen captures which is these images were never meant to be seen as stills.

Doug

 

[RobertR]

What I found contradictory was your use of the word "Nothing" to describe how what you see and the screen grabs resemble each other, followed by an agreement that the both look darker.

 

[Douglas Monce]

You maybe right that the word "nothing" was a bit strong. What I was trying to say is that I'm seeing detail on my system that I'm not seeing in these captures.

I was also trying to say that the blu-ray is defiantly darker than the superbit DVD. To be fair I don't have the superbit version of this movie. I can only go based on these captures as to it being brighter, which it appears to be.

Doug

 

[Jeff Cooper]

My copy of the Matrix looks green!

 

[Dave Mack]

tangent:

The Broadway strike is over!

WooHoo! We just moved back to NYC so it looks like I WILL have work!

 

[Douglas Monce]

Very cool Dave, what do you do?

Doug